What is Meditation?
- Thread starter ShotoJon
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Indagator
Blue Belt
Different traditions have developed different forms of meditation, for example if one attends a 5-day (or if you're able, the full 40 day) Ignatian retreat one will experience Catholic meditation. Also the rosary has meditations attached and there are many other meditations as part of the Catholic spiritual life (although I cannot speak for those who follow the post-Vatican II version of the religion as it has stripped a lot of that sort of thing out).
This kind of meditation has many similarities to the other forms of meditation that you will find, however it is typical to meditate on something. So rather than clear my mind entirely and pursue emptiness, I clear my mind of all but one concept or thought, and meditate on it - the usage of the word comes from the Latin meditare (also declined as meditatio).
Just thought it could be helpful to the thread to share this, so hope it's informative!
This kind of meditation has many similarities to the other forms of meditation that you will find, however it is typical to meditate on something. So rather than clear my mind entirely and pursue emptiness, I clear my mind of all but one concept or thought, and meditate on it - the usage of the word comes from the Latin meditare (also declined as meditatio).
Just thought it could be helpful to the thread to share this, so hope it's informative!
Jesuits are still regarded unfavourably by some, yes? No matter, I still regard Jesuit meditative and spiritual practices as having a sound martial background. In the context of this thread, that is an interesting tangent and post. Thank you. Jenna.Different traditions have developed different forms of meditation, for example if one attends a 5-day (or if you're able, the full 40 day) Ignatian retreat one will experience Catholic meditation. Also the rosary has meditations attached and there are many other meditations as part of the Catholic spiritual life (although I cannot speak for those who follow the post-Vatican II version of the religion as it has stripped a lot of that sort of thing out).
This kind of meditation has many similarities to the other forms of meditation that you will find, however it is typical to meditate on something. So rather than clear my mind entirely and pursue emptiness, I clear my mind of all but one concept or thought, and meditate on it - the usage of the word comes from the Latin meditare (also declined as meditatio).
Just thought it could be helpful to the thread to share this, so hope it's informative!
Indagator
Blue Belt
Hi Jenna,
I read your post not long before I retired for the evening yesterday and then spent most of the workday thinking about how I have steered you wrong a bit there! I will try to explain what I was meaning to say a little better:
Jesuits are not the only Order that practise meditation, for the record. I simply used the example of the Ignatian retreats as they are heavily meditation focused. Other examples could be someting like St Alphonsus de Ligouri's "Eternal Maxims", or the meditations in St Francis de Sales' "Introduction to the Devout Life" both of which I highly recommend to anybody who is interested.
All Orders, and in the past (and today still, amongst traditional Catholics - as in Tridentine observance - although I have no idea about conciliar Catholics) the majority of the laity also practise regular meditations as an integral part of their spiritual life.
As I mentioned, the correct way to recite the Rosary is to meditate on the mysteries as one prays.
Contemplative Orders, especially cloistered Orders, such as the Carmelites or Carthusians practise a far greater amount of meditation in comparison to active Orders such as the Jesuits.
Hopefully I came across a bit better here lol.
I read your post not long before I retired for the evening yesterday and then spent most of the workday thinking about how I have steered you wrong a bit there! I will try to explain what I was meaning to say a little better:
Jesuits are not the only Order that practise meditation, for the record. I simply used the example of the Ignatian retreats as they are heavily meditation focused. Other examples could be someting like St Alphonsus de Ligouri's "Eternal Maxims", or the meditations in St Francis de Sales' "Introduction to the Devout Life" both of which I highly recommend to anybody who is interested.
All Orders, and in the past (and today still, amongst traditional Catholics - as in Tridentine observance - although I have no idea about conciliar Catholics) the majority of the laity also practise regular meditations as an integral part of their spiritual life.
As I mentioned, the correct way to recite the Rosary is to meditate on the mysteries as one prays.
Contemplative Orders, especially cloistered Orders, such as the Carmelites or Carthusians practise a far greater amount of meditation in comparison to active Orders such as the Jesuits.
Hopefully I came across a bit better here lol.
Thank you for this information! I am not Catholic and but I was drawn to Jesuits initially by negatives and but I appreciated researching Ignatius' military position and the kind of rigorous spirituality that this inspired. I think many martial artists would do well to make their own researches into the Society of Jesus irrespective of their religious standing. As for the others, I appreciate you bringing them to light. It is good to come here and learn something on occasion. Thank you so much. Jenna.
OwlMatt
White Belt
I think there is a lot of misinformation about meditation out there. A lot of people seem to think meditation is all about mentally disappearing into another realm. The experience I have with Buddhist-style meditation is the exact opposite: when we meditate, we are cultivating mindfulness and awareness, trying to be full present in the now.
senseishane
White Belt
Great comments. Yes, to me, meditation is a way to "center myself". It allows me to relax, focus on the most simple aspect of life (breathing), and to get back into balance. Life has a way of throwing us LOTS of "curves". I guess also, on the spiritual side, it allows me to be still and listen to what I hear in my heart. I try to meditate everyday (morning and night) for a short period of time (5-15 minutes) just to regain the positive thoughts, feelings, goals, ideas, and sense of who I am.
Just my .02 - there have been volumes of books written on this topic by some very brilliant people. I guess for me the method is in the pratice and experienced through the effort. You learn what works well for you, what does not, etc.
/cheers
Just my .02 - there have been volumes of books written on this topic by some very brilliant people. I guess for me the method is in the pratice and experienced through the effort. You learn what works well for you, what does not, etc.
/cheers
You are right indeed. Most of the meditative portion of catholicism has been removed. For a while even meditating for the Eucharistic adoration was seen as "weird" and "medieval". That is why new churches are removing any meditative symbol and sometimes they even move the tabernacle to the side.
Meditation is incredibly important for Catholics. Even a prayer such the Our Father or the Hail Mary should be meditated as much as possible. The Liturgy of the hours should be a meditative tool. However now "community" is preferred and the community of saints and its importance is often forgotten. At least the Creed was changed last week from first plural person ("We believe") to first singular person ("I believe"), slightly enhancing the personal predisposition (and meditation) and reminding the fact that it's the communion of saints that really makes the community ( single --> community of saints --> community of ppl on earth) and not the opposite (community of ppl on earth --> community of saints --> single individual),
Indagator
Blue Belt
With the SSPX there isn't really the LOTH but they still have the Divine Office (for laity usually it's the Little Office of the Blessed Virgin Mary - which I myself have been known to spend time on!)
I find your post quite insightful as it describes a Catholic viewpoint which Traditional Catholics such as myself do not often get to see, and also you have some very good advice to offer!
Pax Domini sit semper tecum, frater!
Ah! The Divinum Ufficium, so beautiful. It’s a pity that it is not really taught to the laity as it should be. Well, the Mass itself is not thought so it should not be a surprise that people look at you as a weird person if you name the Ufficium (actually, even the LOTH). You brought up a very important point when you claimed that the Council reinvented the religion. Of course it would be crazy to think that before Paul VI everything was OK and after him everything became a mess, but the Council is for sure the official seal of the “new” religion, even thou the Council itself is non dogmatic. Before the age of Paul VI the church was already in turmoil, Marxism had penetrated the sacred palaces, weird ideologies were around. If memory doesn’t fail me, the ideas of Teillhard de Chardin were gaining more and more popularity (and now even the pope quotes his cosmicism based on the God-is-the-universe thing). During the reign of Leo XIII several Catholics attended “ecumenical” congresses, including that of Chicago in 1893, organized by the Theosophical Society, with the blessing of Leo XIII himself! For us, there is nothing to despair, we had a traitor (and inside trader) since the first day and the remaining eleven, but one, were not really there with Him at His last moment on the cross. That doesn’t mean of course that we have to say, as many papists do, that “everything is allright”, that “this is the design of God”, thus putting the brain in a blender. I believe that God gave us the brain in order to use it, so in all humility I try to. Why did I write this premise? Because that of ‘meditation’ is of the uttermost importance for our religion and we are leaving this concept behind. Ideally, the mass itself is designed such that the faithful is allowed to meditate about His mystery right before receiving Him with the sacrament of the Eucharist. The readings, the homily, the prayers, the incense etc. should not be seen merely as a ritual: they serve a purpose and that purpose is to help the faithful to concentrate on the supernatural root of the Sacrifice. Unfortunately the new liturgy, as designed by Bugnini, is just a “one hour all together” therapy session in which we say that everything is cool because He wants to. This causes huge problems in several areas, including doctrine. It’s not a random fact that (saint) Lefebvre was so focused on doctrine. It was not only a matter of saying the mass in a Latin rather than English. But everything ends up to the meditative process of the mass, which is nothing else than the personal relationship between us and Christ. Today’s world is even less helpful for meditation than it used to be due to the media, the videogames, the internet etc. Of course those things are not bad in themselves but they are a constant distraction for higher purposes. The real problem is that we are not trained in looking at higher purposes anymore so the idea of understanding a mass sounds crazy. The idea that bread can substantially become His body and blood sounds superstition. The mass should allow this higher level meditation, thus this relationship, and bring it to a higher level, which the person alone can’t do without the help of a higher being (God, saints, angels). Meditation is way too important to be left behind, everything depends on it. If we do not meditate His mystery, then for us the bread will only be bread even if it is His body.
Pax et bonum.
Pax et bonum.
I've found meditation, for me, to be a number of things, and all ultimately about growing the self. I have found meditation in contemplation, where I consider the deepest matters which concern me, to it being absolute stillness in mind, most usually when executing a technique.
I've found that it's the culmination of self-realization with simultaneous self-release, and it's only in this state one truly finds perfection in their respective art. No thought wins... because it transcends air, matter, everything.
Meditation can be done sitting quietly, or while one is actively being. When one can meditate through any task, I have heard that to be considered mastery.
Or maybe it's just mastery of self.
time will tell, ultimately, and if one can incorporate it into one's activeness in martial arts. It isn't integral, but it is what will help you grow to your highest echelon's of ability.
I've found that it's the culmination of self-realization with simultaneous self-release, and it's only in this state one truly finds perfection in their respective art. No thought wins... because it transcends air, matter, everything.
Meditation can be done sitting quietly, or while one is actively being. When one can meditate through any task, I have heard that to be considered mastery.
Or maybe it's just mastery of self.
time will tell, ultimately, and if one can incorporate it into one's activeness in martial arts. It isn't integral, but it is what will help you grow to your highest echelon's of ability.
Janina
Yellow Belt
Ive seen pictures of people meditating but never quite understood the purpose or how its done. is it simply a way to relax the mind and body? or is there more to it? should i focus on something or nothing at all? a little advice please and thank you
Cause I am a Zen Instructor in Soto sect of Zen-Buddhist tradition, I will take my stance on this question and open little what we mean when we talk about meditation. In our tradition the main practice is called Zazen. Japanese translation of Chinese Chan which is similar to term Dhyana of Sanskrit origin (meaning meditation). In Zazen the main purpose is to let go of all your attachments to thought constructions and thinking. It is not,like many seem to falsely think, emptying ones mind from all thinking but rather the way to let go of your emotions and thoughts by letting them come and go. Practicing thus way gives you possibility to loose off and let your ego go experiencing the reality from moment to moment as it is.
Zen tradition which I teach and instruct has it´s main focus in reality. We don´t try to reach any mystical light shows or get our minds enlightened, but simply sit on it and let go.
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