Organizations

[Mickey]

Hi All,

I came here looking to ask some questions to get some opinions of other people on some issues.

The question I have is Multiple Organizations.

Is it possible for someone to be in two or more organizations at the same time, and not have a conflict of interest?


I ask since a friend of mine's instructor who was a 6th in WTF TKD and 7th in ITF TKD and had maintained his standing in both organizations for many many years. Then all of a sudden both groups within a month of each other told him to choose one organization and only one.

For sake of argument let us assume that he had not doing anything against either, and was able to teach and maintain integrity in both sub-systems.

So, why other than ego, would someone have to quit another organization?

Just curious

Mick

 

[arnisador]

Do they have different standards, like having to know two versions of forms or something? That's the only problem I see--when their rank requirements differ it can be a pain.

 

[Roland]

......I really see no problem if you want to belong to more than one org.
Heck, why not?
Just more people to hang and learn from.
You bring it in, keeps your students happy, they do not need to go else where.
It just means you like to hang out with lots of other people, and you have an open mind, I think that is great.

 

[Bob Hubbard]

On the Arnis side, I don't know what the restrictions are on the WMAA...I believe the IMAF (shea) allows a student to be part of any group, but requires instructors to only be part of their organization.

On the Kenpo side, I was a member of the UMAA, and one of the things I liked was they allowed for multiple group memberships.

Most of these organizations need to realize its a business... by restricting, they lose alot. I know of several people who would join as many as they could, just to say they were a member...

Now, rank on the otherhand... I don't consider my rank in the WMAA to be the same as what I would hold if I were a member of the IMAF. The requirements are different. I'd have to pass their requirements to qualify. More testing, more training, more costs.

I think Roland said it best "It just means you like to hang out with lots of other people, and you have an open mind, I think that is great."

:asian:

 

[Nightingale]

the school I'm in belongs to both OAKKA and LTKKA (original american kenpo karate assn, and larry tatum kenpo karate assn, respectively).

There isn't a conflict of interest, because the two curriculums are virtually identical. OAKKA was the original organization of the school, but its based in another state so there aren't very many people nearby, so the decision was made to add on LTKKA to give the school a more local support base as well. Students wear both patches (if they choose to do so), and can have belt certificates from both associations.

The arrangement seems to be working quite well so far.

 

[Mickey]

Originally posted by arnisador

Do they have different standards, like having to know two versions of forms or something? That's the only problem I see--when their rank requirements differ it can be a pain.

Yes they have two different form sets, but both are taught completely and with no side remarks about the style's forms being better than that style.

 

[Mickey]

Originally posted by Roland

......I really see no problem if you want to belong to more than one org.
Heck, why not?
Just more people to hang and learn from.
You bring it in, keeps your students happy, they do not need to go else where.
It just means you like to hang out with lots of other people, and you have an open mind, I think that is great.

This instructor enjoyed bringing people together from the different styles, when he had his 'Open' training classes on Saturdays. He enjoyed all the people he could meet and hoped everyone else did also.

 

[Mickey]

Originally posted by nightingale8472

the school I'm in belongs to both OAKKA and LTKKA (original american kenpo karate assn, and larry tatum kenpo karate assn, respectively).

There isn't a conflict of interest, because the two curriculums are virtually identical. OAKKA was the original organization of the school, but its based in another state so there aren't very many people nearby, so the decision was made to add on LTKKA to give the school a more local support base as well. Students wear both patches (if they choose to do so), and can have belt certificates from both associations.

The arrangement seems to be working quite well so far.

Yes, if the student only wanted to learn one specific style this was possible, but do to the many over lapping techniques, you could easily spend more time and learn both styles.

And students could test in both styles and wear both patches or only wear one patch if they choose too.

The head instructor only asked that if you were truely serious about teaching that you got your first Dan in both styles. This way you have an understanding of both styles. The instructors idea was to get rid of some of the attitudes and arguements between the two styles.

I thought this a good idea, but the seniors of the two styles had other ideas.

 

[Mickey]

Originally posted by Kaith Rustaz

On the Arnis side, I don't know what the restrictions are on the WMAA...I believe the IMAF (shea) allows a student to be part of any group, but requires instructors to only be part of their organization.

On the Kenpo side, I was a member of the UMAA, and one of the things I liked was they allowed for multiple group memberships.

Most of these organizations need to realize its a business... by restricting, they lose alot. I know of several people who would join as many as they could, just to say they were a member...

Now, rank on the otherhand... I don't consider my rank in the WMAA to be the same as what I would hold if I were a member of the IMAF. The requirements are different. I'd have to pass their requirements to qualify. More testing, more training, more costs.

I think Roland said it best "It just means you like to hang out with lots of other people, and you have an open mind, I think that is great."

:asian:

Why would someone not allow their student to be a member of another group?

Why would an organization not allow an instructor to be a member of another group?

Rank issue would not be the same. The new one might make you start all over. This is not a problem. They might honor the rank for a short period of time and then allow you to test for your existing rank, to prove you deserve it. You might even go straight to your next test for rank. I could see if one organization was giving rank away like candy on Halloween, then this could be a problem. But I do not see were it would be a problem for the first style who was more strick on rank. The student / instructor of both arts could get a bad rep, but how would this affect the other style?

 

[Roland]

instructor insecurity!

:soapbox:

 

[Rich Parsons]

Hi All,


I personally do not think there is anything wrong with belonging to many organizations. It could cause some politics, but if you are willing to ignore or live with it then I see no problem.

I like to meet new people and to train with just about anyone.

Best Regards

Rich

 

[chufeng]

Did either organization get a portion of dues or promotion fees?
It could be a matter of greed on the parent organization...OR, the head of each organization has a personal grudge against the other...

:asian:
chufeng

 

[Mickey]

Originally posted by chufeng

Did either organization get a portion of dues or promotion fees?
It could be a matter of greed on the parent organization...OR, the head of each organization has a personal grudge against the other...

:asian:
chufeng

As it was ITF and WTF in TKD, I believe it to be the grudge, as
the instructor I know of, he had his testing fees, and htat was it.
Anything else, the student was charged for for the organization, the student saw the bil and knew how much it was. Some people only tested in one of the organizations to avoid paying for things twice.


Good feedback

Mick

 

[KenpoTess]

*nudging thread

 

[RCastillo]

Originally posted by KenpoTess
*nudging thread

Nudge harder, I didn't get it.