Musical Forms

Cthulhu

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The other night, I caught some ISKA action on ESPN2. Sometimes, I catch some interesting stuff on the ISKA shows: kickboxing under various rules, style demos, traditional forms, etc. However, this night, I was unfortunate to catch one of my biggest martial arts pet peeves (right below David Carradine): musical forms.

I don't know about you guys n' gals, but where I come from, forms are not meant for public entertainment. Even when I was tested on forms, I didn't do them with the mindset that I was performing them for my instructor. Rather, I did them as I always did them...as personal training and development. I have never seen a musical form that had anything of any real value to the serious martial artist.

How do I hate musical forms? Let me count the ways:

1) As I said, forms shouldn't be done as entertainment for others. They are meant to train students in the techniques and principles of their chosen style.

2) They have no real application. Come on, now...a backflip into the splits while looking down at the ground is supposed to help in a fight? Puh-lease. And standing on one leg doing those incredibly weak repetitive roundhouse kicks at head height? Give me a break. So you can hold your leg real high. Big deal. I can break your knee. :p

3) The kiais. Jeez. They weren't even real kiais. Just an extremely inordinate amount of grunting and yelling for no real purpose. It sounded (and looked) like the performers were all incredibly constipated. There was no focus or intent in any of their so-called 'kiais'. Sure, they grimaced a lot, but if someone did a kiai like that to me in training or sparring, I'd probably laugh my *** off.

4) I'm sorry, but those flimsy little toys they use as 'weapons' in their forms are pathetic. If you can't do those fancy-shmancy moves with the real thing, then don't do them at all. Sure, you can spin that balsa wood bo around nice and fast. Too bad it'll shatter if you hit anything with it. Too bad you can't do that with a REAL bo. Ugh. Then there was the misguided fool doing a form with a toy (no other word for it) katana doing flips and spins and twirls. Anyone remotely familiar with Japanese swordsmanship would know that a katana is not used like that. Sickening, really.

I'm sorry, but I fail to find anything of any value in these musical forms. To me, they are a perversion of everything I do in the martial arts. I shudder at the thought of somebody mistaking me for one of these people when I mention that I do martial arts. Grrrrr.

Cthulhu
(coming off a Nyquil high and incredibly grumpy)
 

Bob Hubbard

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LOL

Could be worse.....your teacher could start every class with "Its Morphing Time!" :D
 
G

GouRonin

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I'm sick. I feel like crap. On my only day off in a like 2 weeks and I'm sick. Plus it's my freakin' birthday. So, please take this with a grain of salt.

Subject : Musical forms.

I would rather a horse kick me repeatedly in the balls than even think about it.

Now if you'll excuse me, I too am going on a Nyquill high.
 
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Cthulhu

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I just got over a wicked-bad cold myself. I feel your pain.

To clarify, I'm not against music or music and martial arts. I'm a bassist/guitarist with two years of music theory under my belt.

Music is good to train with, to help loosen people up and get into a rhythm (or help train to fight without a rhythm). I'm just griping about their use with these ridiculous forms.

I'm much more impressed by a good demonstration of, say, Heian Godan, than I am with some goofy-*** glow-in-the-dark nunchaku form set to the soundtrack of the Mortal Kombat movie.

Phffft.

Cthulhu
 
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Cthulhu

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Happy Birthday, Gou!

Cthulhu
 
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GouRonin

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I'm postponing this one until I feel a bit better, LOL!

Thanx though.

I myself played in several bands in high school and in university and love music as well. However Musical forms seem to leave me wanting to dry heave like a man who has eaten sand for a day.

The forms often have no realistic endevour, are merely acrobatics and the music does nothing to help it.

The silence. The silence is golden.:mad:
 
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Cthulhu

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The only things we should hear when someone is doing a form is the exhale of exertion, snap of the gi, and a good and proper kiai. Not any one these idiotic grunting yells that serve no purpose. A good kiai should be able to stop an untrained person in their tracks...not make them laugh.

Cthulhu
 

Bob Hubbard

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Now, is it the Kiai, or the garlic breath that stops em? <G>

Sorry, couldn't resist...I'm in one of those weird moods today. :)
 
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Cthulhu

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I've heard kiais that could wake the dead. That being said, I've smelt breath that could do the same. :)

The kiai of the musical form competitors were just sad. Really, it was no more than drawn out yelling that was sickening to watch and hear.

Cthulhu
 

Bob Hubbard

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Eep! How'd that one get past the profanity censor? Heh...I'll have to check that.

I was at a Jujitsu/Judo (or something similar) tourny a while back.... there was 1 guy....he had a brown streak....I asked someone else...he verified....

all I can say, is I'm really really glad I wasn't in that event. ICK!
 
G

GouRonin

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Dude, I have seen a test where a woman was at that time of the month and things were not going well for her. The test was going well, "other things" were not...

...ew...:eek:
 

Bob Hubbard

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The problems with white gi's. :D

Watch out for flying objects....ick. ;)
 
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Cthulhu

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Ack. Too...much...information...

Cthulhu
 
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GouRonin

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I'm just waiting for someone to start a thread based on gross adventures while pursuing the martial arts.:rolleyes:
 
I

IFAJKD

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I can actually appreciate some of the musical forms...Oops, the only one ???? Kinda wushuized athletic ability that I can appreciate for what it is. I know the difference and can get by it... Hey I saw a woman WCW wrestler with that same stain. NASTY

Miller :eek:
 
G

GouRonin

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Maybe it's just me but tournaments are way far and beyond what they used to be. Do they even serve the same purpose anymore?:confused:
 
I

IFAJKD

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It's true, they aren't what they used to be but there are some that will actually test your skills. Try some open weapons tournaments, or some schools will look for ways to train their NHB fighters with Traditional martial artists. You have to be careful that they aren't setting you up for anything. Even finding a boxer willing to spar a Kickboxer or grappler. Some of these aren't tournaments but well worth the training experience. I enjoy fighting other styles in their backyard. I learn and gain alot.

Miller
 
G

GouRonin

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So you would advocate going and trying out other schools and styles?

I like to pop all over and check things out but often people do not like to do this. What advice would you give to your own students should they want to try this?:confused:
 
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Cthulhu

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It used to be common practice to visit other martial arts schools to 'practice' with the instructor and/or top student, or offer an outright challenge. In today's litigious society, it's unwise at best.

I'm lucky that my school has a martial arts club where student's from different styles can spar, as well as share information. If you're lucky to be in a city with a decent martial arts store, maybe you can ask the owner of the store to set up a bulletin board where people can search for training/sparring partners.

For legal reasons, I wouldn't have my students visit other schools for the purpose of sparring. If they wanted to go to crosstrain or to get a taste of that style, then I'd be all for it, as long as they've been training with me long enough so that their development in my system isn't impaired from learning another system. I'm all for crosstraining, but I believe you have to first have a firm base in at least one style. After that, train in whatever you want. That's just my opinion, though. After all, we can't all be Bruce Lee :)

Cthulhu
 

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