Yiliquan kung fu information as requested by Arnisador

[YiLiJingLei]

Hi, folks,
Just to chime in on a couple items: the Mural mentioned before on the walls of the northern Shaolin monastary depicts Buddhist martial monks from India in some kind of historic diplomatic visit to the Shaolin temple, I can't remember the details, but I think it was painted about 300 or 400 years ago (?)...Hopefully someone with a better memory can clarify this for me.
The Shaolin Temple itself was built in 495 CE/AD. 25 years later, DaMo visited the Shaolin Temple on Song Shan in 520 AD/CE. Martial Arts in China already had a colourful history a few thousand years old by then, with great systematic diversity between military & civilian martial arts practice, before the Shaolin Temple was even built. And the Monks at Shaolin were practicing Yoga & Martial Arts before DaMo/BodiDharma's arrival. No doubt the temple was a pivotal point to the development of martial arts in China and therefore the rest of Asia afterwards, but it is not the historical "birthplace of Kung Fu".
A great resource is Professor Kang Ge Wu's "Spring & Autumn of Chinese Martial Arts-5,000 Years".
I hope this information is useful and productive to the discussion at hand. Best Wishes, all.

 

[Matt Stone]

Originally posted by theneuhauser

your post was rather rude.

No, that wasn't rude. It was sarcastic disbelief. It just came off as rude... I apologize, sincerely. :asian: Normally I re-read my posts before sending them off, and I didn't this time. Next time, cooler heads will prevail. Please accept my apologies...

i still dont believe the theory that monks only used body guards that used their kung fu (wushu whatever).

And the wonderful thing is that you have every right to do so. Feel free. It really matters not one bit whether you agree with me or not. I shouldn't have gotten my panties in such a knot over what someone else thinks. You are entitled to your opinion, no matter how wrong I think it is! Seriously, though, no worries...

if you are from japan, then i will give you some cultural slack...

Nope, born and bred American from Nebraska. But thanks for asking.

however here is the way things are:...

you are telling me that the monks of shaolin practiced martial arts all day, but never raised a hand in self defense? be realistic.

I am, thanks for asking.

if you are not open to that possibility, then maybe it is you, sir that is ignorant. open your mind.

My mind is wide open, thanks. I don't deny that there is every possiblity, and likely (if they did half as much martial training as they are reported to have done) that once or twice they did get into a scuffle. However, I really doubt that they were a mini-martial arts army.

from where do you get the omniscient gift of undisputable knowledge? i would like to have one of those.

JC Penny. $3.99. Seriously, I am far from omniscient. You want to know what Shaolin was like 300 years ago? Ask a 300 year old Shaolin monk. Past that, we are unlikely to get a factual answer... I draw my conclusions from what I have read (and read into), as well as cross cultural similarities between Buddhist practice in China and Japan.

then what do we really have to go on except the fact that shaolin was a mecca for the early development of martial arts, and as a result of the permanent residents there, that happened to be monks and martial artists, it was allowed to develop and spread.

There is that nasty word "fact" again. It isn't a fact that Shaolin was a mecca for the development for martial arts. And we have little to go on other than the rewritten and exaggerated histories passed down from good teachers to good students and questionable teachers to gullible students...

its not as easy as generalizing that buddhist monks are pacifists and therefore they do not fight. it would be easily justified in the face of danger to their temple.

Actually, it is easy to make that generalization, since there have been many cases in which Buddhist monks refused to raise a hand in their own defense. :boxing: And the ends do not always justify the means, especially when it is a spiritual issue at hand... :angel:

i agree with you that there are western misconceptions about this "martial history".
just because there are other truths, cannot change what shaolin is to martial arts. which is: immensely influential.

On this point, at least, we agree fully. The temple did have a large impact, for good or ill, on Chinese martial arts.

you are probably more qualified to speak on the subject than am I.

Not hardly. I am no more qualified to do anything than anyone else. Just stating my opinions, occassionally a bit too forcefully...

Gomen nasai...