Shame

[Gyakuto]

I remember quite a few Americans getting out of hand though.

They only require a volume control to speak at normal levels!

 

[Gyakuto]

I dont feel right calling out a nationality or accusing them of offenses in a public or forum setting.

Then don’t

I will say my wife who is a waitress has a particular dislike for what she calls "abung" people.

Oh you did, although suriptiously 😉

They are the most rude and demanding and consistently leave zero for a tip at the end of the meal, even when they feel the service was good, for which here in the US should be 20%.

Tipping behaviour has such a wide spectrum of practises ranging from ‘if they’ve just done their job, then why tip them?’ to ‘be very generous because their dastardly employers deliberately pay then very low wages’. I’ve been to a few places where one orders food on a table touch screen meaning the only opportunity for waiting staff to show anything beyond the expected, is in bringing it from kitchen to table. Cartwheels? Sparks out of teeth-clenched fireworks? When the robots rise, the won’t even be required for that 🤖

When we were back home in Thailand, visiting the kings palace. The entry attendant told my wife we should come back later because there was a group of about 200 tourists from xxxx. This nationality is slowly over populating Thailand. They are not particularly liked because they are loud and rude.

Americans? 😳 The ‘loud’ bit gave it away 😉

This is a global problem due to cultural differences and the mass migrations of people in today's world.

It shouldn’t be allowed 😑

 

[hoshin1600]

Americans? 😳 The ‘loud’ bit gave it away 😉

While I do fit the description of being American and often loud, no it wasn't Americans.

 

[Gyakuto]

While I do fit the description of being American and often loud, no it wasn't Americans.

May I ask why Americans feel the need to speak in loud voices? Is it something you’re taught to do at school? Thinking about it, I think it’s actually the midrange, nasal quality that makes your voices appear loud, rather like the Northern Irish 🤔

 

[hoshin1600]

May I ask why Americans feel the need to speak in loud voices? Is it something you’re taught to do at school? Thinking about it, I think it’s actually the midrange, nasal quality that makes your voices appear loud, rather like the Northern Irish 🤔

I really have no idea.
If I was going to take a guess, I would say it's our independent nature and need to compete rather than an Asian cultural need to fit in and maintain harmony.

 

[Steve]

May I ask why Americans feel the need to speak in loud voices? Is it something you’re taught to do at school? Thinking about it, I think it’s actually the midrange, nasal quality that makes your voices appear loud, rather like the Northern Irish 🤔

I think we are just naturally more robust than Brits. More akin to our Australian cousins than the anemic lot who remained in Britain. Brits are like the kids who never leave home.

Or maybe not. Who knows? Just idle speculation.

 

[Steve]

I really have no idea.
If I was going to take a guess, I would say it's our independent nature and need to compete rather than an Asian cultural need to fit in and maintain harmony.

nothing wrong with a little enthusiasm. 🤣

 

[Gyakuto]

I really have no idea.
If I was going to take a guess, I would say it's our independent nature and need to compete rather than an Asian cultural need to fit in and maintain harmony.

The need to dominate? Europeans aren’t loud though.

 

[granfire]

I think there are stereotypes of about all nationalities, and the Western folks cannot adhere to Asian protocol, Shogun be damned.
There is a German made satire lampooning Germans 'Man spricht Deutsch' we speak German. They are the bane of the Balearic Islands.
The Brits are known to be the drunk red skinned people on the beach. Oh my, were they skunked at the Grand Prix d'arc de triomph, 40 years can see how that offends the Japanese sensibilities.
(By the time I can afford to go there they will have closed up the country again)

 

[Fungus]

I really have no idea.
If I was going to take a guess, I would say it's our independent nature and need to compete rather than an Asian cultural need to fit in and maintain harmony.

That's an interesting and it sounds plausible. There is differences also between European countries but my impression is that at least compared to Sweden, life and social security and insurance systems is very competitive in US. There is the idea of the "american dream" but I suppose the flip side is also that anyone can get bad turns in life, and then you are (at least to a larger extent than in Sweden) on your own when it comes to social security and insurances, or so I am told. As much money we spend on taxes in Sweden, many spend on private insurances in US I think. So for those that can afford, there is not much difference, but for those that can't the difference is huge? So perhaps that grows a culture where beeing competitive and thinking of yourself more is the social norm, and where more and bigger = better. And you if you aren't competitive you are inferior or a "looser".

In contrast, in Sweden the traditional social norm is more like "get in line and wait for your turn", as we expect society to to a certaint extent to be fair and just, and that you should get your rightful share without needing to "take it", that is how society "should work", at the expense of someone else. In sweden we tend to look down upon people that, don't respect lines, disobey rules or don't pay attention to detail, yet we are not offensive enough to always express it (slight social inhibition, except when we get drunk, then all bets are off). We tend to think that "just right" is the ideal, and too much is vulgar.

Could be interesting to hear some others from england or southern europeans characterize yourself in simple terms?

 

[Gyakuto]

I think there are stereotypes of about all nationalities, and the Western folks cannot adhere to Asian protocol, Shogun be damned.

Stereotypes are oversimplified images but they have some basis in reality.

The Brits are known to be the drunk red skinned people on the beach.

…with shaved heads, tattoos, 3/4 shorts and polyester football (soccer) tops. At a drop of a hat they will sing football chants and eat full English breakfasts.

 

[Fungus]

no it wasn't Americans.

Maybe a bus load of english sword collectors - aroused by beeing on their once in a lifetime pilgrim tour to Japan? Then I think they should be excused.

 

[isshinryuronin]

I would say it's our independent nature and need to compete rather than an Asian cultural need to fit in and maintain harmony.

I'd say it's both. Historically, some nations were ruled by a king or emperor, having a high class and a lower class where compliance was enforced. The upstart USA with its frontier culture and relatively powerful middle class fostered a less compliant personality. Related to this is self-discipline, some cultures/subcultures having more or less of it.

 

[Hyoho]

I don't feel right calling out a nationality or accusing them of offenses in a public or forum setting.

Well I did not really like to mention Chinese in particular. But I have lived and still living in Asia over 45 years. The friend I mentioned being pushed is a Filipino dentist. I have been dragged into situation between Koreans and Japanese. Sitting with Korean Professors in Japan that say things like, "How can you live with these people"? Going to Korea to do seminars and the Japanese refusing to come! In general there is a lot of bad blood between Japan, Korea and China.

Good Chinese friends as I was the "tropical fish doctor" and maintained all their aquariums at home and work. At that time in my life I never once paid for takeaway. 🤤

 

[Fungus]

In general there is a lot of bad blood between Japan, Korea and China.

This reminds me of what some japanese business contacts from Tokyo told me as we were discussing phones. They tend to prefer iphone over samsung, mainly because samsung is korean. And when samsung phones are sold in japan, often the mobile operator somehow replace the samsung brand in some way with the operator brand. If I remember correctly they could use a shell or sticker to cover samsung logo. That was interesting, as samsung is large, and it never occure to me as a Swede to not like samsung because it's korean. So it was a clear sign of the tension you mention.

 

[Gyakuto]

This reminds me of what some japanese business contacts from Tokyo told me as we were discussing phones. They tend to prefer iphone over samsung, mainly because samsung is korean. And when samsung phones are sold in japan, often the mobile operator somehow replace the samsung brand in some way with the operator brand. If I remember correctly they could use a shell or sticker to cover samsung logo. That was interesting, as samsung is large, and it never occure to me as a Swede to not like samsung because it's korean. So it was a clear sign of the tension you mention.

You think they’d dislike Apple just as much as their products are overpriced, they lock you into their brand and do all that ‘throttling’ to slow their older devices down to make you buy new ones! Apple is a very naughty company…very.

 

[Fungus]

You think they’d dislike Apple just as much as their products are overpriced, they lock you into their brand and do all that ‘throttling’ to slow their older devices down to make you buy new ones! Apple is a very naughty company…very.

As coming from the computer science geek direction, and a linux fan, back in the days no serious programmer or computer enthusiast from where I come would touch an apple computer. I recall at the university days when 486 cpu was "hot" and during one lecturer where a lecture had installed dualboot with macintosh on this PC and was demonstratin an excel simulation and you could tell the audience impression that it was a disgrace to install such an operating system on such a fine piece of hardware! Noone like microsoft either, but apple just locked their customer into their own hardware, taking it one step too far, and tech geeks don't think that.

My view today is that apple today isn't for tech geeks, its more a faishon accessoire, and I am neither into fashion nor feeding dragons.

 

[Gyakuto]

As coming from the computer science geek direction, and a linux fan, back in the days no serious programmer or computer enthusiast from where I come would touch an apple computer. I recall at the university days when 486 cpu was "hot" and during one lecturer where a lecture had installed dualboot with macintosh on this PC and was demonstratin an excel simulation and you could tell the audience impression that it was a disgrace to install such an operating system on such a fine piece of hardware! Noone like microsoft either, but apple just locked their customer into their own hardware, taking it one step too far, and tech geeks don't think that.

My view today is that apple today isn't for tech geeks, its more a faishon accessoire, and I am neither into fashion nor feeding dragons.

Fungus, it’s customary to write in English on this forum so we can all join in the conversation. 😑😉

 

[granfire]

Well I did not really like to mention Chinese in particular. But I have lived and still living in Asia over 45 years. The friend I mentioned being pushed is a Filipino dentist. I have been dragged into situation between Koreans and Japanese. Sitting with Korean Professors in Japan that say things like, "How can you live with these people"? Going to Korea to do seminars and the Japanese refusing to come! In general there is a lot of bad blood between Japan, Korea and China.

Good Chinese friends as I was the "tropical fish doctor" and maintained all their aquariums at home and work. At that time in my life I never once paid for takeaway. 🤤

considering the local history, I can understand.
80 years is nothing in the context of hundreds of years.
So I guess Korean people do not automatically learn Japanese because of proximity then. Although pop artists all seem to have the version for the Japanese market somewhere.

 

[Fungus]

Fungus, it’s customary to write in English on this forum so we can all join in the conversation. 😑😉

I may be stupid or slow, but I failed to get your point, if it was a joke or wether my spellchecking is off chart? 🤔