I want to open a "full-contact" Shotokan Karate dojo. Need some advice.

Bonk

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Warning: this is a long post.

Hello everyone! This is my first post.

A little background on me: I am 25 years old and a 1st degree black belt in Shotokan Karate with about 8 years of experience. I also have about 5 years of Taekwondo experience, 3 years of Tang Soo Do experience, and about a year or so worth of boxing practice, in addition to being a certified personal trainer. I have been assistant-teaching Shotokan for a little over 2 years and have some experience being the head instructor for classes.

I intend to open up my own Karate dojo within the next few years or so. However, instead of teaching Shotokan the normal way, I want to teach a simplified version of it where contact fighting is the primary focus, and the techniques being taught are simple and practical. In other words, it will be Shotokan Karate techniques taught in a manner similar to boxing or kickboxing.

As many of you probably know, many Karate/Taekwondo dojos/dojangs use the "look" of the more interesting techniques to draw students in. I, however, want the appeal of my dojo to be the fighting ability and striking power that the student will gain from the training, but without the more intimidating nature of a "fighting" gym (Muay Thai, MMA, Kyokushin, etc). I think that standard Shotokan has a lot of excellent techniques and methods that are unique to it, but also has many superfluous details that I wish to leave out. Above all else, it lacks a lot of the pressure-testing I wish to include. I have even heard several Shotokan senseis tell me in-person that Shotokan practitioners, although highly athletic and skilled in speed/accuracy, "do not hit hard" and "can't take a hit," which I believe is due to the lack of contact fighting and heavy bag work.

In other words, I want to teach Shotokan in a format similar to boxing or kickboxing in which contact fighting is the end goal, while also keeping it more accessible to the casual enthusiast who wants to avoid injury. I have a few ideas that, in the realm of traditional martial arts, are somewhat unorthodox, and would appreciate any critique of my plan. As of now, this is the way I intend to do things:

The dojo itself will be standard, i.e. one room with a big space for the training to take place in. Surrounding this area will be heavy bags, weight equipment, and other standard dojo items.

Instead of being required to wear a gi, students are free to wear standard sportswear and shoes. The reason for this is threefold: 1.) I, and many others, hate wearing a gi and think it comes apart too easily, and it's easy to get distracted with constantly adjusting it mid-training. 2.) If we are to train self-defense, it makes more sense to train it while wearing shoes, because I assume most real-life altercations do not take place while bearfoot. 3.) Shoes have good traction and therefore allow for better lower body mechanics.

Although there will be belt ranks, wearing belts is not required. Both a gi and a belt CAN be worn if the student desires, but it is encouraged to wear standard fitness clothes with sporting shoes.

Japanese terminology will not be used, except for the names of kata. A kizami is a jab, a mawashi is a roundhouse, an obi is a belt, and we do sparring, not kumite. The students do not need to refer to me as sir or sensei, and they do not need to say osu. In this dojo, people are "coach," "man," "bro," "dude," or whatever casual terms one would use in their everyday life. There will be no strict rules about bowing, kneeling, or other such conventions. It's a fitness studio, not Parris Island. Of course, we will not allow swearing, age-inappropriate terms (a young student calling an old man "dude" is obviously discouraged, for example) or otherwise rude behavior, but the students is free to speak with whichever terms they would normally use in everyday life, or in any other sport for that matter.

There will, however, be a moral code within the dojo. Courtesy both in and out of the dojo will be encouraged, good focus will be emphasized (especially among younger students), and students will be repeatedly told that Karate is a tool for protection and nothing else, save for athleticism and hobbyism. I will not only remind my students to be non-violent outside of the dojo, but I will teach all of them the consequences of violence in the real world - both the moral and legal ones - as a way of telling them to stay away from such harmful activities. If I am going to teach people how to fight, I want teach them why they shouldn't fight.

The training itself will include a lot of bag work, partner drills involving full-contact yet controlled strikes to each other, and strength/conditioning exercises to ensure that students can not only hit hard but also take a hard hit without getting hurt. The focus will be on strikes with closed fists and elbows as well as low- or mid-level kicks and knees, all done from a proper guard with the hands up and the chin tucked. Slipping, rolling, and checking will all be taught. I have not decided if I want to go completely bare-knuckle, light gloves/shinguards, or full-on boxing gloves and padded shinguards. I am leaning toward the first option as I feel it simulates real fighting the most - perhaps reserving gloves/pads for younger students and letting adults go bareknuckle - but further input might be required here.

The sparring will not be the standard Shotokan sparring, i.e. touch sparring where the focus is distance control and timing. It will also not be the Kyokushin-style knockdown sparring where everything except head punches are allowed. Instead, it will be a modified version of a "body round," as it is known in some boxing circles. It will be full-contact fighting involving hand and foot techniques, but the target zone will be limited to below the neck and above the knees. The reason for this is simple: to minimize the risk of injury while also toughening people up. In order to maintain a safe environment for people of all ages, yet also keep the training realistic and having a decent level of pressure to the fighting, I want students to be able to spar with contact yet without the risk of head or knee injury, and I consider this "body round" type of sparring to be a middleground between the lighter Shotokan sparring and the heavier Kyokushin sparring. As for training students to defend against face punches, I feel that this can be done separately with partner drills and pad work.

Although fighting techniques will be the primary focus, the more traditional "basics" of Shotokan will also be taught for the purpose of teaching proper body mechanics, and of course for keeping the traditional aspects of the art intact. I want to teach people how to fight, but I also want to teach them Karate.

As for kata, one observation I have made while teaching Karate is that students typically enjoy sparring more than kata practice. I have only met a few people who prefer kata over sparring. It is for this reason that the kata training, like the rest of the training, will be kept simple. Kata will be taught in a manner far different from other dojos. Beginner students will learn the three Tekki kata. I have chosen these to be beginner kata as I feel they are the most practical and easy to teach. They contain all the basic techniques that would be used during sparring (jab, cross, hook, uppercut, elbow, knee, leg check, etc), and, in theory, their simple side-to-side footwork would be easier for beginners to understand than the more complex footwork found in the Taikyoku and Heian kata. I have actually tested this theory on people who have never done Karate in their life, and they have all found the Tekki kata much easier to get the hang of than the Taikyoku or Heian kata. Once a student has become proficient in these kata, at which point they should be around the green belt level (about 2 years of training), I will choose a single kata for them to practice based on their strengths, weaknesses, and body type. A bigger person, for example, will be assigned Jitte or Sochin. A smaller more athletic individual, as another example, might get Empi or Kanku Sho. An elderly person might get a less physically demanding kata like Hangetsu or Wankan. And so on and so forth. After becoming proficient in this kata, at which point they should be at the brown belt level, I will choose another one for them to study in order to achieve black belt. And of course, the application of each kata will be taught. The reason for this kata system is threefold. 1.) The less kata a student must practice, the easier it is for them to memorize and perfect those kata. 2.) With a rigid kata curriculum, a student might be forced to study a kata they are not comfortable with, are uninterested in, or are otherwise incompatible with. With the system I have outlined above, the student will only study kata that suit them and that they can perform at their maximum potential. 3.) In the event of kata competition, the student will have been strictly practicing two or so kata for a long time, possibly giving them an edge in their performance.

The belt system will go white, green, brown, and black. I will not do belt tests. Instead, I will decide when a student is ready for the next belt and simply give it to them when the time is right. I intend to keep a good pace of belt promotions so that the student practices for a minimum of 4 years before reaching black belt.

I will not include board breaking. There are much better ways to measure a student's power.

It is at this point that I must address what "style" is truly being taught here. The dojo will teach Shotokan techniques but will not strictly be Shotokan. Seeing as Shotokan, Taekwondo, Tang Soo Do, and Soo Bahk Do are all just different flavors of the same art with exactly the same techniques taught in different orders with different mechanics, I will not hesitate to include techniques from those other arts where appropriate. In addition, I will allow practitioners from those offshoot styles to be recognized by their rank in their respective styles. For example, if a Taekwondo red belt signs up, I will recognize them as a red belt. If a Soo Bahk Do black belt signs up, they are a black belt and will be treated as such. I will not do any belt-switching formalities, de-ranking, re-testing, or any of that. There are only so many ways that an individual can punch and kick, so if someone with many years of experience from another style walks into the dojo, I don't think it matters if they aren't proficient in the specific kata we do in Shotokan or if they don't do a certain technique the way Shotokan people do it. If they're good at punching and kicking, they're good at punching and kicking, and I will acknowledge their abilities as such. And if someone walks in with a belt they clearly haven't earned, well then that mistake is on them.

This leads into my final point, which is how I intend to teach all of this. I do not believe in rigid curriculums, nor do I believe in extremely precise details in how a student throws a technique. As stated above, there are only so many ways a human can manipulate their arms and legs to hit a target. I believe that like with everything else in life, everyone will do things a slightly different way, and think that there is an optimal way for each body type to fight. I will not teach a 350lbs individual to focus on speed, nor will I teach an inflexible person to focus on head kicks. I will teach the same basic techniques to everyone but also encourage a certain level of self-expression when it comes to applying such techniques, so long as they throw the techniques in a practical and efficient manner. One student might focus on low kicks, the next student might be a good puncher, the next student might throw a roundhouse with a straight leg, the next student might throw an uppercut from a different angle than the next student, and so on. I think that given the sheer amount of Karate styles that have been developed over the centuries - of which there are probably hundreds - it should be clear at this point in history that there is no "correct" way to do anything.

This plan is intended for something that will likely occur at least 2 years from now, so there are probably a lot of issues that need to be ironed out, but I would like to hear anyone's input on if this is a good idea or how it could be made better. There are some things to keep in mind about my own experience:
-As stated before, my total martial arts experience is only about 8 years, 2 of which have involved teaching.
-Most of the sparring I have done is what I can only describe as "heavy" Shotokan-style sparring, i.e. point-style but with enough vigor that I have received multiple concussions and fractured bones from it. I train at a dojo that has produced several WKF team members and my instructor was a UFC coach at one point, so although the sparring isn't full-contact, it's still "heavy."
-Most of my full-contact experience is strictly hand-based (boxing).
-I have very limited experience with sparring in kickboxing and Kyokushin-style sparring (I'm talking a total of a few days). In other words, I am not experienced in sparring that involves leg kicks which I want to include in my own dojo, and I am not sure on how to work them in if I do not have experience with them.
-I have much experience with full-contact Taekwondo sparring, but only with a hogu.

I want to know if there is anything I must do or become proficient in before I would be competent enough to teach Shotokan in the way I have outlined in this post.

In conclusion, I want to open up a dojo in which I teach Shotokan Karate, but in such a way where the techniques are kept simple and pressure tested regularly with full-contact sparring and heavy bag work. I want my dojo to feel more like a gym and less like a military bootcamp. I want to do things this way not just to make the training more practical, but to make it easier to teach.

Any input would be much appreciated! I look forward to being a part of this community.
 

marvin8

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I intend to open up my own Karate dojo within the next few years or so. However, instead of teaching Shotokan the normal way, I want to teach a simplified version of it where contact fighting is the primary focus, and the techniques being taught are simple and practical. In other words, it will be Shotokan Karate techniques taught in a manner similar to boxing or kickboxing...

Although fighting techniques will be the primary focus, the more traditional "basics" of Shotokan will also be taught for the purpose of teaching proper body mechanics, and of course for keeping the traditional aspects of the art intact. I want to teach people how to fight, but I also want to teach them Karate.

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Monkey Turned Wolf

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What you are describing sounds pretty similar to how American kickboxing started. Karate guys looking for full-contact fighting. It also sounds like @Buka 's american karate style..tagging him so he sees this thread.
 

punisher73

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What you are describing sounds pretty similar to how American kickboxing started. Karate guys looking for full-contact fighting. It also sounds like @Buka 's american karate style..tagging him so he sees this thread.

I agree, there are several "combat karate" styles that have sprung up through the years that had this same idea.

For the most part, "fighting schools" don't pay the bills. That is why most places will have a separate fighting class for those that DO want the hard contact/sparring concept and then have the other classes to pay the bills.
 

Hot Lunch

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As for kata, one observation I have made while teaching Karate is that students typically enjoy sparring more than kata practice. I have only met a few people who prefer kata over sparring. It is for this reason that the kata training, like the rest of the training, will be kept simple. Kata will be taught in a manner far different from other dojos. Beginner students will learn the three Tekki kata. I have chosen these to be beginner kata as I feel they are the most practical and easy to teach. They contain all the basic techniques that would be used during sparring (jab, cross, hook, uppercut, elbow, knee, leg check, etc), and, in theory, their simple side-to-side footwork would be easier for beginners to understand than the more complex footwork found in the Taikyoku and Heian kata. I have actually tested this theory on people who have never done Karate in their life, and they have all found the Tekki kata much easier to get the hang of than the Taikyoku or Heian kata.
Some Shorin-ryu schools do Naihanchis before Pinans; but I understand why each school does it the way they do. Shotokan Heians are a bit more simplified than Pinans in other styles. But I also think Tekki comes after Heian in Shotokan, because Tekkis are done in kiba dachi as opposed to naihanchi dachi. The ability to maintain a good kiba dachi comes from a number of months of training.

But I do agree that all five Heians and all three Tekkis should come before Bassai Dai. This would require katas to be doubled up at the lower kyu grades so that Bassai Dai is still learned at sankyu.
 

Buka

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Welcome to Martial Talk, Bonk. I hope you enjoy it here.

That’s a big undertaking ahead of you, I wish you all the best with it.

Since it’s a couple of years away keep growing as a Martial Artist, keep training, visit other schools to see what ideas they’ve implemented and study business, maybe take some business classes, they can only help.
 

drop bear

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I agree, there are several "combat karate" styles that have sprung up through the years that had this same idea.

For the most part, "fighting schools" don't pay the bills. That is why most places will have a separate fighting class for those that DO want the hard contact/sparring concept and then have the other classes to pay the bills.

There has to be a point to a fighting school to make people want to go through the process.

Which generally means competition.

There is one I know "courage" gym that combines fighting school and martial arts school quie well.

Looks like 1 pro class a week.
 

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punisher73

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There has to be a point to a fighting school to make people want to go through the process.

Which generally means competition.

There is one I know "courage" gym that combines fighting school and martial arts school quie well.

Looks like 1 pro class a week.
Perfect example of what I was talking about. Usually, the most successful (financially) schools have a great kids program.
(Note: I am ONLY talking about financially and "great" in terms of money and being able to keep the doors open, NOT a commentary on the effectiveness)

Most MMA gyms already do this, but most TMA's schools are still learning this.
 

hoshin1600

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From a buisness perspective I would advise that people attend martial arts classes for a multitude of reasons and what you have posted sounds like what YOU would like to see in a school. What is the number of adults in your area that are looking for what you plan on providing? I am not being negative but that number is probably very low.
You are trying to bridge the gap between two different buisness models. That is a marketing nightmare. Clients looking for hard contact will gravitate to MMA and tend to avoid the traditional, while the client not interested in hard contact would be looking for all the things you cut out.
There are ways to have a successful blended approach but you should be aware that what you want in a dojo may not align with what your customer demographic would want.
It sounds like your back round is mostly traditional. I would want to attend an MMA school for a time to get experience with that.
 

Fungus

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I, however, want the appeal of my dojo to be the fighting ability and striking power that the student will gain from the training, but without the more intimidating nature of a "fighting" gym (Muay Thai, MMA, Kyokushin, etc).
...
The sparring will not be the standard Shotokan sparring, i.e. touch sparring where the focus is distance control and timing. It will also not be the Kyokushin-style knockdown sparring where everything except head punches are allowed. Instead, it will be a modified version of a "body round," as it is known in some boxing circles. It will be full-contact fighting involving hand and foot techniques, but the target zone will be limited to below the neck and above the knees. The reason for this is simple: to minimize the risk of injury while also toughening people up. In order to maintain a safe environment for people of all ages, yet also keep the training realistic and having a decent level of pressure to the fighting, I want students to be able to spar with
I think any local club has it's own atmosphere and culture.

I can assure not all kyokushin dojos are fight clubs, it depends on the people on board. some clubs are very comitted and focuses on full contact competitions only.

While full contact competitions allow more, in the weekly fight classes, we sometimes go hard, but not full contact to head, we also avoid "legal moves" that have high risk of damage, such as stomp kicks. In competitions you can do follow-through kicks towards head, but this we don't do in normal sparring. There are also kyokushin semi-contact rules where follow-through full forces kicks to head are not allowed.

Also, it makes no sense to conditioning you head, what we do for corresponding "mental conditoning", is we sometimes slap each other in the face with open hands, just as an exercise, not to knock or break.

So what you describe doesn't seem too unlike a weekly kyokushing fight class. Not every class is a competition! After a real competition you may also be "out of order" for some weeks, which wouldn't work for weekly traiing.
 

Gyakuto

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In conclusion, I want to open up a dojo in which I teach Shotokan Karate, but in such a way where the techniques are kept simple
Then it’s not Shotokan.
and pressure tested regularly with full-contact sparring
Make sure you get really comprehensive personal liability insurance.
I want my dojo to feel more like a gym and less like a military bootcamp. I want to do things this way not just to make the training more practical, but to make it easier to teach.
Master Ken…. is that you? What’s wrong with Ameridote?
Any input would be much appreciated! I look forward to being a part of this community.
Aren’t there a thousand variations of this sort out there, especially in the USA? How will you make your system more appealing than say, Bibbildybobbidly Ryu on the other side of town that offers a clear curriculum so students know exactly where they stand, regular and lots of belts to progress through, a sense of lineage, a comprehensive repertoire of kata, even the ones which are really challenging to their body forms, because a challenge is where you learn the most.

You sound like you’re trying to reinvent the wheel or force through an evolutionary stage without the pressure of temporal forging. Is it time to revamp and reboot our 'Outside the box' policy concepts? Can you be sure that your upgraded model offers responsive relative resources. You need a more contemporary reimagining of your three-dimensional incremental mobility.

All that said, good luck.
 
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Bonk

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Thank you all for the responses. I will spend much time filling all these holes that have been pointed out.

From a buisness perspective I would advise that people attend martial arts classes for a multitude of reasons and what you have posted sounds like what YOU would like to see in a school. What is the number of adults in your area that are looking for what you plan on providing? I am not being negative but that number is probably very low.
You are trying to bridge the gap between two different buisness models. That is a marketing nightmare. Clients looking for hard contact will gravitate to MMA and tend to avoid the traditional, while the client not interested in hard contact would be looking for all the things you cut out.
There are ways to have a successful blended approach but you should be aware that what you want in a dojo may not align with what your customer demographic would want.
It sounds like your back round is mostly traditional. I would want to attend an MMA school for a time to get experience with that.
You bring up a very good point, and it makes me think of the original reason I made this plan:

I have spoken with many people who have done traditional martial arts but have decided to stop because they felt that it was "silly," or in some cases "juvenile." They were drawn in by the appeal of TMA but left due to feeling that the training itself was unrealistic, mundane, or too wacky. In other words, they were memorising dozens of basics and one-steps as opposed to drilling sparring combinations, doing bag work, or proper sparring. In fact, plenty of them actually gravitated toward MMA, Muay Thai, etc after being disappointed with TMA due to the bigger focus on simplicity and practicality.

The dojo I currently attend is not a far cry from the latter type of training, and thus the training I want to teach; we spend maybe 5% of the time doing basics and kata, with the other 95% being kumite drills and sparring. This format has proven itself to be an effective business strategy, as we always have full (sometimes overfull) classes. I've even heard quite a few people say that this training format is the reason they've stuck with the dojo. My intention is to set things up in this format, just with more focus on conditioning and contact.

Would you say that modifying the plan to gravitate more toward TMA could make it more feasible? Perhaps getting rid of the "no-gi" thing and maybe adding the traditional language back in?

Again, you bring up an amazing point and it has got me thinking.
 

mograph

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For the most part, "fighting schools" don't pay the bills. That is why most places will have a separate fighting class for those that DO want the hard contact/sparring concept and then have the other classes to pay the bills.
... like karate for kids.
 

drop bear

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I think the trick is creating opportunities.

You create opportunities for fighters to fight and for non fighters to be part of the fighters process.

This creates cohesion within the club and gives everyone a purpose to work towards.

Then everyone gets to benefit.
 

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