The Essence of your kung fu

Discussion in 'Chinese Martial Arts - General' started by DaveB, Jul 25, 2017.

  1. hoshin1600

    hoshin1600 Senior Master

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    i think the name can be irrelevant to translate. its like saying oinking pig,, some will argue a pink doesnt oink it snorts.
     
  2. DaveB

    DaveB 3rd Black Belt

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    That's a great description. Some of the bak mei videos I've seen are very reminiscent of the Tiger-crane I've done.
     
  3. DaveB

    DaveB 3rd Black Belt

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    I found this great instructional video on Fijian White Crane. It's interesting to observe what my styles founder thought was worth keeping as well as the parallels with wing chun.

     
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  4. VPT

    VPT Green Belt

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    Pretty darn good video, judging by the sections I had a glimpse on. You could actually learn and practice a whole lot of stuff from there. However, the video is mistitled. This is not Yongchun Baihe or 12 Sections Power (or I did not see they perform that form), this is actually Wing Chun.
     
  5. VPT

    VPT Green Belt

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    Ah-ha, I got some tiger-crane footage in my hands. Seems like general Fujian/Hokkien material to me, not necessarily so much Hakka-ish...
     
  6. hoshin1600

    hoshin1600 Senior Master

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    this is Yong Chun white crane.

     
  7. hoshin1600

    hoshin1600 Senior Master

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    there are many variations of fujian crane and tiger/ crane styles. there are fujian styles that were not even officially named. from what i understand they were just "local" styles that sometimes borrowed a popular name like white crane.
     
  8. VPT

    VPT Green Belt

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    Personally I am aware of at least following crane styles of Fujian ancestry: Yongchun white crane, singing crane, feeding crane, flying crane, shaking crane/ancestral crane (apparently same style, former is Taiwan lineage, latter mainland Chinese), monkey crane, Great-Ancestor-turned-crane and Arhat-turned-crane. This tiger-crane seems like on of such hybrid styles. I see some Taizu/Wuzuquan influence (or similar) as well...

     
  9. DaveB

    DaveB 3rd Black Belt

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    Interesting, there are a lot of differences to the wing chun I've seen. Are you able to understand the Chinese or do you just recognise the style in the video?

    I expect FWC to resemble the wing chun as I'm led to believe that the crane in wing chun is literally chopped down FWC.
     
  10. VPT

    VPT Green Belt

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    I read Chinese well enough to confirm that the video is titled "Yongchunquan", "Wing Chun Kyun" in Cantonese. I'm gonna take a better look at that clip tonight, but I can't see any mentions of cranes anywhere. In the meantime, here's a form from Baihe you might appreciate: The Twelve Sections Power form, that was in the title of the Wing Chun video:



    Performer is Lei Kong, the famous Crane teacher from Hong Kong. Interestingly, this shares many, many similarities with the Tensho form of Goju-ryu karate. It was introduced to the style after the style founder Chojun Miyagi returned from his martial arts study trip to China (after his previous master in Okinawa having passed away). He claims the form as his own invention. So there might be a link between Baihe and Tensho, like him having seen it or someone having learned some baihe and taught his version to Miyagi, or whatever. Direct contact with Yongchun Baihe is not necessary by any means.
     
  11. DaveB

    DaveB 3rd Black Belt

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    Thanks for the correction. That style of wing chun looks to have covered some of the concerns people had about its more commonly seen sibling, like use of circular strikes and covering distance.
     
  12. VPT

    VPT Green Belt

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    Ah-hah, this seems to be solved. It seems that DaveB's video is official Chinese government-designed "wushu-Wing Chun". Didn't know that existed. Looks like they've scrapped the old forms, made six levels into it that can be performed both as an individual and paired forms... and added Nike sports wear.
     
  13. hoshin1600

    hoshin1600 Senior Master

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    not the first time the Chinese government had a controlling hand in martial arts. seems to be a constant reoccurring theme.
     
  14. DaveB

    DaveB 3rd Black Belt

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    Sinister yet awesome.
     
  15. Nobody Important

    Nobody Important 2nd Black Belt

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    Omei Crane is legit. Just another name for Tibetan White Crane, generally in reference to village versions which are mixed with another art like Pak Mei, Wing Chun etc. Woo Ching's version would technically be considered an Omei derivitive. As a term it became popular with the Shaolin Do people who attached the label to their "version" of white crane and the history of crane being developed in the west, it definitely isn't the same.
     
    Last edited: Aug 18, 2017
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  16. VPT

    VPT Green Belt

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    In all honesty, I don't believe in the existence of any genuine "Emei/Omei/Ngomei Bak Mei" - as a hybrid of White Crane and BM, at least. Everything that is Bak Mei comes eventually from CLC post-1920s. If there was such a thing, it would be a very recent creation.
     
  17. Nobody Important

    Nobody Important 2nd Black Belt

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    At 10 second mark it says Yongchun Quan Bai He (Wing Chun Kuen Baak Hok). Though, from what I seen in the clip I would have to agree it appears to be Wing Chun. Some mainland branches do consider themselves to be a derivative of White Crane.

    Lee Kong's White Crane is technically 5 Ancestor Fist White Crane (Yongchun Wuzu Quan). It is 5 Ancestor Fist that focuses on Yongchun Crane to a greater extent than the monkey, tiger, luohan & Tai Zu material.
     
  18. Nobody Important

    Nobody Important 2nd Black Belt

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    Correct, the villages around Lau Fu mountain mixed CLC' Pak Mei and other arts with Tibetan Crane back in the 40s & 50s. The Emei (Omei) designation was attributed due to the proximity to the temple and the Tibetan White Crane & Pak Mei oral legends associated with the temple, not necessarily actual real history.
     
  19. VPT

    VPT Green Belt

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    Sorry, but I find it hard to believe that. I am not aware of any extant Bak Mei lineage that far in the east. CLC is from Huiyang District in Huizhou, which is close to Mt. Luofu. However, he only started teaching Bak Mei in Guangzhou prior moving to HK and none of his students seem to have ever ventured that far out. (He was also very strict about not letting others teach his art. He was a greedy individual.) I think my teacher would know about it if there were.
     
  20. VPT

    VPT Green Belt

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    Are you, by any chance, talking about the stuff that Doo Wai teaches?
     

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