XMA - your feelings?

[Balrog]

I personally think that, regardless of the name, XMA is not martial arts. At best, it's dance routines, bad gymnastics combines with bad techniques that look kinda sorta like martial arts techniques. Sure, it's flashy, movie-fu stuff, but it ain't martial arts.

To be considered as a martial art, a discipline should have a grounding in self-defense. XMA has none. I have heard of schools offering rank in XMA and I consider them to be like the schools that offered rank in Tae Bo.

That's my opinion. What's yours?

 

[clfsean]

Great athletes... crap martial like performance arts.

 

[sfs982000]

Our school has an XMA demo team which if that is what you like than so be it. Personally I'm not a big fan of it either, but in defense of my school the XMA part is seperate from the regular classes and they do not offer a separate ranking structure with it.

 

[fangjian]

XMA is awesome.

You mentioned it's not 'martial arts' though. What if some of their techniques are trained with combat in mind. Is it martial arts now?

 

[bushidomartialarts]

Depends what you mean by "martial arts"

The primary advantage an MMA fighter has in a street fight is his ungodly level of physical conditioning.

How is XMA different, really? A guy strong and coordinated enough to do an aerial 540 will destroy your knee with a low-line attack.

Seems like everybody from around blue belt to low black feels the need to dis other styles. At a certain level, you figure out that they're all just different paths up the same damn mountain.

 

[Josh Oakley]

Olympic taekwondo is a martial art, why not xma?

 

[Nomad]

It's a great fun and flashy art that looks terrific in demonstrations.

Martial? Not so much, unless you can show me bunkai for that cartwheel you just did

 

[Steve]

Depends what you mean by "martial arts"

The primary advantage an MMA fighter has in a street fight is his ungodly level of physical conditioning.

Whoa... hold on a minute. Perhaps I'm reading too much into this, but do you believe that athletes who train in MMA are unskilled? Because, that's what I understood from your post. Surely, I'm mistaken. It really sounded to me like you basically equated MMA to XMA with regards to applicable martial skill.

For what it's worth, I love XMA, but view it as more of a performance art than martial art... akin to Wushu. Doesn't mean it can't be adapted, but it's intentionally showy.

 

[Tez3]

MMA fighters aren't always men but are nearly all martial artists in traditional styles. Many I know are BBs. Fighters I know are all experienced martial artists from different styles.

XMA is turning up quite regularly on 'Britain's Got Talent' which I think shows that even it's exponents think it's entertainment rather than a combat style/sport.

Slightly off topic, last Satuday's BGT was fascinating, real combat ...between a small girl reciting a poem and the Boa Constrictor wrapping itself ever tighter round her neck, I was shouting for the snake, brilliant technique.

 

[Steve]

MMA fighters aren't always men but are nearly all martial artists in traditional styles. Many I know are BBs. Fighters I know are all experienced martial artists from different styles.

Of course, all the really good ones are men. Just kidding. Welcome back, Tez.

 

[bushidomartialarts]

Steve...they're highly skilled, but they train for a sport, with rules. They have habits that hurt them in the street. A kenpo or krav maga guy would be just as justified in calling them "not martial artists" as a traditional hapkidoist would be in calling XMA guys "not martial artists".

Which is to say -- from my way of thinking -- not very justified at all in either case.

 

[Steve]

Steve...they're highly skilled, but they train for a sport, with rules. They have habits that hurt them in the street. A kenpo or krav maga guy would be just as justified in calling them "not martial artists" as a traditional hapkidoist would be in calling XMA guys "not martial artists".

Which is to say -- from my way of thinking -- not very justified at all in either case.

Okay. Let's take a step back. You said that a mixed martial artist's primary asset is physical conditioning. Can you tell me what you think of when you use the term Mixed Martial Artist? Do you believe that the skills they learn are impractical "in the street?" Which habits will hurt them?

I'm really surprised to see this topic come up again.

 

[bushidomartialarts]

Steve, I've gone into detail on this in a number of other threads and don't want to derail this one. Any sport art has disadvantages in a street fight as compared to defense-oriented arts, and those defense-oriented arts tend not to produce people as well-conditioned as a sport art, and neither produce people with a level of ethical/spiritual development as many traditional arts.

It's all a big, pointless game of rock-paper-scissors.

My point wasn't that MMA guys suck. It's that everybody rocks. So why do people keep trying to exclude one art or the other -- or get into arguments about whose "kung-fu is best"?

 

[JohnEdward]

It is a good thing and not

 

[JohnEdward]

Well, I have seen it coming since the 1980s with the martial arts arcade video games, Jackie Chan (a real talented and amazing martial artist), Power Rangers, and alike movies seem to inspire XMA. Here is a pretty good overview from the guy who is trying to promote XMA to feed the entertainment business back 2007.

My feeling is that labeling what they do as XMA is a good step because it differentiates it from traditional martial arts, and sport martial arts like MMA. I don't think of it as a bad thing necessarily. In a way it does bring the public's attention to martial arts in a positive palatable way, um...puts it in neon lights? Especially for kids, teenagers and their parents. Parents really like to see their kid perform rather than lose a fight. Parents can be more involved taking an active role in coaching their kids at home without any special language, knowledge or skill. Once those kids get to a certain age the may move into a more traditional art. If not at least they have a greater appreciation for martial arts than if they never did any martial art before.

Now this hurts many traditional martial arts places who are struggling to make ends meet and relay on teaching kids to keep them afloat. XMA is far more appealing and exciting to a greater number of kids and parents than traditional martial arts. It can confuse people's understanding of the difference between traditional martial arts and XMA. Plus, the other downsides of XMA already mentioned.

 

[Steve]

Steve, I've gone into detail on this in a number of other threads and don't want to derail this one. Any sport art has disadvantages in a street fight as compared to defense-oriented arts, and those defense-oriented arts tend not to produce people as well-conditioned as a sport art, and neither produce people with a level of ethical/spiritual development as many traditional arts.

It's all a big, pointless game of rock-paper-scissors.

My point wasn't that MMA guys suck. It's that everybody rocks. So why do people keep trying to exclude one art or the other -- or get into arguments about whose "kung-fu is best"?

Point me to those threads, if you don't mind. To say I disagree is an understatement. Unless we're at the hootenanny and it's all about free love, I think you're entirely off base.

 

[Steve]

Steve, I've gone into detail on this in a number of other threads and don't want to derail this one. Any sport art has disadvantages in a street fight as compared to defense-oriented arts, and those defense-oriented arts tend not to produce people as well-conditioned as a sport art, and neither produce people with a level of ethical/spiritual development as many traditional arts.

It's all a big, pointless game of rock-paper-scissors.

My point wasn't that MMA guys suck. It's that everybody rocks. So why do people keep trying to exclude one art or the other -- or get into arguments about whose "kung-fu is best"?

Point me to those threads, if you don't mind. To say I disagree is an understatement. Unless we're at the hootenanny and it's all about free love, I think you're entirely off base.

 

[bushidomartialarts]

Here's a relatively recent one.

http://www.martialtalk.com/forum/showthread.php?t=87373

IM (not very) HO, it's much more about the instructor and the student than about the art you choose. Goals are also important...as a BJJ guy, your goals are clearly different from a Tai Chi guy. And both of you are different from a TKD tricker.

But all of you are martial artists. Who are you to take that title from somebody?

 

[threethirty]

For what it's worth, I love XMA, but view it as more of a performance art than martial art... akin to Wushu. Doesn't mean it can't be adapted, but it's intentionally showy.

Implying Wushu isnt a martial art. IIRC wushu literally means martial art. The forms are there to develop muscle memory.

As someone who does both Kung-Fu and Wushu I can tell you it is real martial arts.

 

[Tez3]

Thanx Steve, your fault I'm back lol and to the same arguments !

Forms/kata/patterns aren't for muscle memory they contain what in karate is called Bunkai.

Most of my MMA students are soldiers, while they shouldn't fight outside they are squaddies so they do, MMA hasn't given them any disadvantages, quite the opposite actually. Many MMA people do the doors here, MMA certainly doesn't give them any disadvantages. I really don't want to go through all that 'MMA fighters can only fight under rules' rubbish yet again.

If the XMA people only train XMA I do doubt they will be able to fight/defend themselves but if they also train their style properly I have no doubt they will be able to fight. There's quite a few places that teach non touch sparring etc, they also will not be able to defend themselves. If you want me to put it brutally, MMA trains people to hurt other people as do other styles when trained properly.

XMA is entertaining gymnastics, I'd like to see the other side, if they have one, of their training.