G
GouRonin
Guest
Anything you can do I can do better...
...yes I can...
Censorship, Moderation and MartialTalk
- Thread starter Bob Hubbard
- Start date
- Status
Anything you can do I can do better...
...yes I can...
M
Master of Blades
Guest
Nah, trust me, none of my threads or any thread I'm part of stays on track for long
G
GouRonin
Guest
...yes I can...
M
Master of Blades
Guest
Stop singing to yourself.....And to be honest I only hijack threads that I feel are going no where or if the mood needs lightening. Otherwise I let things run smoothly :rofl:
G
GouRonin
Guest
It's too late now for that! "It's ChinaTown!"
:redeme:
M
Master of Blades
Guest
Is that your new saying or something?
J
Jill666
Guest
Quite true.
I will also keep the rating down a bit- now I'm comfortable w/ PM.
:asian:
I have 0 problems guys! :asian:
R
RCastillo
Guest
NO, you have one, ME!
Yes I see, now. I really wish I can see your face when you get to view "THE" picture (only you will know when you see "the" picture).
R
RCastillo
Guest
Yes, and I have a nice looking face. Just ask the Dragon!
- Joined
- Apr 18, 2002
- Messages
- 8,069
- Reaction score
- 25
Kaith et al.,
As a general rule I do not have a problem with the Mod TEAM. I do however, have a problem with a couple of the Mods. I will be happy to discuss my feeling with you as long as they remain private.
As a general rule I do not have a problem with the Mod TEAM. I do however, have a problem with a couple of the Mods. I will be happy to discuss my feeling with you as long as they remain private.
Cruentus
Grandmaster
(disclaimer: the "you" in my post is directed to MEMBERS in general)
Couple of short things to remember:
1. Mods are people too. They have emotions, desires, likes, dislikes, etc. What little quirk sets one Mod off, might not phase another.
2. Consistancy? You want consistancy, go join a commune, hippie. It just ain't going to happend, anywhere. No set of rules is ever perfectly abided by, or enforced. The "consistancy" of enforcement of rules also is effected extrememly by the fact that the Mods. aren't making the big $$$, and don't do this full time.
3. YOU (as a non-mod.) don't know what goes on behind the scenes, and neither do I. One thread that crosses the line might go untouched by the mods because no one complains about it. Another might get warnings even if it seems that the line was "barely" crossed; but what you don't see is the mods might have gotten a complaint or two or three, which caused the warning. You just don't know, but the "unknown" has to be taken into account.
Basically, any "inconsistancies" are probably due to one of the above things listed. Yet, despite these factors, I think that that you'll only be able to find a small handful of posts where things could be argued to be "inconsistant" out of the thousands of posts and threads on this forum, where things where handled just fine. Considering this, I think that the Moderators are doing a wonderful job.
Guess what, I have been "edited" just recently where I felt it might of not been completely necissary. Well, boo-hoo. So friggin' what! I'm not goin to sit here and b**ch about it like a sissy. I wouldn't even be mentioning it if it wasn't for the sake of this example. I just respected the authority and responsability that the Mods have undertaken, and I moved on with my life. No harm really done. When people get there tighty-******'s in a bunch over stuff like this, I think that they are making more out of an issue then they should.
Point it, the mods here are extrememly lienient and fair. Most likely you won't have ANY problems. But, so what if your warned, sensored, edited, or locked, and you don't "fully agree"? Just take your medacine and move foward, and don't be such a damn sissy! Use a different word, or sensor yourself, or simply log off for awhile and calm down. It's only an internet forum, for cryin' out loud! Given the honest attempt to be fair by the mods here, I think that as members we should be willing to compromise more often, even if we don't agree with an action.
Now, if there is an honest problem, I can understand talking to the mods regarding the issue. Usually, though, there isn't an honest problem, YOUR just being a cry baby, and that is the real problem.
So, shape up, as they say, and if you don't like the rules, or if you can't stand being corrected or "warned", or if you simply can't behave yourself, then (as they also say) ship yo @$$ out!
Thank you,
PAUL
:bird:
Couple of short things to remember:
1. Mods are people too. They have emotions, desires, likes, dislikes, etc. What little quirk sets one Mod off, might not phase another.
2. Consistancy? You want consistancy, go join a commune, hippie. It just ain't going to happend, anywhere. No set of rules is ever perfectly abided by, or enforced. The "consistancy" of enforcement of rules also is effected extrememly by the fact that the Mods. aren't making the big $$$, and don't do this full time.
3. YOU (as a non-mod.) don't know what goes on behind the scenes, and neither do I. One thread that crosses the line might go untouched by the mods because no one complains about it. Another might get warnings even if it seems that the line was "barely" crossed; but what you don't see is the mods might have gotten a complaint or two or three, which caused the warning. You just don't know, but the "unknown" has to be taken into account.
Basically, any "inconsistancies" are probably due to one of the above things listed. Yet, despite these factors, I think that that you'll only be able to find a small handful of posts where things could be argued to be "inconsistant" out of the thousands of posts and threads on this forum, where things where handled just fine. Considering this, I think that the Moderators are doing a wonderful job.
Guess what, I have been "edited" just recently where I felt it might of not been completely necissary. Well, boo-hoo. So friggin' what! I'm not goin to sit here and b**ch about it like a sissy. I wouldn't even be mentioning it if it wasn't for the sake of this example. I just respected the authority and responsability that the Mods have undertaken, and I moved on with my life. No harm really done. When people get there tighty-******'s in a bunch over stuff like this, I think that they are making more out of an issue then they should.
Point it, the mods here are extrememly lienient and fair. Most likely you won't have ANY problems. But, so what if your warned, sensored, edited, or locked, and you don't "fully agree"? Just take your medacine and move foward, and don't be such a damn sissy! Use a different word, or sensor yourself, or simply log off for awhile and calm down. It's only an internet forum, for cryin' out loud! Given the honest attempt to be fair by the mods here, I think that as members we should be willing to compromise more often, even if we don't agree with an action.
Now, if there is an honest problem, I can understand talking to the mods regarding the issue. Usually, though, there isn't an honest problem, YOUR just being a cry baby, and that is the real problem.
So, shape up, as they say, and if you don't like the rules, or if you can't stand being corrected or "warned", or if you simply can't behave yourself, then (as they also say) ship yo @$$ out!
Thank you,
PAUL
:bird:
G
GouRonin
Guest
D@mn it Paul! Stop that! You made me think of Eric Cartman when you said that and I spit my milk all over the keyboard.
I have to ask you to refrain from making me laugh while drinking.
Cruentus
Grandmaster
Glad I could return the favor from all the times you made me laugh and spit Guinness out my nose all over my keyboard.
K
Kirk
Guest
Pretty good job of kissin' ***.
More butt kissin. But I am no hippie. You don't know me, and
don't know what went on in the past. But do tell oh wise one,
how does the fact that they make no money here effect the
consistency?
I was a mod here, so I know a hell of a lot more than you do
about this. In the 6 months that I was a mod, there were maybe
a total of 5 complaints about posts. Out of how many
HUNDREDS?! But there were LOADS of warnings and quite a few
thread locks. How much do YOU know? You're totally making
assumptions here in your attempt to suck up and making yourself
look stupid. Look who started this thread off initially. I was
content with taking it to PM, I didn't start this thread, A MOD DID!
Again, posting on something you know nothing about. If you
even read this complete thread, you'd see that The Admins were
upset about ONE SINGLE SOLITARY SIGNATURE FILE .. which
proved the point that words can sting others, and that this board
shouldn't be a medium for that. But I'm sure you're gonna come
back with "well golly gee willikers, if the mods think that it's okay,
then they're absolutely right".
You're bitchin' about it now dorko! All hail Paul, prince of irony!!!
Again ... why don't YOU tell me where my actual complaints were?
How 'bout a quote? You have nothing, and are therefore talking
out of your ***. You know nothing about it, yet feel you have to
seize the opportunity to suck some butt. What is it that you're
looking for? Wanna be a mod? Ever try just asking?
Fair = consistancy. That's all. The mods said they wanted feed
back, and when I gave it, or tried to discuss I feel it ended up
on "deaf ears". So I made a point in a dramatic way. This was
SOOOOOOOOOO not about using a different word!
And it's not about ONE occurance. If you'd have read this entire
thread, you'd have realized that (given that you have a normal
amount of literacy, which the way you sling out insults, I think
you do).
Fine .. start a poll .. if that's the consensus of this board, I'll be
more than happy to step aside and never return. I do however
suggest you KNOW what YOU'RE talking about before you post
such a passionate, insulting message. Or next time just start a
thread on how wonderful the mods are.
Cruentus
Grandmaster
Well Kirk,
I didn't mention your name in my post, but if the shoe fits, wear it.
I'm not kissing anyones @$$ either Kirk, I'm just stating my opinions. I haven't overstepped my boundries, or stated anything beyond the scope of my knowledge. I don't need to go "point by point" with you post, either, because your message is clear. When you don't get your way, you cry like a child.:wah:
The mods have done some things that you disagree with, so you cry about it. Although you try to pretend like you are the all-knowing former mod, you have been clearly wrong even here on this thread. Yet, instead of admitting fault, you cry some more. Then, I posted opinions that you disagree with (which weren't really specifically directed towards you) and you cried even more, and resorted to personally attacking me.
Your message is very clear, and so is mine. Suck it up and be a man, Kirk.
I didn't mention your name in my post, but if the shoe fits, wear it.
I'm not kissing anyones @$$ either Kirk, I'm just stating my opinions. I haven't overstepped my boundries, or stated anything beyond the scope of my knowledge. I don't need to go "point by point" with you post, either, because your message is clear. When you don't get your way, you cry like a child.:wah:
The mods have done some things that you disagree with, so you cry about it. Although you try to pretend like you are the all-knowing former mod, you have been clearly wrong even here on this thread. Yet, instead of admitting fault, you cry some more. Then, I posted opinions that you disagree with (which weren't really specifically directed towards you) and you cried even more, and resorted to personally attacking me.
Your message is very clear, and so is mine. Suck it up and be a man, Kirk.
G
GouRonin
Guest
1) The "I'm leaving" thing. Um...you kinda do this a lot. Usually when you're mad and then you sheepishly come back saying you're sorry. People accept it and welcome u back. I think you're a bit mad now and want people to see your opinion and running on an emotional surge about this. People just might not agree with you on this though. Maybe take a few minutes and just think about what you're saying.
But I could be wrong.
Also, on Paul making himself look stupid. Well, he is funny looking, but he's just stating his point. Take this in the idea of just an outside observer. They method you are using to state your position isn't helping you look much better. It's making you look kinda childish and "i'm right and if you don't like it I will take my ball and go home." which I don't think you intend to come across like.
You have said that sometimes what you type doesn't come across as you intend on the net and I think this is one of those time.
Just trying to give you a heads up before you get deep into something that you are not sure how you got into.
:cheers:
P.S. - It's CHINA TOWN!
:redeme:
But I could be wrong.
Also, on Paul making himself look stupid. Well, he is funny looking, but he's just stating his point. Take this in the idea of just an outside observer. They method you are using to state your position isn't helping you look much better. It's making you look kinda childish and "i'm right and if you don't like it I will take my ball and go home." which I don't think you intend to come across like.
You have said that sometimes what you type doesn't come across as you intend on the net and I think this is one of those time.
Just trying to give you a heads up before you get deep into something that you are not sure how you got into.
:cheers:
P.S. - It's CHINA TOWN!
:redeme:
K
Kirk
Guest
I know you're just lookin' out for me here, but I didn't say "fine,
I'm leaving. I said if the majority of the members here, want me
gone, then I'll go .. quietly.
Also, if you search, I did the "fine, I'm leaving" thing ONE time. It
was when I decided I'd leave forums altogether, so there was a
post here, and on kenponet about it. That's it. Never more than
the one time.
And the manner in which I'm stating my opinions is the result of
other failed .. private attempts. No one just reading the
"public" stuff knows how many.
You may see it as me "attacking" Paul, I see it as retaliating.
Insult made were "hippie" "sissy" and "cry baby". To say it wasn't
addressed to me personally, shows yet again, that he didn't read
this post and had no idea what he was talking about. Who else
said they had a problem, but myself and Seig? Who the hell else
could it have been adressing?
This thread exists because I took a shot at the staff. ONE tiny lil
itty bitty sentence, that hurt thier feelings. In the past, when I
tried to discuss things, I felt I got no reply. I don't feel that sigs
and titles should be used for this purpose. I did resort to extreme
measures to make my point, but only after previous attempts
didn't even get a "if you dont like it leave" statement.
OP
- Thread Starter
- #80
Just a few bits:
I was content with taking it to PM, I didn't start this thread, A MOD DID!
I was too, however, you brought up some good points that I felt needed a public addressing. I wanted all the cards on the table so we can move forward towards fixing things, and I think we're doing that.
"you'd see that The Admins were
upset about ONE SINGLE SOLITARY SIGNATURE FILE " No. There were other things too, that was however the one that put me over the edge.
"how does the fact that they make no money here effect the
consistency?" The staff (including me) is all volentier. A few paid moderators could devote more serious time focusing exclusivly on things, rather than working it in around 'real life'. That -might- make things more consistant.
"1. Mods are people too. They have emotions, desires, likes, dislikes, etc. What little quirk sets one Mod off, might not phase another." This is true. Have a bad day at the office? A minor slight one day seems worse then. We're only human.
Wanna be a mod? Ever try just asking? I think Kirk and Rob will both agree, being a mod on an active forum can be a royal pain in the ***. Burn out is high, as is the stress level.
Problems with a moderator? This is an open invitation. PM or Email me your voice phone number and a good time to call you. IF you are in the US or Canada I will be more than happy to call you voice to discuss your concerns privately. (Sorry, I can't afford international charges now, but feel free to email me and it will also remain private)
Behind the scenes stuff We maintain a couple of private forums for administration. 1 for forum mods, 1 for admins and 1 for chat mods (as well as a few others for tossed threads, special projects, and reference material).
Past issues We are commited to activly improving how we do things. Kirk and Rob both have commented that we would 'talk' an issue to death before doing anything. Its also been mentioned that we 'jump the gun' at times. We are putting new procedures into place that will hopefully smooth things out in the long run. For example, Moderators are now under instruction that if they are 'involved' in a situation, that they are to go hands off, and let a cooler less biased mod deal with it...that includes me.
I do anticipate some growing pains as we do this though. Have a little patience and give us feed back on how we are doing. Without it, we function in the dark.
Balance of arts on the moderation team. I do FMA. So do the majority of our moderators. While I would love to have a very diverse background team, it hasn't worked out quite that way.
Whats it take to be a moderator here?
When -I- look at potential moderators, I look for a number of things:
- Are they cool under pressure?
- Are they non-political?
- How long have they been here?
- How have they contributed to MartialTalk?
- Do they have any mod experience?
- Whats their background?
There are people here I would love to have as a mod. They post tons of great info, often go out of their way to help, etc. But they end up in huge flame wars, or lost in vendettas, or have a history with enough folks, or are too 'politically involved' with their own organizations, or a dozen other reasons. DC offered a while back to help out. I had to turn him down as he's the head of an organization. But Tim Hartmans an org. head and hes a mod, you say. Tim is a special case. Tim helped me setup and is a major promoter of martialTalk. That said, he has never been an very active moderator, and is now in an advisory position here. Would I accept someone from a Modern Arnis organization outside the WMAA as a mod? Sure. If they can contribute to the forum and behave in a professional and polite manner.
To answer the unasked question : Why no kenpo mods since kenpo is a very important part of martialtalk?
answer - we had 2, but we parted ways. We now have 1 who has shown herself to be cool under fire. I'd like to have at least 3 mods with a kenpo background.
You want to be a mod? Think you can handle the stress? Let me know. But, one thing to remember - we expect you to 'get outside the box' of your own art. We have dozens of forums here that need attention. If youre willing to take on the job, let me know you might be interested. We will give anyone a fair chance at it, provided they fit our requirements. There are many things you can do to improve your chances:
- help keep threads on topic
- stay out of flame wars
- keep cool under fire
- add good content to the forum, not just 'me too' posts.
- keep us informed of 'problems' by PM or using the 'report to mod' function.
- help out newbies
- be on often and be active while on.
We cant make everyone a mod, and a moderator position isn't a 'prize' or 'reward'. Its an often times thankless job thats full of stress and headaches. But the reward is a better forum community for all of us.
:asian:
I was content with taking it to PM, I didn't start this thread, A MOD DID!
I was too, however, you brought up some good points that I felt needed a public addressing. I wanted all the cards on the table so we can move forward towards fixing things, and I think we're doing that.
"you'd see that The Admins were
upset about ONE SINGLE SOLITARY SIGNATURE FILE " No. There were other things too, that was however the one that put me over the edge.
"how does the fact that they make no money here effect the
consistency?" The staff (including me) is all volentier. A few paid moderators could devote more serious time focusing exclusivly on things, rather than working it in around 'real life'. That -might- make things more consistant.
"1. Mods are people too. They have emotions, desires, likes, dislikes, etc. What little quirk sets one Mod off, might not phase another." This is true. Have a bad day at the office? A minor slight one day seems worse then. We're only human.
Wanna be a mod? Ever try just asking? I think Kirk and Rob will both agree, being a mod on an active forum can be a royal pain in the ***. Burn out is high, as is the stress level.
Problems with a moderator? This is an open invitation. PM or Email me your voice phone number and a good time to call you. IF you are in the US or Canada I will be more than happy to call you voice to discuss your concerns privately. (Sorry, I can't afford international charges now, but feel free to email me and it will also remain private)
Behind the scenes stuff We maintain a couple of private forums for administration. 1 for forum mods, 1 for admins and 1 for chat mods (as well as a few others for tossed threads, special projects, and reference material).
Past issues We are commited to activly improving how we do things. Kirk and Rob both have commented that we would 'talk' an issue to death before doing anything. Its also been mentioned that we 'jump the gun' at times. We are putting new procedures into place that will hopefully smooth things out in the long run. For example, Moderators are now under instruction that if they are 'involved' in a situation, that they are to go hands off, and let a cooler less biased mod deal with it...that includes me.
I do anticipate some growing pains as we do this though. Have a little patience and give us feed back on how we are doing. Without it, we function in the dark.
Balance of arts on the moderation team. I do FMA. So do the majority of our moderators. While I would love to have a very diverse background team, it hasn't worked out quite that way.
Whats it take to be a moderator here?
When -I- look at potential moderators, I look for a number of things:
- Are they cool under pressure?
- Are they non-political?
- How long have they been here?
- How have they contributed to MartialTalk?
- Do they have any mod experience?
- Whats their background?
There are people here I would love to have as a mod. They post tons of great info, often go out of their way to help, etc. But they end up in huge flame wars, or lost in vendettas, or have a history with enough folks, or are too 'politically involved' with their own organizations, or a dozen other reasons. DC offered a while back to help out. I had to turn him down as he's the head of an organization. But Tim Hartmans an org. head and hes a mod, you say. Tim is a special case. Tim helped me setup and is a major promoter of martialTalk. That said, he has never been an very active moderator, and is now in an advisory position here. Would I accept someone from a Modern Arnis organization outside the WMAA as a mod? Sure. If they can contribute to the forum and behave in a professional and polite manner.
To answer the unasked question : Why no kenpo mods since kenpo is a very important part of martialtalk?
answer - we had 2, but we parted ways. We now have 1 who has shown herself to be cool under fire. I'd like to have at least 3 mods with a kenpo background.
You want to be a mod? Think you can handle the stress? Let me know. But, one thing to remember - we expect you to 'get outside the box' of your own art. We have dozens of forums here that need attention. If youre willing to take on the job, let me know you might be interested. We will give anyone a fair chance at it, provided they fit our requirements. There are many things you can do to improve your chances:
- help keep threads on topic
- stay out of flame wars
- keep cool under fire
- add good content to the forum, not just 'me too' posts.
- keep us informed of 'problems' by PM or using the 'report to mod' function.
- help out newbies
- be on often and be active while on.
We cant make everyone a mod, and a moderator position isn't a 'prize' or 'reward'. Its an often times thankless job thats full of stress and headaches. But the reward is a better forum community for all of us.
:asian:
- Status
