Martial Arts in Fantasy/Sci-Fi

[hoshin1600]

like i said i have no idea about that character, i was just using the concept as a exercise example.

 

[hoshin1600]

Star Wars includes fictional weapons, such as lightsabers and blasters

i remember seeing an interview with Lucas and he was talking about how he had the actors using poles for stand in weapons while filming because he wanted to make sure the action looked like the light sabers had some weight to them.

 

[Gerry Seymour]

How would Judo work against a centaur? How about Hapkido against a Harpy? Boxing against a ghost? What styles would be best against the Undead?

@kempodisciple, I smell another bracket coming!

 

[Gerry Seymour]

I love your OP, Skribs. You've put a lot of well-formed thought into the topic. I'll try to drag some thoughts together to contribute. As @AngryHobbit can attest, my memory for any detail of books and movies is pretty laughable, so I'm more likely to have vague references than good details to add.

Off the top of my head, I'm thinking there's some discussion of sword work in one of Heinlein's novels. And I'm remembering at least two books where fencing (one was all saber, I think, and the other included multiple styles) was central to the plot. Mind you, I can't remember what any of those books were, so I'll have to go home and stare at the bookcases.

 

[Gerry Seymour]

Mostly plot driven. I suck at writing characters.

So did Sue Grafton, and I really enjoy her books, for all their thin characters.

 

[Gerry Seymour]

I hadn't considered behavior, value systems, mythology, or religion. That's an excellent idea! You really caught me, regarding focusing on simply creating unique biology and then building based on that.

For example, I'm working on that Animorphs reboot right now, and I have one of the Animorphs morph into a Hork-Bajir and then fight with a Muay-Thai fighting style. They're creatures with huge blades on their elbows and knees, so an art that uses a lot of elbow and knee strikes makes a lot of sense.

Of course, this is the behavior of a human who has morphed into an alien, and not the behavior of the alien itself, but it still kind of gives you an idea of what I'm doing with mine.

As I mentioned in my last reply, I suck at writing characters, and so it would be harder for me to focus on values and behavior of a species as it would pertain to martial arts, but it is something I can try. Thanks for the idea!

Arts, as I see them, are heavily influenced by the culture they develop in. So it would make sense that in your world-building, the culture you create would help define what the martial art(s) of that culture look like. This is most emphasized in writing styles that use more archetypes than nuanced characters (including the original Star Wars). Often, the difference in the fighting styles is used to demonstrate the difference in cultures (one is needlessly brutal, while the other is competently defensive). In other cases, a contrast is deliberately created between the fighting style and the nature of the people (either shown as an adaptation to a threat, or linked to past history of the people).

 

[Gerry Seymour]

yeah im just the opposite. i really want to write a fictional horror story about a serial killer. the book would be in the form of a diary. written by the killer. im actually scared to write it with the fear people will think i am really a killer. i can go deep into character. but that also scares me a bit because i know that "going there" actually can re wire the brain and the plasticity of the brain is not something i want to mess with.

I've been tinkering with details for a fantasy novel for a few years. My problem is I understand the characters too well, but not the plot. I have a first line I kinda like (and that might be part of the problem) and know a bit of the story around it, but can't seem to get past it. I suspect this is one that will never get written.

 

[skribs]

I've been tinkering with details for a fantasy novel for a few years. My problem is I understand the characters too well, but not the plot. I have a first line I kinda like (and that might be part of the problem) and know a bit of the story around it, but can't seem to get past it. I suspect this is one that will never get written.

My problem is I either have:

1. An action set piece I want to build towards
2. An incredible world and backstory with no plot

For example, I have one book I want to write which takes place in like 2037, and I have the entire history from now until then written as backstory. I have no story to actually take from there.

 

[Gerry Seymour]

My problem is I either have:

1. An action set piece I want to build towards
2. An incredible world and backstory with no plot

I'm somewhere between those issues. I know some important action points, and a fair amount about the principle characters and their backstories. How any of it relates to a plot, I haven't a notion. I sometimes think I've confused characters that don't belong in the same world.

For example, I have one book I want to write which takes place in like 2037, and I have the entire history from now until then written as backstory. I have no story to actually take from there.

Well, at least you'll have no trouble with the prequels!

 

[skribs]

I'm somewhere between those issues. I know some important action points, and a fair amount about the principle characters and their backstories. How any of it relates to a plot, I haven't a notion. I sometimes think I've confused characters that don't belong in the same world.

Well, at least you'll have no trouble with the prequels!

Except prequels can be convoluted and boring.

 

[Gerry Seymour]

Except prequels can be convoluted and boring.

Well, yours only has to cover 20 years of history, so probably not too convoluted. As for boring, I guess that depends what you have happening in that 20 years. But then, I like to read books about the long progression of small-scale naval combat in WWII (the sinking of the Shinano), so boring is pretty relative.

 

[Tony Dismukes]

A few writers you might want to look at ...

Steven Barnes is a martial artist (Silat practitioner, I think) and a sci-fic/fantasy author who inserts martial arts ideas into his writing. In one of his series, the protagonist is a former "null-boxer" - essentially a professional MMA fighter who competes in zero-gravity. Since null-boxers can't connect to the ground while striking, they rely on technologically enhanced physiques to torque their bodies fast enough to inflict damage in mid-air.

Jim Butcher is a fantasy author and a martial artist. In his Dresden Files series about a modern-day wizard, he does include some real world martial arts. More on topic for this thread, he has well-thought out fight scenes when magic and/or mythological beings are involved. Harry Dresden can be found mixing fireballs and force blasts with fists, firearms, and improvised weapons. While Dresden is a brawler, some of the more advanced users of magic can be spotted using the mystic arts in a much more subtle, jiu-jitsu-like manner.

Brandon Sanderson's Mistborn series has a very well-thought out magic system which produces fight scenes resembling some of what you would see in movies of the Wuxia genre.

Of course, anime has a ton of shows tying martial arts to some form of magic or fantastical super-science. In Avatar: The Last Airbender, the four main elemental bending styles were each modeled after a real-world martial art. In Fullmetal Alchemist, each of the characters has a unique fighting style based on their own alchemical specialty. The list goes on and on.

 

[Gerry Seymour]

Brandon Sanderson's Mistborn series has a very well-thought out magic system which produces fight scenes resembling some of what you would see in movies of the Wuxia genre.

I didn't even think of these. I second this thought. Also his Stormlight Archive series, which has some pretty cool choices of how to make movements different in a fantasy usage.

 

[hoshin1600]

I have one book I want to write which takes place in like 2037, and I have the entire history from now until then written as backstory. I have no story to actually take from there.

this is why i kind of suggest looking into old mythology . they will give you a frame work.

 

[Buka]

Hey, Skribs, I bet you know more about character than you think you do. I betcha'.

And writing a plot driven piece is hard, real hard. Let's say your book is three hundred and fifty pages - trying to drive a plot for 350 pages is like climbing Mount Everest. I mean, it can be done, but it's wicked hard.

I have some suggestions on character if you're interested. And, again, you probably already know them. You just don't realize you do.

 

[AngryHobbit]

I like to write. In particular, I like to write sci-fi action, and might dabble into fantasy action. Either way, I think Fantasy and Science-Fiction are just two sub-genres of non-realistic fiction (I know fiction isn't reality, but there's a difference between a story about LA cops going undercover in a drug cartel and elves fighting orcs). Since starting martial arts, I've grown more and more interested about martial arts as they pertain to the sci-fi and fantasy genres, and how I can explore these themes going forward.

Yay, a fellow sci fi writer!

 

[AngryHobbit]

I love your OP, Skribs. You've put a lot of well-formed thought into the topic. I'll try to drag some thoughts together to contribute. As @AngryHobbit can attest, my memory for any detail of books and movies is pretty laughable, so I'm more likely to have vague references than good details to add.

Off the top of my head, I'm thinking there's some discussion of sword work in one of Heinlein's novels. And I'm remembering at least two books where fencing (one was all saber, I think, and the other included multiple styles) was central to the plot. Mind you, I can't remember what any of those books were, so I'll have to go home and stare at the bookcases.

Not surprisingly, I thought about Heinlein too. Also not surprisingly - I know which novel you are thinking about even though you don't. It's Glory Road - Oscar Gordon's duel with the Eater of Souls, plus his other skirmishes with various nasty creatures such is the Cold Water Gang and the constructs in Karth Hockesh. The duel scene is one of my favorite pieces of writing EVER - it's exquisite.

I also hope you are not confusing this with the opening scene of Agatha Christie's Mystery of the Spanish Chest with Hercule Poirot.

 

[AngryHobbit]

I play to my advantages, so my writing mostly includes travel, scenery, and thinking - but no fighting. There is sometimes struggle. An occasional slap. But no fighting. Most of my characters are nerds - frequently with very poor fitness levels. You know what all the writing gurus (including Stephen King) say - write what you know.

 

[AngryHobbit]

this is why i kind of suggest looking into old mythology . they will give you a frame work.

Old mythology is a brilliant idea - I pillaged SO much from that. Actually had two short story series with half the characters pulled out from African, Norse, Russian, Native American, Indian, Greek, and other mythologies. Awesome fun! The research on those is sometimes more enjoyable than the writing process itself.

 

[AngryHobbit]

Except prequels can be convoluted and boring.

Depends on who writes the prequel. Be someone who writes good ones - and you'll have no problem at all.