Discussion in 'Wing Chun' started by Bino TWT, Feb 11, 2018.
Training the practical applications of IRAS / Yee Jee Kim Yeung Ma...
Is there supposed to be a video here? It seems to be a picture of you and your dogs. (edit - goats?)
Here is another usage.
Hey Bino, did anybody ever find out if the acronymn IRAS or Internal Rotation Adduction Stance works the same in German as English? I suppose it should ...seeing as this term originated with the EWTO (German) Branch of WT.
I tried google translate and variously came up with Interne Rototation Adduktion Haltung, or Interne Adduktion Rotationsposition, or finally Interne Rotation Adduction Stehen (which could work) ....but I have no idea if any of these actually make sense! ...It's almost like there's never a German speaker around when you need 'em!
Meanwhile, I just call it "Character Two" stance, as Sifu Leung did, coming from the Yee Gee in YGKYM.
No video, just a pic of me in my Yee Jee Kim Yeung Ma; Character Two Goat Clamping Stance.
Probably the first time you've actually seen the stance used for what it's named after, huh? lmao
I actually know a few old school EWTO German guys. I'll ask them when I talk to them. You have me curious now as well lol.
The English term IRAS did not originate in Germany, it was Leung Ting's English term for "Yi Zhi Kim Yeung Ma".
You will see that he uses this term in his books and videos.
I'll check that out. I have a lot of his books. I've never seen the IRAS name used in a non-EWTO release though. The IWTA (Hong Kong Wing Tsun) side of the lineage doesn't use that term.
He is also using it in his videos, if I ak not mistaken.
Given how YZkYM translates, IRAS might be a far better English term to use.
I agree with the acronym over the translation lol. Any links to vids? I've never seen it in one that wasn't an EWTO sponsored vid.
Authentic Wing Tsun and Dynamic Wing Tsun, the companion videos to the books by the same names.
Update: i was wrong in Authentic Wing Tsun he calls it
character two adduction stance
same for Dynamic Wing Chun...
I found out my mistake: I checked the German edition of Leung Ting's books.
Lol that'll do it!
It can be a bit confusing keeping track of those things...
Different language editions and some inconsistency when it comes to terms used, make it quite a challenge to keep things clear.
Also, certain omissions, modifications and addendums make it even less transparent.
I remember that some things have been left out from "Authentic Wing Tsun" in its German incarnation, with a chapter being added by Sifu Kernspecht (his "Lat Sao" aka "Paak Sau Spiel).
Also, certain Terminology was modified in the German version of "Dynamic Wing Tsun" as well as having all the pics replaced with new shots featuring the top guys in his EWTO at the time.
Thanks for the perspective. I have never seen the German editions of those books.
I trained with LT in the states back in the 80s, before the Germans started coming over here and LT never used the term IRAS. Also, his Lat Sau was very simple and unlike what the EWTO versions.
Later, some EWTO guys, most notably Emin Boztepe, came over here and introduced some of the EWTO curriculum, and the guy I currently train with, my si-dai under LT, went to Germany when he was in the USAF and learned the German curriculum.
Sorry to hear that the EWTO changed the pics in the European edition of Dynamic Wing Tsun. I was in the original version!
Well, from a sales point of view it was a smart move of Sifu Kernspecht to have all his current (at the time) top people featured in the book. In this way all the students could see pictures of their respective masters/sifus which might entice a loyal and dedicated student to purchase the book...
Leung Ting himself put out a new version of Dynamic Wing Tsun more than 10 years ago, I believe some pics had been changed as well. I would have to check, to be sure, though.
Leung Ting's Lat Sau is basically five "attacking hands" implementing what the Chinese call "zin faat zhai yan" (taking initiative/preemptive attacking) and has nothing to do with Keith Kernspecht's "Lat Sao", which surved as a surrogate for sparring.
Leung Ting is not exactly a fan of KK's creation, to put it mildly...
oh. Hah. I didn't even notice you were in WC stance.
Yep. In private, Sifu (Leung Ting) used to refer to the "German lat sau" as "Some funny movements..." and would make critical remarks about people who thought they were "very clever" making things up. And that was in the 80s. I believe the conceptual rift between the EWTO and Hong Kong versions of WT has only grown wider over the years.
On the other hand, in our program we use a lat sau program based on the EWTO model and, although at first I had doubts (coming from LT's camp), now I have come to see it as a very useful way of training.
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