Ninjutsu with a heart condition

Discussion in 'Ninjutsu' started by Shinobi Teikiatsu, Jul 1, 2008.

  1. Shinobi Teikiatsu

    Shinobi Teikiatsu Green Belt

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    Hi, I've been practicing ninjutsu for two years and I've been getting quite proficient at it, but I have a problem that I only recently revealed to my sensei.

    I have a heart condition, or a lung condition (can't tell exactly) that can best be described as arrythmia.

    I went to the cardiologist and they said that my heart is perfectly healthy, not a murmer or affliction in sight.

    I told my sempai about this on Monday during training, as it was so bad that I was forced to sit out, and he said that it might not be arrythmia, but a condition with my lungs.

    So, my question to you guys is this: How do I continue training with this condition, and is there a way that I can solve it?
     
  2. shesulsa

    shesulsa Columbia Martial Arts Academy

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    You have had a couple of replies to your question in another area.
     
  3. tellner

    tellner Senior Master

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    Here is how you continue training: You continue training when you've had a long talk and tests with the cardiologist, the internist and the pulmonary specialist. You need to have those talks right away. That means immediately. Whatever you have may be minor. It may kill you dead tomorrow. You need to know, and you need to know right away. Until then you should not be working out.

    Here is how you solve the problem: You see the cardiologist, the internist and the pulmonary specialist. You get examined and maybe have some tests. You do exactly what they tell you.
     
  4. Brian R. VanCise

    Brian R. VanCise MT Moderator Staff Member

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    Yes go see your doctor and some specialist and have them work you up so that you and they can understand your condition thoroughly. Good luck!
     
  5. exile

    exile To him unconquered.

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    Take the above replies deadly seriously, ST. Good as your instructor may be as a ninjutsuka, you shouldn't take his medical advice any more than you would take your GP's advice on whether to go inside or outside a roundhound punch. Be very, very skeptical when you get diagnosed about a major physical symptom by someone who's not medically qualified.

    The question you're asking isn't really one the likes of us can answer. Get yourself checked out by the relevant specialists down to the last detail before you train any further. If you have an arrhythmia, getting it dealt with should be at the top of your To-Do list, and nothing else should even be on your To-Do list till you get that sorted out.
     
  6. kwaichang

    kwaichang Purple Belt

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    Indeed. Remember the first lesson for a ninja is to survive. Get to those doctors.
     
  7. jks9199

    jks9199 Administrator Staff Member

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    Begin by going to a doctor, identifying the cause, and only then worry about anything else.

    See above...
     
  8. Kacey

    Kacey Sr. Grandmaster

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    I can only echo what others have said - go see a doctor.
     
  9. jks9199

    jks9199 Administrator Staff Member

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    I just re-read the post.

    I'm a bit confused; docs are apparently telling him they can't find anything. He's experiencing something. But the symptoms he's experiencing aren't all that clear...

    Maybe, just this once, his teacher IS the right person; he can actually see what's going on and what's leading to it. That may reveal what the issue is.
     
  10. shesulsa

    shesulsa Columbia Martial Arts Academy

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    All the more reason to see a doctor. What he's saying doesn't make much sense to me - lungs don't have arrhythmia. But an arrhythmic heart *can* be healthy.
     
  11. exile

    exile To him unconquered.

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    My question is, what kind of tests were done, and scans and the like, before the Drs. in question threw up their hands? EKGs, almost certainly; but EKGs can miss a lot of stuff. Was a stress ultrasound scan done? Just how much in-depth examination was carried out before the declaration that apparently nothing was wrong?

    We can't say at this point because the OP hasn't told us just how many tests were done, and how thorough the scrutine he received was. I have the lingering sense, though, that his case wasn't treated as particularly urgent. If not, he needs to pursue it more aggressively and have the current state of the cardiologist's art brought to bear on his condition. Arrhythmias are potentially deadly.
     
  12. Kacey

    Kacey Sr. Grandmaster

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    I agree - the OP hasn't given us enough information about what was already done - but perhaps, with a clear accounting of what happened in his class, he could get in to see a different doctor, or a different set of tests.

    The thing to remember is that none of us are there with the OP - so we can only recommend what we would do in his place.
     
  13. exile

    exile To him unconquered.

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    Yes indeed—second opinions are often lifesavers. Given the fact that the very, very best of us make mistakes aplenty, putting all one's eggs in the basket of a single physician's opinion (no matter how good) when an indecisive result could mask a grave condition is just... well, 'excessively optimistic' is a polite way of putting it.

    Right. Maybe all is well, as his doctor seems to be implying. But it's interesting that just on the basis of what the OP has told us, all of us suspect that a lot more follow-up attention is needed. We all have a healthy respect for physicians. But it's useful at times to think of them as garage mechanics for the human body. If you were getting severe mechanical problems with your car, problems that felt like a serious timing problem, say, and the shop you brought it to said, sorry, nothing at all seems to be wrong... wouldn't you take it to another garage to be looked over? Or at least write to the Magliozzi brothers at Car Talk? I sure as hell would...
     
  14. jks9199

    jks9199 Administrator Staff Member

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    I wasn't meaning to suggest that the OP doesn't need to see a doctor -- but that whatever is happening isn't apparently happening in the doctor's office.

    It seems like the instructor is the best one to actually see and hear what's going on when it's happening. It may be linked to certain exercises, and not others. Or it may only happen when the OP passes 90% exertion, or does a series of rolls, or whatever. Now the doc has more to work with to figure out what's up...
     
  15. tellner

    tellner Senior Master

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    Arrythmias are notoriously tricky and can be like that funny noise your car makes - trouble out on the road but disappears whenever you pull into the mechanic's garage.

    One of the reasons we all said "See a doctor, see several doctors" was the vagueness of the symptoms. We can't diagnose and some sort of "heart or lungs" problem is mysterious enough to warrant having a professional take a look.

    "Hello, and welcome back to another hour of Carnal Talk with your hosts Snick and Snack the Stitch-it brothers."
     
  16. exile

    exile To him unconquered.

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    Yes, and the other thing about arrhythmias is that they are really insidious. Some regulatory mechanism in the body has failed, for whatever reason, and it's completely unpredictable when the disorder will kick in under chaotic conditions that can have fatal consequences. From other people's experience, I know that physicians often try to get you into hospital where you can be monitored over a prolonged period of time for these things, for precisely the reason you mention—a single random sample of data will very likely not identify anything as being off-color.



    It's dangerous for me to listen to them while I'm driving—I laugh so much I can't keep the car going straight!

    Even their manic thank-yous at the end of the program are hilarious... acknowledging among others, say, 'our Russian driver, Pikop Andropov'... ad infinitum...
     
  17. Kacey

    Kacey Sr. Grandmaster

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    I had a friend who had an arrythmia at one point; the doctor put a set of sensor and a portable recorder on him and told him to go about his day as normal, including (especially including, actually) the physical activity that seemed to set it off - that's how they diagnosed it. Turned out to be a minor valve irregularity (congenital) that only caused problems in times of high physical activity - it was fixed with an outpatient procedure involving microtools through a catheter, with only a couple of days of downtime... but until you see a doctor, tell them the symptoms and what's going on when you experience them, they can't do anything.
     
  18. kwaichang

    kwaichang Purple Belt

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    You have to get and take your doctors advice. At one point I had to stop all falling/tumbling for fear of permanent paralysis. Believe me, that was a terrifying two years.

    Heart problems and breathing problems aren't any less threatening or frightening.

    Do get all the advice from medical professionals you can.
     
  19. shesulsa

    shesulsa Columbia Martial Arts Academy

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    My mom's arrhythmia resulted from bad electrolyte balance and depletion due to three blood pressure medications containing diuretics. She developed a "sick sinus node." As a result, she later developed atrial fibrillation (a-fib) - a condition for which she really *should* have gotten a pacemaker. A-fib can cause reduced oxygen delivery to the brain bringing about a host of other problems as well as poor circulation to the periphery leading to congestive heart failure - a slow, debilitating, torturous death.

    In some people and some cases, cardio aversion (sp? - shocking the heart and node mildly) can fix the problem for years and years.

    But ... again ... if you are out of breath because of your heart, you have a heart condition which requires immediate attention. If you have a heart condition because of a pulmonary condition, you require immediate attention. If you have both, you definitely need immediate attention.

    You're probably getting the idea that this is serious business and that arrhythmias can lead to nasty things if left untreated. I think the people telling you to go to the doctor either directly or indirectly have experience with this problem and YOU SHOULD LISTEN AND GO TO THE DOCTOR.

    Let us know how it turns out.
     
  20. kwaichang

    kwaichang Purple Belt

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    Those symptoms are inclusive of degerative heart failure also. That is something you do not want to wait and see; get thee to a physician.123
     

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