Agreed. I'm probably somewhere between you and what I'm talking about. Your background probably leads to a more formal and systematic view of the weapon. I see it as part of a continuum of sticks, and tend to deal only with rudimentary technique, which I expect you cover but also have the background to go beyond. So I'm probably less systematic than you, though we both view the weapon seriously. And some folks (what I was talking about in recent posts) just want to learn a staff because it's kinda cool (and it is). They may not have a functional purpose, just want to learn a new skill. In that case, bad habits (things that would interfere with developing fighting skill with the staff) aren't really an issue unless they create some safety risk. I'm trying to learn to consider folks who learn for these kinds of purposes. I've learned (mostly through MartialTalk discussions) that there are some pretty committed people who really just want to learn something new, and aren't focused on fighting skill. I used to look down my nose at that kind of pursuit, but that's just me projecting my "should" on them.