Am I Man Enough for Ninjutsu?

Discussion in 'Ninjutsu' started by adpatterson, Jan 15, 2017.

  1. JP3

    JP3 Master Black Belt

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    I agree with DropBear, there was some douchbaggery going on.

    I also agree with KangTsai, that if your fitness level was better and your ability to move (not being able to get to the ground quick is a huge problem in arts which use lock submissions)(.

    I combine both of the above statements into the class was, even if unconsciously, trying to drive some sort of point home. This is my opinion. Problem is, the end result... what your doc said... I have to contradict you, that is rather spectacular!

    I mean, whoa... here's what you said: "According to my doctor this afternoon I had a dislocated left shoulder, broken metacarpals on my right hand, strained right groin, strain lower right back, and an over sense of brokenness and humility."

    And you got about half of that in the first class and you WENT BACK two days later. That, in itself, is showing some great intestinal fortitude.

    I agree again with Drop, a boxing gym is a great fit because of the extreme aerobic exercise you'll have to put yourself through. Just take it easy, and stepwise. Don't expect to be able to do a typical 20-round workout your first day. Best find a boxing club, go in and talk to one of the old guys,a nd get a plan. Follow the plan, and keep written hnotes on paper or in your phone. Don't push too hard at the outset, but each day go just a ... ittle... farther, a ... bit ... more energy consumed. Best of luck, but I think you can do it.
     
  2. Brian R. VanCise

    Brian R. VanCise MT Moderator Staff Member

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    Fitness and flexibility, we all need it. In hearing your story that would be a major focus for me going forward.
     
  3. jks9199

    jks9199 Administrator Staff Member

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    Did you advise the instructor about the joint condition?

    I am concerned about the number of injuries you suffered. Good training will include some bumps and bruises and discomfort, and even the occasional injury. But for a new student, absent a real accident or significant misunderstanding of directions (e.g., walked into something or slipped and fell, landing terribly), there shouldn't be major injuries that involve seeing a doctor.

    Chris and Tony have answered well, and, while I see concerns -- I'm also not absolutely trashing the teacher/class. But you certainly should talk to the instructor (who will also be a good source for referrals to a club or class closer to you, probably...) about it.
     
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  4. adpatterson

    adpatterson White Belt

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    Actually I didn't even think about my joint condition at the time of going to class or writing this initially. It's not something that I deal with on a daily basus. I only about 5-6 years ago found that there was actually a name for it. We were having diagnostics done on my son, they said it was genetic then interviewed me, even though we knew imeadiately after hearing genetic.
     
  5. Brian King

    Brian King Master Black Belt

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    Folks tend to work 'harder' on bigger folks. A good training partner is honest and lets their partner know when there is pain and injury. Not too many want to injure their partner and would appreciate someone tapping or saying that they are injured.

    You are in Charlotte area? I like that area having gone there a few times for Systema seminars. Good food and good people and great training.

    Good luck in your training.
    Regards
    Brian King
     
  6. adpatterson

    adpatterson White Belt

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    Well its very similar if not almost identical.
    I'm having an issue actually tapping, i just yell in pain typically. Once I'm in a joint-lock i'm already getting my other arm ready to brace the impact of getting put to the groud. If I dont the impact will be far too much for my body (actually either way is at this point...) I'm gonna talk with everyone Thursday I guess. It's hard as a man, when you go in there and have to ask people to go easy on you. It may sound silly but it's the truth, that's the way we men are born!
    This was a very encouraging thing to say, I felt great hearing this! Sometime we loose sight of what is actually in us. Thank You!
     
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  7. JB28205

    JB28205 White Belt

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    Aaron,
    I'm really sorry you were injured. I've been going to the same class you went to for many years, and there has never been any serious injury as far as I know. We work at really low speed, particularly with new people and generally take care to make sure everyone wants to come back. For the green and particularly the black belts, we all go home with bruises which is the nature of a 'martial' art, but that's the extent of it.

    It sounds like you might have some skeletal and fitness issues that should probably be addressed before you get into martial arts again. You had some spinal issues back in 2014? There are a lot of great resources online for low impact fitness. Vahva Fitness on youtube is one of my favorites for building flexibility and strength.

    As a 45 year old man, I am well aquainted with the pains and strains of getting older. The important thing is to keep flexibility and know your limits. That 100lb girl in the class gets the better of me sometimes too and I've had to tell her to take it easy or back off. No pride lost. It's all about learning.

    Again, very sorry about your injuries.
     
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  8. JP3

    JP3 Master Black Belt

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    I think I know this girl... she seems to be travelling from school to school, intentionally destroying the self-esteem of her older male training partners. I'm not sure if she's goind it on purpose or not.

    J/K...
     
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  9. fatninja

    fatninja Yellow Belt

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    Hey there, I am 50 5'9" 250 lbs, I had my second class, it's not without struggle, My first class I got winded just doing the stretching exercises, lol , and the various stretches are difficult for me at times, but each class I get better and able to do juuuuust a little bit more as far as flexibility goes,I still have to practice my Kaiten rolls, as far as the class ,it's small and very well controlled, I don't get beat up or twisted like a pretzel like the more senior guys, my instructor gives them some advanced moves to practice, then works with me on the basics I need to know. I really do loooooove this class, instructor and martial art in general.
     
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  10. gojusi

    gojusi White Belt

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    Hi Adpatterson,

    I'm a new member here but I have 5 years of Wing Chun experience and i've just started up Goju-Ryu Karate. Here's my 2 cents: I think you've got two issues here. 1) You have joined a poor club (not your fault, you don't know until you've tried) and 2) Ninjutsu isn't going to get you fit. I'll elaborate on my thoughts.

    You made me laugh with your original post (I think you intended the humour, about the pregnant cow thing!) but you've identified that you've got some weight that needs shifting and it's amazing that you've decided to join a martial arts class. I'm probably one of only a few people who knows someone who has done Ninjutsu for the long term. From what he tells me (and shows me), Ninjutsu isn't going to get you fit by itself. Ninjutsu is a philosophy, a way of life and about locks/submissions etc. It's something you do when you're already fit (some may disagree, but that's the impression I get when I speak to my friend who practices it).

    As for the injuries you picked up...wow. That's simply a poor club. There is no way you should be getting injured on your first lesson. Maybe a bruise or two at the most. But I digress. I remember whilst I was training Kung Fu, there was a guy who wanted to injure people - he didn't last long at the club. Good instructors will not allow their members to get hurt by overly aggressive members. Incidentally - martial artists shouldn't be the overly-aggressive type. If members of a club cannot show restraint and know when they're inflicting too much damage - they're not good. Period.

    My friend was showing me a Ninjutsu submission whereby his two hands were using my clothing to choke me. He tried it on me and just as I was about to tap out, before I even made the tap noise, he let go. He knew from the way I winced that I had felt it, and that was it.

    So. My suggestion is this: you will want to find a Kung Fu or Karate class (Shotokan, or Goju-Ryu). The reason being: I always find Karate/Kung-Fu classes tend to have fantastic warm ups that start off relatively slow. You'll stretch your legs, your feet, your hands, your neck etc. There will be some jumping around - but don't overdo it, just do what you can. I say this with all seriousness: don't give yourself a heart attack..... just ease yourself into all of this. For example, if you manage to throw 10 punches in lesson 1. Try throwing 15 punches in lesson 2. In lesson 3, if you throw 20 punches, you've made progress.

    Martial arts is about progress. Going into lesson 1 and getting injured so you can't make lesson 2 isn't progress - that's actually sending you backwards. Bottom line: find a better club that involves stretching and a good warm up and takes into account your current fitness levels, however good or bad they may be. A good club will strive to help make your fitness better, which in turn, will help your martial arts studies come along nicely.

    Best wishes,
    Gojusi
     
  11. Chris Parker

    Chris Parker Grandmaster

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    Hmm...

    Hi, Gojusi. Firstly, welcome aboard. Secondly, I get that you feel you're offering good advice, but honestly, you're overstepping your bounds quite a bit here... for one thing, "I'm probably one of the few people who knows someone who has done Ninjutsu for the long term"... uh, you do realise there are members here who have trained in those exact arts for decades, yeah? To be completely frank, to someone like myself, and a number of others here, you are little more than a beginner when it comes to martial arts... and almost completely knowledge-less in this area.

    You don't know if the class was. a poor one, so suggesting that it is is not a good idea, nor a positive one.

    While you're right that Ninjutsu is not particularly geared towards getting you fit the same way that sport arts are, or going to the gym is, it is a damn sight better than not doing anything. So Aaron should be encouraged, rather than being told he should not do what he's chosen to do.

    As far as disagreeing with you, yeah, I'm going to disagree with you... and that's with a few decades in the art, mate. As well as a karate background, a TKD background, training in BJJ, and a number of other things. No, you don't need to be fit to start Ninjutsu. And, as with anything, the type of fitness is geared to the activity... Ninjutsu will get you fit in the ways you need to be to train in the art successfully.

    As far as the injuries, again, you don't know exactly what happened, or how it occurred... so your assumption that it was a bad class, rather than poor preparation on the OP's part, or due to his pre-existing medical condition (which wasn't mentioned initially, you may note), is not something that is necessarily supported by the actual reality.

    I encourage you to recognise that the format of a forum is text based... and we are getting a part of a single version of a story here. Jumping to too many conclusions isn't helpful... and telling people to do something other than what they're interested in, regardless of your views, is simply not helpful at all.
     
  12. gojusi

    gojusi White Belt

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    Well I guess that's my first and last post on this forum. I was being helpful and for you to say I'm not being helpful is quite offensive. Regardless of how many years of experience you have, OP implied he was injured in that class. So find another Ninjutsu school, fine, but I wouldn't take those kind of injuries and return there.

    Anyway, take care. I'm out.
     
  13. Chris Parker

    Chris Parker Grandmaster

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    Well... I suppose that's one way to learn from your mistakes.
     
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  14. drop bear

    drop bear Sr. Grandmaster

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    Remember that post where you. Said more people would respect me if... And how a conversation works?

    Read that post again.
     
  15. Chris Parker

    Chris Parker Grandmaster

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    They would respect your input more... and frankly, if you think this is the same thing, you're (again) completely off base.
     
  16. fatninja

    fatninja Yellow Belt

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    ,
    Hi Ad Patterson, I am going to chime in here, for what my advice is worth, I am 50 years old and like you I am overweight, I have joint issues, particularly both knees and right shoulder, I have a torn right bicep and chronic back pain, I only have 2 classes under my belt ,that being said, I find that taking a Glucosamine supplement helps my knees, I find the pre class stretching to be very helpful, the first two classes I always get the jitters, sometimes tempted to turn back, but I make myself go in and glad I did every time, and each class I am more and more comfortable. I believe you can still do this if you want, even with a joint condition, you chose Ninjutsu/ Budo Taijutsu for a reason, not Karate or Kung Fu,so enjoy it and embrace it, you just might have to alter how you train a little, but man GO FOR IT!!!!!!!! I bet Hatsumi Sensei, being up in years has issues he overcomes and adapts to training and he moves like a spring chicken. If you need a buddy to compare experiences being as we both are starting equally, I am always here ;) And as an aside my weight really hasn't been an issue so far.
     
    Last edited: Feb 8, 2017
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  17. JR 137

    JR 137 Senior Master

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    Just a point of order, the quoted message is your last post, not the previous one :)

    But in all seriousness, Chris is Chris. Don't get offended. Everyone here knows him, good, bad, and indifferent.

    Stick around.
     
  18. Aiki Lee

    Aiki Lee Master of Arts

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    Your intention may have been in the right place, but your information was way off base.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
  19. drop bear

    drop bear Sr. Grandmaster

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    And what is the correct information then?
     
  20. drop bear

    drop bear Sr. Grandmaster

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    You mean where you have just insulted posters without adding any informational content.

    You are basically trolling.

    Read that response. Apart from you being awesome and everyone else being ignorant what did you contribute to the discussion?

    I would be surprised if you actually answer that question.

    I mean fatninja who has been training two days has been more helpful.
     
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