Some of you are getting ridiculous.

[streetwise]

For years the bickering and "lineage" feuds in Wing Chun made them the joke of the CMA community. Many people seem determined to put Modern Arnis above them on the "collection of fools" list in the general MA world.
I have worked with people from 5 diferent WC organizations, and I got something from all of them. I have trained with folks from a baker's dozen of FMA groups, and all but one had something to teach, and even the one was a type of learning experience. What someone calls their group, or the head of their group, is not only meaningless, it is no business of anyone from outside that group.
I know Jeff Delaney personally, and he is a very good teacher. I know what GM Presas said about him, to me, in private. And I know what he said about some of the other "system leaders" in MA. I won't repeat the bad things he said about some, since they MEAN NOTHING. I will say that he spoke very highly of Jeff, and that Jeff speaks highly of many of the folks who seem obsessed with talking bad about him, since the GM's death. Train, practice, and above all have fun (since, hopefully, you will have far more days without a stick fight, than you wil have days with one!). Who really cares about the politics!

And before any more internet challenges are slung around, I will train with anyone, but offers to come and show me whose paperwork is more legit, will be met with the laughter they deserve.

 

[Phil Elmore]

How To Win Friends And Influence People

 

[streetwise]

Ha, an excellent book! Let me add, that I am not even a member of ANY of the Modern Arnis groups, and while I practica FMA as part of my training, I really do not train in Modern Arnis, as a system.

 

[Rich Parsons]

Originally posted by streetwise
For years the bickering and "lineage" feuds in Wing Chun made them the joke of the CMA community. Many people seem determined to put Modern Arnis above them on the "collection of fools" list in the general MA world.
I have worked with people from 5 diferent WC organizations, and I got something from all of them. I have trained with folks from a baker's dozen of FMA groups, and all but one had something to teach, and even the one was a type of learning experience. What someone calls their group, or the head of their group, is not only meaningless, it is no business of anyone from outside that group.
I know Jeff Delaney personally, and he is a very good teacher. I know what GM Presas said about him, to me, in private. And I know what he said about some of the other "system leaders" in MA. I won't repeat the bad things he said about some, since they MEAN NOTHING. I will say that he spoke very highly of Jeff, and that Jeff speaks highly of many of the folks who seem obsessed with talking bad about him, since the GM's death. Train, practice, and above all have fun (since, hopefully, you will have far more days without a stick fight, than you wil have days with one!). Who really cares about the politics!

And before any more internet challenges are slung around, I will train with anyone, but offers to come and show me whose paperwork is more legit, will be met with the laughter they deserve.

Streetwise,

I have a problem with JD. Some of it being the web-site. Some of it being the titles and ranks he has used and or given out. Some of it also is how he dealt with me. He personally told me I had no rank and that I would have to retest under him to be recognized and to have knowledge of Modern Arnis. He wanted to make sure I truly knew Modern Arnis (* His words *) I guess from his point of view. He then gave me the sales pitch to come and sign up at the web site and give him money.

He started in the early or mid 90's and is now a GM? I started before him, and have trained slowly and sure. Yes he could be better then me, in shorter time. Just that I do not believe it. MY Opinion here. So, since I have no rank in Modern Arnis, I do not have to reconize him. I am also allowed to have opiions of people.

As for ill wishing, I never wished the man to get sick or get hurt, I have wished that he would treat people better then he treated me.

He made his opiion of me quite clear. So I have made mine of JD also Quite Clear.

Of all of the Groups, Independants, JD and his organization is the only one I do not wish to have contact with. My Choice. I might loose out on something. I might not.

So, if One of my posts upset, I am sorry it did. I was just expressing my opinion.

I wish there were more supported of JD here to give a point of view and to clear up some issues. Just my opinion. For you see, without discourse conflicts cannot be resolved.

Have a nice day and keep posting and keep all of us honest.

 

[streetwise]

Mr Parsons, what a well said and reasonable post, sir! I have no problem with people having a specific disagreement with Jeff (or anyone else). I am an old friend who trained with him for years, but I was not his student, and I haven't seen him more than 2 or 3 times since GM Presas' death. I have just seen lots of people being really insulting and issuing "come and fight" challanges. I even got an email challenge after an earlier post about Jeff. I IN NO WAY promote Jeff's group, or any other group, I am just saying that Jeff is a good guy, personally, and a good martial artist with a huge amount of very diverse knowledge. I know almost nothing about his business practices, though next time I see him, I wil be teasing him about the whole "titles and rank" thing, since is one the most informal martial artists I have met. Plus, I owe him big time for paying my way to my first seminar with Carlos Machado, oh so many years ago, so the least I can do is stand up as someone who knows him.

 

[Rich Parsons]

Originally posted by streetwise
Mr Parsons, what a well said and reasonable post, sir! I have no problem with people having a specific disagreement with Jeff (or anyone else). I am an old friend who trained with him for years, but I was not his student, and I haven't seen him more than 2 or 3 times since GM Presas' death. I have just seen lots of people being really insulting and issuing "come and fight" challanges. I even got an email challenge after an earlier post about Jeff. I IN NO WAY promote Jeff's group, or any other group, I am just saying that Jeff is a good guy, personally, and a good martial artist with a huge amount of very diverse knowledge. I know almost nothing about his business practices, though next time I see him, I wil be teasing him about the whole "titles and rank" thing, since is one the most informal martial artists I have met. Plus, I owe him big time for paying my way to my first seminar with Carlos Machado, oh so many years ago, so the least I can do is stand up as someone who knows him.

Streetwise,

Always defend what you think is right. Just keep an open mind in case you are not. Or at least understand that others will differ from you just because.

And enjoy teasing him.

:asian:

 

[progressivetactics]

I hope i'm not out of line here, but I wanted to throw my 2cents in for what it is worth.
I have only been in Mod Arnis for a short time, and only trained with JD 1 time. He was very respectful of me, and spoke of other orginizations respectfully. I have had some interaction with Lisa McManus and found her to be of extremely high charachter. I have seen a couple negative things wrote about her, which may or maynot have been true. My experience was very good. She is a talented person, good teacher, and she was EXTREMELY RESPECTFUL of many many Arnis people. She mentioned many people I could also look for information from, some of which are a big part of the discussion board.

I have no way of knowing about the past, and the stories of you lucky ones who spent much time with the ORIGINAL grandmaster, professor presas. I respect all of you, and your opinions. I just wanted to stand up for JD and LM from my point of view.

 

[Guro Harold]

I don't think anyone has anything personal against Mr. Delany or Ms McManus. There have been only a few person type attacks their way.

It is not my job to recap the all the concerns that where raised but to put it in general terms, some people have been concerned how they have been doing business as of around mid to late 2000 until now.

However, there are some people, myself included, who do not feel comfortable about the GM title, the use of the title "Professor", and the rapid promotion of both of these individuals.

Are they nice people? Yes. Would I speak to them? Yes. Would I tell anyone not to train with them? No. The only personal beef that I have against Jeff is his insistance on calling me "Howard", after four friggin years, daggumit, that makes me mad!!!:cuss:

BTW, Mr. Barker, with all due respect, how come you didn't also mention that you will be hosting Ms. McManus as well this next October? That is the epitome of standing up for her as well.

Palusut

 

[progressivetactics]

Didn't think it made much of a difference. I hosted her last November for a 2 day clinic. That is when she spoke so nice of all the people she has met through Modern Arnis. I will have another clinic this october with her. I also have intensions of attending some other Arnis clinics outside the IMAF. If the opportunity arises, I would orginize a clinic with them as well. I am not bias. I simply want to learn, and teach.

 

[Guro Harold]

"Didn't think it made much of a difference. I hosted her last November for a 2 day clinic."

Hi Mr. Barker,

It does in the fact of the commitment it takes to organize and host such an endeavor.

BTW, there are several talented people in Michigan for Arnis and Balintawak, some on MartialTalk, who I have had the pleasure to exchange ideas with.

Best of fortune in your efforts to introduce Modern Arnis in your area.

Palusut

 

[Rich Parsons]

Originally posted by Palusut
"Didn't think it made much of a difference. I hosted her last November for a 2 day clinic."

Hi Mr. Barker,

It does in the fact of the commitment it takes to organize and host such an endeavor.

BTW, there are several talented people in Michigan for Arnis and Balintawak, some on MartialTalk, who I have had the pleasure to exchange ideas with.

Best of fortune in your efforts to introduce Modern Arnis in your area.

Palusut

Talent? Where? You must be talking about Paul .

Mr. Parker, Paul is out of town now, yet, you should contact him, to see what he can offer you. He is much closer than I. I am up in Flint. Besides, Paul hosts Seminars and Camps in the past and he may do so in the future, if there is support from people like yourself. Contact him and I am sure something postive and constructive will come out of it.

Good Training to you.

 

[redfive]

I think that Jeff D. just rubbed people the wrong way after the Proffessor died. He did say that our rank would not be recognized by him and that we had to re-test under him. I'm a 1st degree and my certificate was issued and signed By Remy and my formal instructor, Anding De Leon. Anding is a 4th degree under Remy and one of Remy's original students from the Philippines. So who is Jeff to say who is qualified and who is not, when most of the Modern Arnis players have been in the game twice as long as he has. So thats why alot of people said Put up or shut up. Get in the ring and show me what you got. Thats the real filipino way.
I have met Jeff and he is a nice guy, he just went about things the wrong way. Last year I met Tim Hartman at Anding's school. There is a huge difference in skill levels. Tim is far ahead of Jeff, but Jeff is a GM. So thats another point that people dont like.That of having a title, but not the skill level of a majority of the people under you.

Redfive

 

[Datu Tim Hartman]

Originally posted by redfive
Last year I met Tim Hartman at Anding's school. There is a huge difference in skill levels. Tim is far ahead of Jeff, but Jeff is a GM.
Redfive

Thanks for the compliment. No other comments for now.

:asian:

 

[Dan Anderson]

Jeff is taller than Tim...and has more hair than I do. Ahhhh, such is life.
Dan

 

[ace]

Originally posted by Dan Anderson
Jeff is taller than Tim...and has more hair than I do. Ahhhh, such is life.
Dan

.......

 

[Cruentus]

Basically Rich has summed up my general opinion about JD's group. I've gotten pretty fired up about the issue before and I've said some things that might alude to me wishing him injury or death. I actually don't wish him or Lisa any bodily harm or extreme ill will; I just wish they would stop misrepresenting themselves. It's bad for the art that I have dedicated myself to. We can't just all train and "be happy" when people are out there lying about themselves, and misleading the populus about our system. There is no real check in balance system in the martial arts, and Modern Arnis would risk going down the drain in quality because of this if some of us didn't put our foot down and say "That isn't right!" I don't want to see our system go into the toilet because of a few lyers.

Now, are Lisa and Jeff "nice". Of course, but that is their M.O. also. They will be very kind to you, and that is part of the P.R. tactic. One has to ask themself, however, what the motive is, and why they are so nice when it is clear that they are lying and misrepresenting themselves. I don't know the answer to this question; and I don't think I'll ever understand. All I know is that con men have a nice even tone in their voice and a smile on their face when they are cheating you. So how nice is that, really? I sort of feel like they are conning the martial arts community by lying about themselves; and that is why I will make no apologies for anything I have said about them in the past for I feel that they had brought it upon themselves.

Bill Barker: Hi, how's it going? I have mentioned to you before that there really is a large array of skill in FMA in Michigan, and that I would be happy to introduce you to anyone that I know. I will probably host more events in the future with the WMAA and Tim Hartman. I'll keep you updated on those, and you'd be welcomed to stop by.

I should I have no problem with you wanting to host Lisa for seminars; I won't support her events (and I think you know how I feel), but if it works for you then that's great. I would recommend, however, that you explore some of the talent from the other groups. I had met you before, and the invitation to get together is still open. I'll be back in Michigan This weekend. E-mail me private message here if you want me to give you a ring.

Sincerely,
Paul
Currently residing in the Big Apple

 

[Dan Anderson]

Originally posted by PAUL
Now, are Lisa and Jeff "nice". Of course, but that is their M.O. also. They will be very kind to you, and that is part of the P.R. tactic. One has to ask themself, however, what the motive is, and why they are so nice when it is clear that they are lying and misrepresenting themselves. I don't know the answer to this question; and I don't think I'll ever understand.
Sincerely,
Paul
Currently residing in the Big Apple

Paul,
JD actually feels he is the current GM as dictated by Remy Presas. I don't think, in his own mind, that he is lying or misrepresenting hmself. The thing is that he doesn't have broad agreement with this designation amongst the Modern Arnis world. That gives the apparancy that he is lying and so forth. If you believe in your heart something is true, then it is true for you.

Yours,
Dan Anderson

 

[Cruentus]

Originally posted by Dan Anderson
Paul,
JD actually feels he is the current GM as dictated by Remy Presas. I don't think, in his own mind, that he is lying or misrepresenting hmself. The thing is that he doesn't have broad agreement with this designation amongst the Modern Arnis world. That gives the apparancy that he is lying and so forth. If you believe in your heart something is true, then it is true for you.

Yours,
Dan Anderson

Ahh......So he is crazy then.

That is the only alternative. Either he is elaboratily lying, or he is crazy. The one thing he isn't is the grandmaster of Modern Arnis designated by Professor Presas. If he is crazy then I feel bad for him.

I don't believe that he is crazy, unfortunatily. I think that he is elaboratily fabricating his credentials because he is looking for a meal ticket and a pay day, and he used Modern Arnis and the death of our instructor for this. He has also taken a few people with him. Hell, I have seen it happend before: a guy in his 50's with no real career path or clue decides to take advantage of a situation to make a buck.

I know that sounds insulting as all get up, and please understand that I'm not trying to be "insulting" just for the sake of itself. I am just being brutily honest. I just don't think that he is crazy. And as "nice" as he and Ms. McManus are in front of your face, I believe that this is just one elaborate marketing scheme.

I hope that I am wrong, though. Bottom line is: he is not the grandmaster, and what he does and says is bad for our art. So the question is, what are YOU going to do about it.("you" being ambigious for anyone in Modern Arnis) Are you going to support his organization? Are you going to be his buddy? Are you going to boycott him? That is a decision that each individual will have to deal with on their own.

Just my opinions, and sorry to offend.

Gotta go to a meeting now....

respectfully,
Paul Janulis
straight from the city that never sleeps

 

[streetwise]

Paul, I really didn't want to do this, since I really don't care if you declare yourself "Great Ultimate Grand Master Poobah and Arbiter of All Rank in All Martial Arts, Yesterday, Today and Forever." Rank and titles don't impress me much, and I have been in martial arts longer than you have been alive. My turn to be honest, Jeff was given a co-successor title by GM Presas. Quibbling about that is insulting to his memory. Before he became ill, Remy Presas told me that he was starting to consider turning the operation of the seminar circuit over to Jeff, since he felt Jeff was very active, and would be willing to make the personal sacrifices needed to keep it going. There was no time frame mentioned, but the GM wanted to work on some personal dream projects, some of which were in the Phillipines. Jeff loses money when he is travelling and not able to run his contracting business, and GM Presas was impressed by his willingness to do this whenever he was asked. I don't talk to Jeff very often these days, and he would simply laugh at your odd obsession with him. Your attacks are more personal than any lineage feud warrants. He is neither lying nor crazy, I repeat my earlier advice, relax (how many instructors have told all of us that!), have fun, support or don't support whoever you choose. You are a young man, as you continue in martial training, you will find open doors of much more use than closed ones. You have changed my mind about one thing, I think I need to get my students, and the students of some of my friends, together and get behind Jeff's group. One thing I have learned, when you see an honorable man under attack, stand with him.

 

[Mao]

Honorable?