All kinds of requirements to rip students off! Is this normal?

gpseymour said:
If someone was training folks MMA-style without entering them in competitions (perhaps only rolling/sparring within the school) that need not be a red flag, unless you are planning to compete.
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I know a lot of people who train MMA without wanting to fight as I know a good many traditional people who train but don't want to fight.
 
Blindside said:
One of the problems with many "self-defense instructors" is that they don't know what "the street" is. I don't. I have been in two fist fights in my adult life, I have talked down an angry guy with a machete at close range. I have done all the good good self-defense techniques of "don't be an *******" and "live in a decent neighborhood" and "avoid young males drinking alcohol" and "verbal deesclation" that I haven't had to do the "reality on the street" too often. So I don't train for the untrained guy on the street, I train for a competent adversary, one that knows how to punch, grapple, and use a variety of weapons, I figure if I can deal with that then "the street" should be easier.
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It should be, but there are things the unskilled guy will do that the skilled one won't. If you only practice for the skilled guy, you don't get to practice those things (big haymakers, tackles, for example). Also, if I train for sparring/randori (exclusively), then I'm training for how to work against someone who knows what I do, and that's easily the least likely possible scenario on the street. We all definitely need to work on how to deal with someone who is skilled, but that's not all we need.

Of course, the other side of this is also that I can't possibly teach a new student how to defend against me. I have to start them with how to defend against a bumbling idiot (which most of us were when we started) and work up from there.
 
Blindside said:
I think he is referring to karate style stop and go point fighting.
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Yes; Karate, TKD etc. I actually said somewhere that I see the traditional Thai system (as an example) as a good one. Not only because it doesn't stop but the traditional one also looks for techniques. If you don't use a good balance of techniques, say you are punching 75-80% of the time, you get gigged. I am assuming you were responding to someone I have on ignore, the only one actually, since for some reason they troll virtually everything I say, even if they lack articulable facts or experience to present. It especially frustrating at times since I have agreed with them on issues to say 95% on a point but they do a 180 over the 5%
 
Juany118 said:
Yes; Karate, TKD etc. I actually said somewhere that I see the traditional Thai system (as an example) as a good one. Not only because it doesn't stop but the traditional one also looks for techniques. If you don't use a good balance of techniques, say you are punching 75-80% of the time, you get gigged. I am assuming you were responding to someone I have on ignore, the only one actually, since for some reason they troll virtually everything I say, even if they lack articulable facts or experience to present. It especially frustrating at times since I have agreed with them on issues to say 95% on a point but they do a 180 over the 5%
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You make stuff up. Blatantly. And then deny you said it.
 
Why didn't I think of this before...

The perfect art for you is Kyokushin karate. Yes, you have to buy a gi that may be a bit expensive (they almost all use embroidered Isami brand), but it's a quality gi. Many Kyokushin dojos are bare knuckle, so that cuts down on gear (except for a cup and mouthpiece; some strongly advise shin guards).

Kyokushin is bare knuckle/knockdown, so there's the whole what works and doesn't aspect.

Many have pay per lesson plans, so there's your no contract clause.

But I'm sure you'll find Kyokushin quite objectionable somehow.
 
JR 137 said:
Why didn't I think of this before...

The perfect art for you is Kyokushin karate. Yes, you have to buy a gi that may be a bit expensive (they almost all use embroidered Isami brand), but it's a quality gi. Many Kyokushin dojos are bare knuckle, so that cuts down on gear (except for a cup and mouthpiece; some strongly advise shin guards).

Kyokushin is bare knuckle/knockdown, so there's the whole what works and doesn't aspect.

Many have pay per lesson plans, so there's your no contract clause.

But I'm sure you'll find Kyokushin quite objectionable somehow.
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There is a whole bunch of stuff that would work.

I think he is suffering from ninja disillusionment. Which I didn't get until a few years in.

You know where you do all this martial arts stuff and find out that even though you want it to be a certain way. It never actually is.

Like the first time you Spar multiples or Spar unarmed vs knife. And realise you are going to get hospitalised if you tried that for real.

You think it is going to be this.


And the reality is this.

 
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JR 137 said:
I'm just waiting to hear his reasons why Kyokushin sucks too. I'm sure there's many deluded reasons.
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Yeah. Sorry I added to that. I assume he wants the fantasy on the packaging not what is actually in the box.
 
drop bear said:
Yeah. Sorry I added to that. I assume he wants the fantasy on the packaging not what is actually in the box.
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It'll be all great until someone throws a roundhouse to his head or punch to his ribs, he's got to do knuckle push-ups on hardwood floors, show respect to his teachers and classmates, etc. Shouldn't they have to pay you for all that?

And I really like the "fantasy packaging and not what's actually in the box" line. I've got to remember that one; it'll come in handy.
 
kehcorpz said:
But I heard judo sucks for self defense. Does it not?

I simply refuse to pay monthly fees if you get no training at all for 1,5 months. This is crazy.

And the fees are pretty high. It's 45 euros. You train 4 times per months. This means every session costs 10 euros.
This is pretty crazy when you think about it.
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Honestly, when considering if a martial art is "good" or not, you have to consider the context. A paintbrush is a perfect tool but it's not effective to drive nails. A hammer is a perfect tool but it's not effective to paint a wall.
True story: One time at work, I had a guy grab me and try to put me in a headlock. I executed a hip throw and tossed him onto the concrete floor. He wasn't hurt too badly but he stopped. In that case, Judo was effective. In other situations it might not be. What works and doesn't depends on the context.

Really, the only way to decide if a club is worth your time and money is to join, train, and after awhile you'll know if your getting what you want or wasting your time. Go for it!




"Re-stomp the groin"
Sent from my iPhone 6+ using Tapatalk
 
Tired_Yeti said:
Honestly, when considering if a martial art is "good" or not, you have to consider the context. A paintbrush is a perfect tool but it's not effective to drive nails. A hammer is a perfect tool but it's not effective to paint a wall.
True story: One time at work, I had a guy grab me and try to put me in a headlock. I executed a hip throw and tossed him onto the concrete floor. He wasn't hurt too badly but he stopped. In that case, Judo was effective. In other situations it might not be. What works and doesn't depends on the context.

Really, the only way to decide if a club is worth your time and money is to join, train, and after awhile you'll know if your getting what you want or wasting your time. Go for it!




"Re-stomp the groin"
Sent from my iPhone 6+ using Tapatalk
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Context goes down that rabbit hole though.

It works on the street so it doesn't have to work anywhere else.
 
Danny T said:
I don't list my prices on my website nor will I discuss price over the phone unless you have actually come in and done some complimentary training.
I want you know what you are getting, I want you to meet the staff and talk with them, I want you to meet some of the other students/members and speak with them. I want you to meet and speak with some of the instructors/coaches. I want you to actually see and experience what we have to offer.
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Ok I accept that.

Then tell me what exactly should one expect to get when you're checking a place out?

What if they're just like "you're new? ok, you can train with this guy here". and that's it?

What should be on my checklist so that I know if a place sucks or not?
 
kehcorpz said:
Ok I accept that.

Then tell me what exactly should one expect to get when you're checking a place out?

What if they're just like "you're new? ok, you can train with this guy here". and that's it?

What should be on my checklist so that I know if a place sucks or not?
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Go step by step:

Step 1 - Get off your butt and actually go to a school.
Step 2 - Talk to instructor(s).
Step 3 - Watch a class
Step 4 - Get off your butt and go train.
 
Dirty Dog said:
Go step by step:

Step 1 - Get off your butt and actually go to a school.
Step 2 - Talk to instructor(s).
Step 3 - Watch a class
Step 4 - Get off your butt and go train.
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This doesn't address my questions.
 
No it does not. It does not even mention 1 indictator.
 
kehcorpz said:
No it does not. It does not even mention 1 indictator.
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You're right it didn't you want to know why? Because we're not your instructors go to a school and ask the /instructor/ questions that's how you'll learn. I can't keep up with all your bs is there a reason why you haven't actually done it...
 
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