True, this is why, IMHO, I don't think its a good idea to hide anything, or feel like we have to 'protect' them from something. Like I said, they're going to experiment, its a fact of life. Not educating them is IMO, causing more harm than good.
6th graders may get birth control pills in school?
- Thread starter Ceicei
- Start date
True, this is why, IMHO, I don't think its a good idea to hide anything, or feel like we have to 'protect' them from something. Like I said, they're going to experiment, its a fact of life. Not educating them is IMO, causing more harm than good.
CoryKS
Senior Master
And that thought is predicated on the belief that they should resist there natural urges. Which is applying a sense of morality that not everyone agrees on to the situation.
No one said that they should have sex, just that if they choose too, they can do so safely.
I'm not a parent, so I can only speak for how I was raised. My parents didn't try to 'protect' me from anything. Instead, they educated me, asnwered any questions about anything, and most importantly, educated me on the use of good old common sense. Of course, this lesson also contained examples from their own life experiences.
This thread isn't about me, so enough rambling on that.
I guess my point of view is...this is 2007. Kids are not dumb. Turn on the tv pretty much any time of day, and you'll see people kissing, in bed, hints of sex, etc. I'd rather have my child, if/when the time comes to have one, educated properly, than pretend teen sex doesnt happen.
Just my .02
grydth
Senior Master
Uh, folks..... girls in the 6th grade are generally 10 to 11 years old. That isn't sex at that age, but child molestation. (For reference, the age of legal consent is usually 16 to 17.) Handing out pills at age 11 isn't realism, but an acceptance of rape on a massive scale.
If I find anyone messing with my 9 or 12 year old daughters, they won't need pills, but instead bullet proof armor.
If I find anyone messing with my 9 or 12 year old daughters, they won't need pills, but instead bullet proof armor.
Yes, thats actually a very good point. Now, I suppose if two 12 yr olds had sex.....
Here is something that happened here in CT recently.
http://www.courant.com/news/local/hc-ctwhdsexbust1005.artoct05,0,84223.story
Obviously, the people in question here are older than someone in the 6th grade, however, I would not be fooled into thinking that 6th graders are not smoking, drinking or having sex. Against the law? Yes, everything I mentioned is against the law. Again, doesn't stop people though.
It's very rare that a year goes by in which at least one student at the middle school where I teach becomes pregnant (for those not familiar with middle school, that's grades 6-8, ages 11-14)... and the father is usually another student at the school. Does it happen? Yes. Can anything the school does stop it? No... at least, not once they're off the school grounds. Do their parents blame the school? Most definitely yes... as otherwise they'd have to blame themselves.
grydth
Senior Master
There's a major difference between providing sex education to an 11 year old girl and equipping her to do something she has no business doing.
I immediately signed my daughter up for the sex ed classes at school when she was 11. Both my ex wife (her mother) and my current wife also had long talks with her.... and I have spoken with her. I told her what some of those popular song lyrics really meant - and asked if that was all she thought she was worth? (NO WAY!). I told her how great a complete relationship between a man and a WOMAN (not a child) can be - and what some of the life consequences could be for her. How would she like to give up many of her dreams to do baby care 24/7.... and I've had her help some new moms with their infants - its great knowledge to have, but she doesn't need to be doing it at age 13. I told her about diseases, and the killer with AIDS who went around seducing young girls.... and asked if she'd like to be 16 and going to the prom, or dead being buried?
There's a reason why ages of consent are set at 17 - not just olde morality, but a serious understanding that an 11 year old girl isn't able to make a decision like that... anymore than she should be driving an SUV or drinking whiskey.
We need to protect and preserve their childhood. 25+ years in my line of work and you see examples of EVERYTHING - but that doesn't mean its okay. Rather than shrug my shoulders, I'll do what I have to to protect my children.
You want to debate kids just shy of 17 doing it, fine. But girls at 11 or 12, its just child molestation and rape. If we won't protect them, then what do we stand for? Any society that fails to protect its children will not survive and does not deserve to survive....and anyone I find molesting my girls will not survive.
I immediately signed my daughter up for the sex ed classes at school when she was 11. Both my ex wife (her mother) and my current wife also had long talks with her.... and I have spoken with her. I told her what some of those popular song lyrics really meant - and asked if that was all she thought she was worth? (NO WAY!). I told her how great a complete relationship between a man and a WOMAN (not a child) can be - and what some of the life consequences could be for her. How would she like to give up many of her dreams to do baby care 24/7.... and I've had her help some new moms with their infants - its great knowledge to have, but she doesn't need to be doing it at age 13. I told her about diseases, and the killer with AIDS who went around seducing young girls.... and asked if she'd like to be 16 and going to the prom, or dead being buried?
There's a reason why ages of consent are set at 17 - not just olde morality, but a serious understanding that an 11 year old girl isn't able to make a decision like that... anymore than she should be driving an SUV or drinking whiskey.
We need to protect and preserve their childhood. 25+ years in my line of work and you see examples of EVERYTHING - but that doesn't mean its okay. Rather than shrug my shoulders, I'll do what I have to to protect my children.
You want to debate kids just shy of 17 doing it, fine. But girls at 11 or 12, its just child molestation and rape. If we won't protect them, then what do we stand for? Any society that fails to protect its children will not survive and does not deserve to survive....and anyone I find molesting my girls will not survive.
This just frighten's me as I have a fifth grader. :erg:
KempoGuy06
Grandmaster
This is a terrible idea. All they are doing is sending the kids the message that it is ok for them to have sex. Im all for education on these topics at an early age but to actually hand out birth to middle school are you ****ing kidding me. Are they gonna hand out condoms and karma surta books to the boys?
Ok so that may have been a little harsh but seriously I under why kids need to be educated and like I said Im all for that but to actually give these girls these pills is just astounding. This shows a lack of interest in thE subject and makes me think that they have just given up
B
CoryKS
Senior Master
Given the number of teachers that have been arrested for having sex w/ students over the past few years, it may be that putting the kids on pills is just a matter of CYA.
Kennedy_Shogen_Ryu
Blue Belt
Add me to the list of people who is quite taken aback and disgusted at the idea of giving birth control to kids that are so young. I remember at that age, I was still of the thought that girls carried life threatening cooties! Whatever happened to that wonderful line of thought?
Cheers!
Cheers!
The pill does not prevent the spread of cooties. The pill should be combined with a barrier method to lower the risk of getting cooties.
I'm not sure what to think about this. I'm concerned that everthing I've ever known has been wrong.
No, it's giving them the ability to do so safely, if they choose too. The choice is still up to them, and will be influenced by there parents to some extent. But not giving them protection is kind of like not installing seat belts and air bags as a preventive measure to keep people from crashing IMO.
Kama Sutra books might not be a bad idea though, beats having them learn how to do it from porn
CoryKS
Senior Master
No, it's giving them the ability to do so safely, if they choose too. The choice is still up to them, and will be influenced by there parents to some extent. But not giving them protection is kind of like not installing seat belts and air bags as a preventive measure to keep people from crashing IMO.
Kama Sutra books might not be a bad idea though, beats having them learn how to do it from porn
Then why not take up a collection among those parents who wish to support this program? Further up the thread you derided the concept of "applying a sense of morality that not everyone agrees on to the situation." Why is this consideration not extended to those who are expected to pay for the program but may disagree with it on moral or other grounds?
I certainly see your point, and in no way am I advocating a young person to run out and have sex. Despite the laws, people are going to do what they want. There are laws against DUI and people get into their cars every day drunk. There are laws about illegal drugs, yet every day, there are people who engage in that activity. There are laws about minors buying alcohol, yet I'd bet every weekend, liquor stores have people who come in with fake IDs. Prostitution is illegal, yet I can drive to the downtown area of the city in which I work, and find a prostitute.
Again, my point is not to advocate a 13yo girl, running out, and having sex, but the fact remains that kids may do this, despite the talks, lectures, stats, etc. I don't think handing out pills is the answer, but condoms and sex ed classes instead.
Trust me, I'm the first one to have my blood boil when I see a young girl, probably still in school, pushing a baby carriage, thinking, "Yup, there is another kid I'm paying for!"
I just don't think people should assume it can't/won't happen to their child. Anything is possible.
Mike
- Thread Starter
- #39
For those who want to read the article rather than view the videoclip in the original post.
- Ceicei
- Ceicei
Arizona Angel
Master Black Belt
It's not very hard to get written parental permission without the parents knowledge. Not a good idea. I think it needs to be an in person deal.
