Kapap versus Krav Maga

righttack77

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Hi Everyone,

I am very new to the boards here, and I am also new to the world of martial arts (other than dabbling a bit in beginner Karate). I just spent the last couple of days taking one-on-one Kapap classes with an instructor and I really enjoy them, although it is quite expensive.

I have been looking into an alternative which was taking Krav Maga classes at a local gym. The classes are longer (2hrs per class versus 1hr per private session with my Kapap instructor) and they seem to be taught by very credible instructors. The classes are also much cheaper ($20 per class versus $40 per private lesson). From a value for money perspective it would seem to me that the classes are a better bet. However, I have a job which requires me to often work long hours, and I'm concerned that I just won't have the time to make it to class, and therefore, I'd prefer of having the flexibility of arranging a private lesson when it suits me.

However, I've been told by my Kapap instructor (who also has taken many years of Krav Maga) that Kapap is a bit better to learn because it is slightly more developed than Krav Maga (he mentioned that Krav Maga is basically a simplified version of Kapap).

I'd like to hear your advice on the following:

1. Is it really worthwhile taking private one-on-one training (ie. do you tend to learn more), or is generally better to go for the class route?
2. Is it better (from the perspective of a beginner) to learn (i) Krav Maga or (ii) Kapap and is there actually a difference between the two?

Thanks!
 

MJS

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Hi Everyone,

I am very new to the boards here, and I am also new to the world of martial arts (other than dabbling a bit in beginner Karate). I just spent the last couple of days taking one-on-one Kapap classes with an instructor and I really enjoy them, although it is quite expensive.

I have been looking into an alternative which was taking Krav Maga classes at a local gym. The classes are longer (2hrs per class versus 1hr per private session with my Kapap instructor) and they seem to be taught by very credible instructors. The classes are also much cheaper ($20 per class versus $40 per private lesson). From a value for money perspective it would seem to me that the classes are a better bet. However, I have a job which requires me to often work long hours, and I'm concerned that I just won't have the time to make it to class, and therefore, I'd prefer of having the flexibility of arranging a private lesson when it suits me.

However, I've been told by my Kapap instructor (who also has taken many years of Krav Maga) that Kapap is a bit better to learn because it is slightly more developed than Krav Maga (he mentioned that Krav Maga is basically a simplified version of Kapap).

I'd like to hear your advice on the following:

1. Is it really worthwhile taking private one-on-one training (ie. do you tend to learn more), or is generally better to go for the class route?
2. Is it better (from the perspective of a beginner) to learn (i) Krav Maga or (ii) Kapap and is there actually a difference between the two?

Thanks!

Welcome to Martial Talk! :)

As for your questions...ultimately its you that has to decide what fits your schedule better. If you don't think you'll have time to make it to that many Krav Maga classes, then stick with the private lessons. Have you looked into taking private Krav Maga lessons in addition to the classes? Howmany KM classes are offered a week? How many will you be able to attend?

As for whats better...everyone will have their own preference. Of course, an instructor is going to tell you that Kapap is better. Do they really want to lose you as a student? Now, I'm not saying one is better than the other. I'm more familiar with KM than the other. From the little that I've read about Kapap, it sounds like its not that different from KM.

Good luck in your decision. :)

Mike
 
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righttack77

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Thanks Mike

I did some reflecting over the past couple of days. I've decided to stick to the private Kapap lessons for now, simply because I know that if I don't have the flexibility of private lessons, I won't go to the classes.

Thanks for your insight.
 

MJS

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Thanks Mike

I did some reflecting over the past couple of days. I've decided to stick to the private Kapap lessons for now, simply because I know that if I don't have the flexibility of private lessons, I won't go to the classes.

Thanks for your insight.

Glad I could help. :) Private lessons are great, as they'll give you the chance to focus on pretty much any area you want. Are group classes in Kapap an option for you? If so, you may want to look into taking at least one to supplement your private lesson.

Mike
 

Yaagil

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Hi, I'm a Kapap and Krav Maga instructor. It's even confusing to me :)

When in Europe (like now) I sometimes visit Krav Maga schools and I sometimes see a kind of Tae Bo instead of KM. Clearly teached by fitness instructors. I don't know what the situation is in the US but those fitness guys are killing Krav Maga.

On the other hand, I've never seen Kapap being raped like that.
 

Spork3245

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KAPAP teaches devastating things like the "touch of death". Clearly it's better... wait, I just remembered it's just BS and it doesn't work. :p
Go ask any Golani IDF agent what they trained in for hand-to-hand, they will tell you "Krav Maga", not KAPAP like the official US KAPAP website will lie to you about.
Now, to say which is "better" depends upon which "association" the Krav Maga school you are looking at is affiliated with. If it's a Commando Krav Maga school, I will warn you to stay far away from it. If it's a World Wide school (KMAA), or IKMF school (Israeli Krav Maga Federation) it's up in the air and depends on the instructor. If it's a IKMA/Alan Feldman/Rick Blitstein school, I can promise you that it will destroy whatever KAPAP kool-aid that instructor is selling you.

-This message is brought to you bought the worlds biggest KAPAP hater on the planet. ;)
 

TheArtofDave

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Actually "Kapap" was around in the 30's to almost the 50's when it was desanctioned, and Krav Maga took its place. I did some research.

My guess its was more foundation, and not very effective like Krav Maga has turned out to be. And so let me be clear on this that Kapap no longer exists, and the only thing that is recognized is Krav Maga.

As for somebody teaching out dated material that no longer exists or is effective that's another story completely. Maybe Rick Tew would be happy for the guy lol
 

drop bear

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I am not sure how you even have a linage war on what is basically two hybrids anyway.

Both styles depending on the instructor will either be crap or good. Rather than being dependant on the system.
 

Justin Chang

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Hi Everyone,

I am very new to the boards here, and I am also new to the world of martial arts (other than dabbling a bit in beginner Karate). I just spent the last couple of days taking one-on-one Kapap classes with an instructor and I really enjoy them, although it is quite expensive.

I have been looking into an alternative which was taking Krav Maga classes at a local gym. The classes are longer (2hrs per class versus 1hr per private session with my Kapap instructor) and they seem to be taught by very credible instructors. The classes are also much cheaper ($20 per class versus $40 per private lesson). From a value for money perspective it would seem to me that the classes are a better bet. However, I have a job which requires me to often work long hours, and I'm concerned that I just won't have the time to make it to class, and therefore, I'd prefer of having the flexibility of arranging a private lesson when it suits me.

However, I've been told by my Kapap instructor (who also has taken many years of Krav Maga) that Kapap is a bit better to learn because it is slightly more developed than Krav Maga (he mentioned that Krav Maga is basically a simplified version of Kapap).

I'd like to hear your advice on the following:

1. Is it really worthwhile taking private one-on-one training (ie. do you tend to learn more), or is generally better to go for the class route?
2. Is it better (from the perspective of a beginner) to learn (i) Krav Maga or (ii) Kapap and is there actually a difference between the two?

Thanks!


Hello,

It is my understanding that KAPAP is actually the predicessor to Krav Maga. It was explained to me that KAPAP derrived from multiple fighting arts before Isreal was known as Isreal and is always evolving. Krav Maga is a little more attached to their techniques and is more of a set martial art and was origionally a quick and dirty way to train the military (and very effective). Krav Maga is a fighting style, KAPAP is a way, KAPAP is different for everyone who takes it, some techniques work better for some people, some styles are better suited for some more than others. KAPAP is a bridge between styles not a style of its own. You can be a practitioner of Karate and study KAPAP at the same time, or Kung Fu, or Kali, or anything or all of them. KAPAP is really a group of diverse fighters, martial artists, teachers, and students who all come together to share their knowledge and learn from each other and it isn't limited to the physical aspects of Martial Arts and survival, you could learn wilderness survival and it is KAPAP, learn prepping skills and it is KAPAP.
 

anunnaki

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Hello.
It's an old thread but anyway... Krav Maga and KAPAP are the same think. KAPAP is Israeli Krav Maga.
In this two I prefer KAPAP, but of all martial arts I defenitely prefer Kempo Arnis. I trained almost everything but I stopped here.

Kempo Arnis is "The Mother Of All" and a concise, highly effective method of self defense that teaches practical application of Ryukyu kempo, Modern arnis and KAPAP-Krav Maga. It is used also in special forces.



Check out this instructors:
- Borut Kincl (Kempo Arnis Federation),
- Avi Nardia (KAPAP),
- Patrick Mccarthy (Ryukyu Kempo),
- Ken Smith (Modern Arnis).

;-)
 

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Martial D

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I am not sure how you even have a linage war on what is basically two hybrids anyway.

Both styles depending on the instructor will either be crap or good. Rather than being dependant on the system.
What system isn't a hybrid?
 

z0rr007

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Hello.
It's an old thread but anyway... Krav Maga and KAPAP are the same think. KAPAP is Israeli Krav Maga.
In this two I prefer KAPAP, but of all martial arts I defenitely prefer Kempo Arnis. I trained almost everything but I stopped here.

Kempo Arnis is "The Mother Of All" and a concise, highly effective method of self defense that teaches practical application of Ryukyu kempo, Modern arnis and KAPAP-Krav Maga. It is used also in special forces.



Check out this instructors:
- Borut Kincl (Kempo Arnis Federation),
- Avi Nardia (KAPAP),
- Patrick Mccarthy (Ryukyu Kempo),
- Ken Smith (Modern Arnis).

;-)
Yes, it's true. It's the mother of all these threes. I recommend this martial art to all of you!
 

Martial D

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I dont know. A system that is old enough to have a linage I suppose.
A lineage just means a few people have taught it already. It only takes a couple generations. Look at all the jkd and BJJ lineages already.

But even thing like Wing Chun and Taekwondo were synthesized from other systems.
 

Kababayan

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Hi, I'm a Kapap and Krav Maga instructor. It's even confusing to me :)

When in Europe (like now) I sometimes visit Krav Maga schools and I sometimes see a kind of Tae Bo instead of KM. Clearly teached by fitness instructors. I don't know what the situation is in the US but those fitness guys are killing Krav Maga.

On the other hand, I've never seen Kapap being raped like that.


Sorry...old thread but I felt like responding anyway. The "Tae Bo" Krav is happening a lot here in the US too.
 

Kababayan

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You just generalised the whole Krav Maga soci禱ty of Europe congrats on that.

I have always been curious about the Krav off-shoots that have spread through Europe, and where they came from. I guess I could just research it. I only really know about the US through Darren Levine (my instructor's instructor) and Gabi Noah (my other instructor's instructor). With Krav being a fairly new system of self defense it should be easy to trace an instructor back to Imi Lichtenfeld.
 
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