Contact Sparring

[Gemini]

So we all agree that "NO" contact is not a good thing.

No. Again, that is not what I wrote and I'm sorry you're taking away such a singular view of all that I've tried to describe. It suggests to me that you're probably in your early years of instruction that has not had alot of interaction with other schools and their training philosophies. Please don't take any offense to that. It's only an observation, not a critique. We all started there.

Most senior instructors have learned there is always more than one way to skin a cat and demonstrate a much greater tolerance for other teaching styles (whether they agree with it or not) than the reaction I've seen to the OP's post. I mean, we still have no idea what the school's training philosophy is other than what a new student has told us from his viewpoint and we're throwing the rope over the tree limb. How long has he been training? Do we really think as a community that such a post will accuratley describe this school and convey all we need to know to make an informed opinion? Not in my opinion, no. Personally, I'd like to hear more from the OP and get some answers to the questions I asked in the first post.

My apologies to the OP if I've gotten off topic. I know I've been gone from MT for a while, but this is not the behavior of my peers as I remember and I find this new "no tolerance" unsettling.

Regards,

 

[Earl Weiss]

Yes, I agree with everyone. Students often learn best if there is a combination of auditory, visual, and tactile context given.

If you only talk...they can tune you out (involuntarily of course).

If you only show them visually, they might miss any nuances which invariably are rather important to making it work.

If you have them 'feel' the technique, they only get half of the instruction.

So the answer is to give it all to them.

Hmm sounds kind of familiar:
http://371078645507472465-a-1802744...9jTjnCkLaVqfdy-T-L5g16gcSSDQ==&attredirects=0

I guess great minds think alike

 

[dancingalone]

Good article! Thanks for writing it.

 

[ATC]

No. Again, that is not what I wrote and I'm sorry you're taking away such a singular view of all that I've tried to describe. It suggests to me that you're probably in your early years of instruction that has not had alot of interaction with other schools and their training philosophies. Please don't take any offense to that. It's only an observation, not a critique. We all started there.

Most senior instructors have learned there is always more than one way to skin a cat and demonstrate a much greater tolerance for other teaching styles (whether they agree with it or not) than the reaction I've seen to the OP's post. I mean, we still have no idea what the school's training philosophy is other than what a new student has told us from his viewpoint and we're throwing the rope over the tree limb. How long has he been training? Do we really think as a community that such a post will accuratley describe this school and convey all we need to know to make an informed opinion? Not in my opinion, no. Personally, I'd like to hear more from the OP and get some answers to the questions I asked in the first post.

My apologies to the OP if I've gotten off topic. I know I've been gone from MT for a while, but this is not the behavior of my peers as I remember and I find this new "no tolerance" unsettling.

Regards,

Well you can't have it both ways. Either there is contact or there is none. As soon as you even say light contact then there is contact so there is no middle ground here.

You can learn the art with no contact I agree but your art wont be practicle by any stretch.

 

[Master Dan]

The whole point to TKD is full contact for conditioning as well as self defense and I do not mean hitting but being able to take a hit so it dose not bother you in fact after an oponent has hit you with everything they have and it did no good you now have the advantage not to mention more wind.

Sparing is the strong helping the weaker get stronger by allowing them to improve with out injury. I have met many people at master level in many styles that have only applied technique to the air and have no ability to make penetrating contact just pretty movements.

Your problem is this. Koreans are now totally afraid of being suide for injury and believe Americans are litigous. Instead of having dicipline and total control in the class which takes more work just eliminate the teaching. There are more permanent injuries over the last 25 years in wrestling, football and basket ball than there has ever been in TKD but the majority of teachers/coaches in those sports are not Korean and they are covered by general insurance and a different mentality. Kids are being hurt in those sports because coaches want to win regardless of injury or risk to youth.

At the very least use a wave master or heavy bag be sure you know how or that will injure you also. You may have to go down the street to MMA to cross train but still keep up your traditional tkd if you cannot find one that will still do contact sparing. Remember sport tkd is not everything but just one piece you need all of it but muscle memory will serve you in old age.

 

[Twin Fist]

.... in this dojang we spar but have NO NO NO contact during sparring.

no contact sparring = bullcrap martial arts, fake, trickery fraud you name it, it is any and every bad thing you can think of

martial arts is about FIGHTING, and I dont care how much you practice, if you aint getting hit, you aint learning anything.

look at it this way, does watching a lot of porn make you a good lover?

 

[bluewaveschool]

no contact sparring = bullcrap martial arts, fake, trickery fraud you name it, it is any and every bad thing you can think of

martial arts is about FIGHTING, and I dont care how much you practice, if you aint getting hit, you aint learning anything.

look at it this way, does watching a lot of porn make you a good lover?

Well, it can certainly teach you things...

 

[ATC]

...look at it this way, does watching a lot of porn make you a good lover?

Bad, bad analogy. I now see this thread going way off topic. :rofl:

 

[Earl Weiss]

The whole point to TKD is full contact for conditioning as well as self defense and I do not mean hitting but being able to take a hit so it dose not bother you in fact after an oponent has hit you with everything they have and it did no good you now have the advantage not to mention more wind.


quote]
If an opponent has hit you with everything they have and it does no good, then they were not much of an opponent.

 

[just2kicku]

I am a firm believer in contact,a lot of contact. I'm not aTKD guy, but I think you start off light and go heavier as you progress. To me it would be like taking jujitsu and rolling on the mat with no one. Doesn't make sense

 

[Master Dan]

The whole point to TKD is full contact for conditioning as well as self defense and I do not mean hitting but being able to take a hit so it dose not bother you in fact after an oponent has hit you with everything they have and it did no good you now have the advantage not to mention more wind.


quote]
If an opponent has hit you with everything they have and it does no good, then they were not much of an opponent.

Thats a generalization of opinion not fact the best fighters in the world have been deflated or demoralized by oponents with what at first seemed to be a less skilled contender but they had the ability and endurance to last long enough to win not just physical but mentally!!!!!!!

Contact even though sport is to simulate life and death with out actually dieing!!! it builds confidence and courage like in Zen when you take a cold shower at the begining of the day they say it builds courage for the start of the day? and this comes from world authorities in mental health and development.

If you have never been hit how are you going to react on the street its like trying to teach grapling and presure points with out touching or having it applied to you? try doing throws with out knowing how to fall disaster.

I love the movies but I hate what digital has done to Martial Arts in the minds of students not realizing not every block works no one blocks everything the actors may have worked hours to do one 60 second segment that was all in pieces in slow motion then put together. Position, covering vital areas is more important but with out contact you will never truely learn that?

 

[Earl Weiss]

x>>

Quote:
Originally Posted by Master Dan
The whole point to TKD is full contact for conditioning as well as self defense and I do not mean hitting but being able to take a hit so it dose not bother you in fact after an oponent has hit you with everything they have and it did no good you now have the advantage not to mention more wind.


quote]
If an opponent has hit you with everything they have and it does no good, then they were not much of an opponent.

Thats a generalization of opinion not fact the best fighters in the world have been deflated or demoralized by oponents with what at first seemed to be a less skilled contender but they had the ability and endurance to last long enough to win not just physical but mentally!!!!!!!

Uh, No, it's fact.

A. You are confusing the street with sports that include padded coverings and legal target areas. Willing combatants often more or less evenly matched, prepared and highly conditioned.
B. Even in sport few shots land "with everything they have" except for the shot that ends the fight.

If your opinion is that I am incorrect, then we can let readers of this board choose who they believe to be correct.

 

[Marginal]

So we all agree that "NO" contact is not a good thing.

As for the thread in the General Martial Arts section about the poor guy that gets tossed in with the HULK every class, I have read that and had no response.

Calm the Hulk down. He just wants to be left alone.

I really don't mind the full contact, but with no training and against someone bigger, stronger, better than you is just confidence crushing. That poor guy may stop his training altogether.

The the worst shots I've taken were during "no contact" sparring. Nothing debilitating but super annoying stuff like shin clashes sans pads etc.

 

[Gemini]

The the worst shots I've taken were during "no contact" sparring.

Likewise. Once I even broke my partners wrist when he reached out to block my kick. It happens.