Hapkido As An Olympic Sport

[Black Belt FC]

Lets face it gentleman the best way to attract a large audience to Hapkido is by tapping unto the sport side of the art. Hapkido has the kicks of Taekwondo, hand techniques of Karate, throws and floor techniques of Judo; it will make a major impact.





Focusing on trying to make it an Olympic sport will help united the associations or kwans under one umbrella like the Kukkiwon, to create one governing body for standards and certification. Creating a governing body will help weep out the trouble makers.

 

[Paul B]

Interesting idea, Felix.

I'm sure you have seen the rules for Hanminjok sparring. Is this the type of rules you would like to see in the Olympics?

 

[zac_duncan]

Agreed, that's the best way to attract a large audience.

Now, why do we want a large audience?

 

[arnisador]

Where can I find the rules for Hanminjok sparring?

 

[Paul B]

You might try www.kidohae.com


You'll probably have to shoot them a email. There is a short overview of "types" of sparring on the site.

 

[Martial Tucker]

Agreed, that's the best way to attract a large audience.

Now, why do we want a large audience?

I agree with this sentiment, and would add the old adage: "be careful what you wish for..."

I'm not usually the "alarmist" type, and I am perhaps speaking just a bit out of turn here, as my primary art has been a very traditional TKD curriculum
for about 8 years. But, our TKD curriculum includes a very healthy dose of Hapkido taught by a 6th dan, and the techniques and philosophy that I have
learned are quite brutal and designed to disable and/or maim, if done properly and with "attitude". Having said that, I am far from being an expert in HKD by any stretch, but it really escapes me as to how this brutal, self-defense art can be adapted to Olympic-level competition without watering down the material, and applying such a multitude of safety rules for the competition that the resulting "sport" bears little resemblance to the
"mother art". Does this sound familiar or "ring any bells" with all of the people who have opinions on the validity of "sport" TKD as an art?

If you do adapt the style such that a safe competition "branch" would get greater exposure and reach a broader audience, and become popular, are you possibly stepping onto the "slippery slope" that ends with Hapkido "mcdojangs" and 12 year old 3rd dans and endless debates about the merits of sport vs. traditional HKD, as has unfortunately brought such unwanted negative attention to TKD? Again, I hate to be alarmist, but where does it stop? I am not a hapkidoin, but from what I have seen happen in TKD, my feeling is: leave HKD as it is....a brutal, but beautiful art steeped in tradition and sound principles.

 

[Paul B]

Give the man a cigar! (I like your band,BTW)

*My* take on it is pretty much the same. Even when reading through the sparring "rules"...it struck me as watered down and basically no fun.

The whole thing seems to be asking for someone to...break something+hospital+lawyer= lawsuit.

There was a specific passage in the Hanminjok rules that said "appropriate use of yu-sool techniques"......? To me,that says that somethings "gettin busted". How else would one "appropriately use" a yu sool technique,eh? Got me.

Speaking for myself...I would find it very hard to *not* go a little hard and fast when applying yu sool at speed..how about you?

 

[zac_duncan]

leave HKD as it is....a brutal, but beautiful art steeped in tradition and sound principles.

Can I get an Amen?

Well said. Keep the sports away from my HKD.

 

[jujutsu_indonesia]

Lets face it gentleman the best way to attract a large audience to Hapkido is by tapping unto the sport side of the art. Hapkido has the kicks of Taekwondo, hand techniques of Karate, throws and floor techniques of Judo; it will make a major impact.


Focusing on trying to make it an Olympic sport will help united the associations or kwans under one umbrella like the Kukkiwon, to create one governing body for standards and certification. Creating a governing body will help weep out the trouble makers.

Uh oh... I think a group called JJIF (Ju-Jitsu International Federation http://www.jjifweb.com/) is already in the World Games... and of all Jujutsu groups in the world, they have the best chances to introduce Jujutsu in the Olympics. Since Hapkido and Jujutsu pretty much looks the same (from a layman's point of view), perhaps Hapkido people can compete in Jujutsu competitions and won medals for their countries. Ain't it great?

 

[jujutsu_indonesia]

Here are a brief look at their rules

Ju-Jitsu Competitions



The Jutsukas compete at National level, and the best athletes of every Member Nation are allowed to participate in the local Continental Championships (organised by the local Union) and eventually the World Competitions (which take place every two years).

A well-determined score system based on Continental and World Championship results is then used to assess who the top 4 or 6 seeded Countries (and not athletes!) are for each category. These Countries will then have the right to present their athletes to compete in the International World Games (every four years) only in the categories for which they have qualified.



The Ju-Jitsu International Federation currently contemplates two different types of Competitions at world level: the Duo System and the Fighting System.

The former is a discipline in which a pair of Jutsukas from the same team show possible self-defence techniques against a series of 12 attacks, randomly called by the mat referee from the 20 codified attacks to cover the following typologies: grip attack (or strangulation), embrace attack (or necklock), hit attack (punch or kick) and armed attack (stick or knife).



The Duo System has three competition categories: male, female or mixed, and the athletes are judged for their speed, accuracy, control and realism. It is arguably the most spectacular form of Ju-jitsu competition and it requires great technical preparation, synchronism and elevated athletic qualities.

With a different approach, the Fighting System is articulated in a series of two-round, one-on-one combats between athletes from opposing teams. The system is divided in 10 categories according to weight and sex (Male categories: -62 kg, -69kg, -77kg, -85kg, -94kg, +94kg; Female categories –55kg, -62kg, -70kg, +70kg). The actual combat is divided in three phases (Parts): Part I sees the Jutsukas involved in distance combat (controlled attacks with arms and legs and atemis of various nature). Once a grab has been made the Fight enters Part II and hits are no longer allowed.



The Jutsukas try to bring one another down with various throwing techniques (and points are given according to how "clean" and effective the action was). Once down on the tatamis (mats) the match enters its Part III. Here points are given for immobilisation techniques, controlled strangulations or levers on body joints that bring the opponent to yield. The winner is the Jutsuka who has accumulated most points during the fight. Automatic victory is assigned to the Jutsuka who gets an "Ippon" (clean action, full points) in all three Parts or who outscores his opponent with a 14 point score difference by the end of round one. This type of competition requires timing, agility, strength and endurance.

I am sure Hapkido people will adapt very quickly to these rules!

 

[howard]

True Hapkido is not a sport at all. It is a martial art of self defense, the techniques of which are intended to do damage to an attacker. Original Hapkido and sport are mutually exclusive concepts. There are simply no two ways about this.

If you're doing something that involves rules-based competition, it is not traditional Hapkido - full stop.

 

[Paul B]

Well said,Howard.

I have been giving this some heavy thought recently because of the "sparring rules" in our Hapkido Org.

I must admit that the resulting mix of acceptable and "legal" techniques makes for a potentially watered down training focus,furthermore... *I* think it would be all to easy for Hapkidoin who are interested in competition to ignore the painfully effective and admittedly brutal self defense aspects that make Hapkido what it is,opting instead to score the quick and easy point for the win.

I would have a difficult time trying to justify cherry-picking techniques to teach to students who are interested in competition and trying to teach the Art as I have leaned it thus far to students who choose to focus on plain ol' Hapkido.

I say with emphasis...."What's the point?"

Hapkido,to me, is nothing that I would ever want to see people trying to do to each other in competition or elsewhere.

 

[Brad Dunne]

To quote Yogi Berra, "Hey! it's deja vu all over again"..............:shrug:

Want to see what will happen to "Sport Hapkido"? Just take a look at TKD

 

[searcher]

Hey, if they can have Curling in the Winter Olympics then surely Hapkido can be a summer sport. It never hurts to try. It may ahve an impact on other styles as well. I am for anything that gets students in the door, within reason.

 

[jujutsu_indonesia]

Hey, if they can have Curling in the Winter Olympics then surely Hapkido can be a summer sport. It never hurts to try. It may ahve an impact on other styles as well. I am for anything that gets students in the door, within reason.

Hehehe.... imagine this: finally Sport Jujutsu became an Olympic Sport, then at the first Olympic tournament, the Japanese were soundly defeated by the Korean Team which uses Hapkido... that would be the ultimate revenge!! (joking mode on.. don't kick me )

 

[howard]

Hi Paul, imo you've made some good points.

I got flamed earlier today on another board for posting almost the same thing that you replied to... was basically accused of being one of those dudes who says "Hapkido can't be used in competition because its techniques are too deadly." Now, I never said anything of the sort... all I said was that there was NO competitive component in Choi Young Sool's art. Therefore, if you practice a form of Hapkido that has competition, it is not Choi's original art. And those are simple, indisuptable facts. I'm not making any judgments about folks who decide to adapt their Hapkido to competition, although it's not for me.

I agree that the training mindset for competition is different from that of self-defense... and, having studied the old stuff for so many years, would probably have great difficulty adapting the Hapkido I know to competition. But, if people want to adapt the techiques by making them safe for competition, I don't have a problem with that. However, I think they should realize that what they're doing is something very different from the original art. That's really all I'm trying to say.

Take care...

Well said,Howard.

I have been giving this some heavy thought recently because of the "sparring rules" in our Hapkido Org.

I must admit that the resulting mix of acceptable and "legal" techniques makes for a potentially watered down training focus,furthermore... *I* think it would be all to easy for Hapkidoin who are interested in competition to ignore the painfully effective and admittedly brutal self defense aspects that make Hapkido what it is,opting instead to score the quick and easy point for the win.

I would have a difficult time trying to justify cherry-picking techniques to teach to students who are interested in competition and trying to teach the Art as I have leaned it thus far to students who choose to focus on plain ol' Hapkido.

I say with emphasis...."What's the point?"

Hapkido,to me, is nothing that I would ever want to see people trying to do to each other in competition or elsewhere.

 

[searcher]

Maybe then we should all try to get a NHB type competition for the Olympics. This would allow for HKD to compete wihtout the limitations of rules.

 

[mantis]

Lets face it gentleman the best way to attract a large audience to Hapkido is by tapping unto the sport side of the art. Hapkido has the kicks of Taekwondo, hand techniques of Karate, throws and floor techniques of Judo; it will make a major impact.





Focusing on trying to make it an Olympic sport will help united the associations or kwans under one umbrella like the Kukkiwon, to create one governing body for standards and certification. Creating a governing body will help weep out the trouble makers.

why would you want to attract people to your martial art?
i'd rather have an art that no one knows!
also, by making it a sport you will lose what hapkido has now!
away from that, u seem to be a good marketing person, send me ur resume

 

[spud]

One of the main reasons I left TKD is the way it changed in the general mainstream to cater for the Olympic’s, now this only may opinion but I felt it took a great art & changed it into something I wasn’t interested in, had nothing to do with why I started training in or strengthened the core practices of.

Those who wanted to teach the more traditional ways were basically shunned & viewed as of no use to the new generation of students attracted by the lure of being an Olympic hero not a martial artist.

It brought in the masses of westerners & regrettably opened the flood gates for those frauds to pop up on every corner so in the end I was personally embarrassed to by know to do TKD. Not because of TKD but how people then perceived what it was.

I feel if this was attempted with HKD it would have a definite negative effect on the ART. Now we all know how much of the art would have to be omitted or so dramatically changed as to make it acceptable as an Olympic SPORT that what would be seen an perceived to be HKD by the world would in truth have very little resemblance to what HKD really is.

Do we want to attract the masses only to have to re-educate them as to what HKD actually is.

Personally I’d prefer to try to promote HKD in an honest & open manner showing the many benefits & core values of a wonderful art & only attract those people who feel these values & benefits to be truly worth pursuing. Building a solid foundation of people who will ensure the art continues into the future retaining its true beauty & values.

This is only my opinion but it is my hope for the future, stop infighting & focus on improving, promoting & teaching the art not the personalities who feel they are more than the art itself.

 

[SAVAGE]

Lets face it gentleman the best way to attract a large audience to Hapkido is by tapping unto the sport side of the art. Hapkido has the kicks of Taekwondo, hand techniques of Karate, throws and floor techniques of Judo; it will make a major impact.





Focusing on trying to make it an Olympic sport will help united the associations or kwans under one umbrella like the Kukkiwon, to create one governing body for standards and certification. Creating a governing body will help weep out the trouble makers.

I pray this never happens...so few arts are traditional anymore, HKD in my humble opinion is one...to include sports to it...hell why not put a XMA form in it add al kinds of backflips and lets entertain people!