Common Principle

Cthulhu

Senior Master
Founding Member
MTS Alumni
Joined
Sep 1, 2001
Messages
4,526
Reaction score
28
Location
Florida
I think a common principle in many martial arts matters is a 'return to the beginning'. I'll use examples to illustrate this.

1) Circle of Fear
This is sometime common to many systems, though it may have a different name. It refers to the radius about oneself where you would feel threatened. The initial stage is a wide radius, where things that may be threatening cause fear or nervousness without having to be nearby. You can illustrate this with some beginning students by talking to the class as a whole and suddenly lunging at a beginner standing, say, 12 to 15 feet away. Many may jump reflexively.
The middle stage is achieved after some training. The student grows confident in his/her abilities and the radius of the circle of fear tightens. Only direct threats, like an opponent right in front of him/her, is perceived as a threat. The lunges made to the beginner no longer get a response from the more experienced student. In fact, the student may no longer even notice them.
The final stage is a return to the beginning. The radius of the circle is wide once again. However, now it is more like a circle of awareness. Threats are recognized from a distance, but no longer cause a reflexive action unless the danger is imminent. This student notices the lunge made by the instructor to the beginner, but registers it as a harmless act.

2) Reflexes
This has been touched on in another thread. In the beginning, the student responds to attacks reflexively. However, these motions are most likely very inefficient, full of wasted motion with no real combat potential, save the slight hope that they may deflect the threat.
After some training, the student has learned more effective moves. However, the student still has to think about the motions when attacked. The reflexes have been replaced by concious thought, as the brain struggles to remember the appropriate action for the oncoming threat. Time is lost, and many times the action, while appropriate, comes too late.
Eventually, the student will reach a level where he/she responds reflexively once again. However, their neuro-muscular system has been programmed with much more efficient, combat-effective motions. Another 'return to the beginning'.

3) Ye Olde White Belt Story
This last is a somewhat allegorical-type thing, but most -if not all- of us have heard something similar.
It has been said that the original karateka simply wore white belts. There were no other colors. With some training, the belt began to take on colors, from sweat, grass, dirt, etc. Eventually, after years of practice, the belt has become black (with grime...ewwwww). After many more years, the belt is frayed. The color (and nasty ol' muck) has faded. The belt is white again.

Bruce Lee made similar statements in the same vein when he said that at first, a person fights with no form. They begin to learn a system, and fight within the confines of that form. Eventually, after self-analysis and experience, the student will hopefully break the bounds of the form, becoming formless once again. The actions of their opponent, rather than the preconceptions and doctrine of their style, will determine what action they take.

Once again, I think I've rambled to the point where my original idea has been lost in a sea of babbling. If you've managed to pry my point out of this mish-mash, great! If not, I velly solly. :D

Cthulhu
 
D

Despairbear

Guest
I often get quizical looks from people who ask me how my training is going and I tell them that every year I find out how much less I know. It is an interesting dichotomy that the more we train the the less we realise we know.



Despair Bear
 

Jay Bell

Master Black Belt
MTS Alumni
Joined
Nov 12, 2001
Messages
1,052
Reaction score
34
Location
Where it's real hot..
hehe, I feel your pain. It always seems that just when things get comfortable, I attend a seminar or something clicks inside of me that makes me understand that I don't know a thing.

Two hours can destroy years of training this way (in a postive sense). It keeps everything new..and keeps me humble ;)
 

arnisador

Sr. Grandmaster
MTS Alumni
Joined
Aug 28, 2001
Messages
44,573
Reaction score
456
Location
Terre Haute, IN
Originally posted by Jay Bell
It always seems that just when things get comfortable, I attend a seminar or something clicks inside of me that makes me understand that I don't know a thing.

I felt this way after my first George Dillman seminar--not so much the pressure points as the grappling-based bunkai. It completely changed my view of karate, and it made so much sense! I was somewhat embarrassed that I hadn't seen it sooner and in fact I still am. What a revelation.
 
I

IFAJKD

Guest
The key is to always be a student. Learn from all. It's great to see someone who rocks your understanding of the universe. Training in something that has no ends but many many beginnings to return to Chtu's post. Common theme in many life situations.
 
R

Rob_Broad

Guest
I constantly find the little things that I thought I should have know earlier in everything I do. Then I realize that this just part of the learning process.
 
I

IFAJKD

Guest
I hear ya. I particularly enjoy playing with something and finding a million different ways to apply it. I look at mastery in terms of one technique at a time. You can never get enough. at least I can't
 
OP
Cthulhu

Cthulhu

Senior Master
Founding Member
MTS Alumni
Joined
Sep 1, 2001
Messages
4,526
Reaction score
28
Location
Florida
This is one reason I like doing forms. I'll spend a long time analyzing the movements, trying to apply the different techniques that I can discover. Just when I think I've squeezed every technique and principle out of a form, somebody invariably comes along with a whole bunch of other ones I never would have thought of. I love that.

:D

Cthulhu
 
I

IFAJKD

Guest
one time while nursing a shoulder injury I sat for a long time and disected the jab and the staright blast. It was amazing what I learned from this that was so far beyond what I was taught. That is one of the 1,497,790,999,000,68 things that I love about martial arts ( or somewhere there abouts)
 
R

Rob_Broad

Guest
I have found that I like doing beginner basic forms backwards that way I can find my holes in motion. I often tape video myself doing this so that when I play it in reverse(forward) I can see if my motions are the way they are supposed to be.
 
OP
Cthulhu

Cthulhu

Senior Master
Founding Member
MTS Alumni
Joined
Sep 1, 2001
Messages
4,526
Reaction score
28
Location
Florida
One thing that is challenging for me is to do forms slowly. I've found that I can program my neuro-muscular system fairly easily, to the point where I can do things by 'muscle memory'. This is good and bad. It's just not in martial arts...I've found I can do this with guitar stuff as well.

It's good in that I know the motions are 'hard-wired' into my system. It's bad because if I try to break some things down, I can't do it. My concious brain can't remember it, though if I just whip through the form, I'll nail it. Makes it difficult to teach something if you can't break it down. Similarly, I taught myself a classical guitar piece, just because I liked it. However, if I try to play it at anything other than full speed, which would require concious thought, my fingers tie themselves in knots. I can only play it at the speed at which it was 'programmed' into my system.

Therefore, I always have to work on forms at a slow place every once in awhile to ensure that I will be able to break motions down when needed.

Cthulhu
 

Nightingale

Senior Master
MTS Alumni
Joined
Apr 24, 2002
Messages
2,768
Reaction score
14
Location
California
I like to slow down forms too... it really gives you time to go over every little detail, rather than just rushing.
 

KennethKu

2nd Black Belt
Joined
Aug 3, 2002
Messages
757
Reaction score
17
Originally posted by Despairbear
I often get quizical looks from people who ask me how my training is going and I tell them that every year I find out how much less I know. It is an interesting dichotomy that the more we train the the less we realise we know.

Despair Bear

....and finally you managed to have learnt everything about NOTHING..... lol

Seriously, learning for learning sake is an exercise in academic pursuit. If one's goal in MA training/learning to reach an attainable level of competency so as to apply it to perform a task, such as self defence, security details, teaching, or personal betterment, then, there is a definite level where one's knowledge pushes the edge of the envelope.
 
Top