Black Belts from other styles entering your school

Discussion in 'General Martial Arts Talk' started by Azulx, Jan 14, 2016.

  1. Azulx

    Azulx Black Belt

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    What are efficient ways to handle black belts that come form different styles, or even the same style, in your school?
     
  2. Tony Dismukes

    Tony Dismukes MT Moderator Staff Member

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    What do you mean by "handle"? Are you talking about new students who come in with prior training?
     
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  3. Azulx

    Azulx Black Belt

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    Yes, how do you go about treating these students, and fulfilling their needs.
     
  4. Andrew Green

    Andrew Green Grandmaster

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    Figure out what there needs are, if you can meet them do so, if not don't do business?

    Apart from that they are just another student, treat them like you would anyone else, which should hopefully be to pretty high standards.
     
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  5. Tony Dismukes

    Tony Dismukes MT Moderator Staff Member

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    If the students have a black belt (or other rank) in another style, that's pretty much irrelevant. They start out at white belt like everyone else. If their previous training is in a related art which helps them learn faster, then they will progress through the ranks faster.

    If they have rank (black belt or otherwise) in the same style (BJJ in my case) from another instructor, then they continue to wear that same rank.

    For example, when I started training BJJ I had black belts in two other arts and a brown belt in a third. I started out BJJ as a white belt, but my prior training allowed me to reach blue belt a bit faster than I would have otherwise. When I moved to a new city and enrolled in a new BJJ school, they recognized my blue belt from my first instructor.

    Now I have black belts in BJJ, Bujinkan Taijutsu, and American Kickboxing, but if I were to start training in a new art I would start at white belt (or whatever the beginning rank is in that system).
     
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  6. Dirty Dog

    Dirty Dog MT Senior Moderator Staff Member

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    We treat them like anybody else. Politely and professionally.
    Beyond that, it just depends.
    If someone with Dan ranking from another school comes to us, they're allowed to wear their belt if they want.
    I find that those who want to learn tend to strap on a white belt and work their way up through the ranks.
    In no event will they promote above their current rank until they've learned our curriculum.
    If they're from a similar system, that might not take very long. If they're from a quite different system, it'll likely take longer.

    I really think your question is excessively vague. Perhaps you can clarify exactly what it is you want to know.
     
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  7. Hanzou

    Hanzou Grandmaster

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    I have a black belt in Shotokan. When I started Judo and later Bjj, I wore a white belt both times.

    I couldn't even imagine a Karate guy walking into a Bjj gym wearing a black belt or vice versa unless they're a guest instructor or something.
     
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  8. Azulx

    Azulx Black Belt

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    Thank you for pointing that out. For example if a Tang Soo Do or Shotokan black belts, or even a TKD black belt form a different style, comes into a TKD school. The styles are all fairly similar. How would you go about handling these student in regards to what rank they begin in, and role in the organization. Do they keep their rank? Become the new Senior Student? Do they progress faster, if so , how will that affect the rest of the students watching him/her progress at a faster rate?
     
  9. Dirty Dog

    Dirty Dog MT Senior Moderator Staff Member

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    We'd handle it as I described above.
    We've had that happen a number of times with student from yellow belts on up through a KKW 3rd Dan. They can wear their belt if they like, and they can line up as the most junior person of that rank. If they come in as a 1st Dan, then a 1st Dan they will remain until they have learned our curriculum from 10th Geup through 2nd Dan, at which time they will be eligible for promotion to 2nd Dan. Just like any other student.
    How fast they progress will depend on how much effort they put in. And unless you're in a belt mill, students really ought to be used to the idea that different people will progress at different rates.
    In my experience, they people who want to wear their rank from another system generally don't stay very long. It's probably frustrating wearing a black belt and not being able to do the poomsae that the yellow belts are doing.
    Personally, I'd rather wear a white belt and have people wonder why, than wear a black belt and have people wonder why.
     
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  10. Azulx

    Azulx Black Belt

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    That is great quote, and very insightful information. Thank you so much!
     
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  11. drop bear

    drop bear Sr. Grandmaster

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    We make them take classes and teach us stuff.

    We have a brazil top team guy in next week.
     
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  12. WaterGal

    WaterGal Master of Arts

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    We've had this happen before with a kid - she had a 1st Poom from a TSD place and wanted to switch schools. What we did was let her wear a 1st geup belt (basically for pride reasons, so she wouldn't feel like she was totally starting over), and she spent about a year wearing that belt and learning all of the Taegeuk forms, how to do Olympic-style sparring, getting kicks up to snuff, etc, before doing a test with us for KKW TKD 1st Poom.

    We've had other cases of both kids and adults coming in with prior experience, and I think how you handle it is going to vary a lot by the person - by their age, experience, motivations, goals, personality, etc. For some people, you might agree to fast-track them through like we did for that girl, but have them wear a white belt at first because they'd feel self-conscious wearing an advanced rank and not knowing their stuff. For other people, they might not want any special treatment at all and want to start fresh. Other people might have a big ego and want to wear their high belt so everyone sees what a hotshot they are, which is no good. So it depends.
     
  13. Chester Wright

    Chester Wright Yellow Belt

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    Treat them with respect. But remember that is your house, do not let them disrespect it. Let them know that is your house.

    Ive had people show up and start talking negative about other schools and how they were so much better than those previous schools. Those type of people you have to educate a little more than others.
     
  14. Azulx

    Azulx Black Belt

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    We have a similar issue we have a student from Tang Soo Do and always has some type of comment about how TSD is better that TKD. Especially when he spars, he clearly tries to be over aggressive. We are meeting with him personally, with all the instructors, and telling him what we expect of him. If he doesn't want to change, we will politely ask him to leave.
     
  15. Danny T

    Danny T Senior Master

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    I have black belt ranking is several martial arts and my school provides instruction in multiple martial arts. 2 months ago we began a BJJ class when a BJJ black belt moved into our area. I have participated in every one of the classes as a white belt. Why, because I am a white belt in BJJ.

    When others come in with experience in arts that are different they begin as a white belt however the belt they get is white with a black stripe. This is our way to acknowledge they have experience and are a black belt in something just not in what they are training with us.
     
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  16. Azulx

    Azulx Black Belt

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    We use a stripe on the belts of people who have a black belt from other arts as well. I was really looking to see if it was common practice, by other schools to let them wear their rank, from their other program(s).
     
  17. Tez3

    Tez3 Sr. Grandmaster

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    Our adult's class is MMA so no belts anyway but we often have martial artists passing through when they are on courses so they are welcomed into the club with or without belts. Often if it's a black belt we invite them to take a part of the session to pass on a little of their knowledge and they do the same as everyone else for the remainder, it's usually a very satisfactory exchange of information for everyone. The only odd one I remember was a brown belt Judoka ( and a military policeman) who bit someone while grappling, that was weird.
     
  18. RTKDCMB

    RTKDCMB Senior Master

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    How do I handle black belts from other styles when they come to train at my school?

    They are ALL white belts when they start at my school so I treat them like any other student.
     
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  19. JP3

    JP3 Master Black Belt

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    My question for the O/P is what do you mean by "efficiently?"

    Personally, the way I handle anyone with experience of any sort who comes to my school is to greet them warmly, ask about that experience and how much of it there is/was, and with whom. See if there are any points of congruency or even nearly so with what I/we do, then explore wha the differences both perceived and real, happen to be.

    Then we go have class. I find it efficient. I also find out pretty quick if they are of he mindset that "What I learned first is the bestest of them all." Which is really never true. The bestest of them all question is very individual, of course, but is hardly ever the first thing/art that one learns. Even if you are only in one style for 40 years, the way you did it in yoru first decade is, has to be, WAY different than the way you do it in your fourth decade, and I bet the last decade is mucho awesomer than the front end.
     
  20. lklawson

    lklawson Senior Master

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    Am I the only one noticing this? This is the third or fourth thread in the last 7 days or so in which the subject of students from another system wearing their "belt rank" in another system's school. The old saw is, "Once is an accident. Twice is coincidence. Three times is an enemy action."

    I don't know if it's coincidence or not but this many times certainly sticks out.

    Is there some sort of movie or something which is suddenly making people think about this?

    Peace favor your sword,
    Kirk123
     

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