U.K Police Shoot to Kill......

[Bammx2]

Greetings y'all.....

I just woke up to the news here in the UK of the police chasing,shooting(5x's) and killing a suspected suicide bomber in a tube station.....just under 2 miles from me.
As was one of the tube station bombs yesterday.
The news is saying the armed response unit apparently has been given the OK to shoot to kill now as far as this "terrorsit" stuff is concerned.
An east london Mosque has been surounded by armed police as well.
But this seems the hot spot for recruiting these people.
The muslim community is in a MAJOR uproar right now and already talking about marching on london in protest.
THAT will get nasty.
There's some things that have happened that won't make the news.
The image the UK is giving the rest of the world is NOT the image of whats going on here inside.
It's going to get worse.

 

[Kane]

Greetings y'all.....

I just woke up to the news here in the UK of the police chasing,shooting(5x's) and killing a suspected suicide bomber in a tube station.....just under 2 miles from me.
As was one of the tube station bombs yesterday.
The news is saying the armed response unit apparently has been given the OK to shoot to kill now as far as this "terrorsit" stuff is concerned.
An east london Mosque has been surounded by armed police as well.
But this seems the hot spot for recruiting these people.
The muslim community is in a MAJOR uproar right now and already talking about marching on london in protest.
THAT will get nasty.
There's some things that have happened that won't make the news.
The image the UK is giving the rest of the world is NOT the image of whats going on here inside.
It's going to get worse.

Well at least the police are finally using guns despite the ban on guns for civilians and police if I'm correct.

Yes this will probably get nasty (especially considering you made two threads about it, but I think police action like this is necessary other wise these few radicals will try an attack like this again. Actually about a month or two ago their was a huge anti-american and anti-british rally happening in a radical muslims group. They were chanting stuff like "bomb bomb Pentagon" or "death to Tony Blair". With these type of people we need to crack down on them quickly and hopefully escape the politically correct mumbo jumbo as well.

 

[jonah2]

.....The muslim community is in a MAJOR uproar right now and already talking about marching on london in protest.
THAT will get nasty.....

My opinion is that the muslim comunity have to do something within their own midst. I've seen numerous religious leaders from the muslim community comming forward denouncing these terrorist elements saying they are not followers of the true islam. If that is so, why are these elements not being exposed by the true muslim peacful society.

If it is proved that this person was a terrorist then justice has prevailed - but of course its just more loss of life

Jonah

 

[Bammx2]

Well at least the police are finally using guns despite the ban on guns for civilians and police if I'm correct.

Yes this will probably get nasty (especially considering you made two threads about it, but I think police action like this is necessary other wise these few radicals will try an attack like this again. Actually about a month or two ago their was a huge anti-american and anti-british rally happening in a radical muslims group. They were chanting stuff like "bomb bomb Pentagon" or "death to Tony Blair". With these type of people we need to crack down on them quickly and hopefully escape the politically correct mumbo jumbo as well.

Oops......

Sorry bout that.I have no idea how I made 2 posts on the same thing.
Thanks for pointing that out.
One thing that is being harped on quite heavily now and publicly,
is if the muslim community doesn't want to recognise western laws,then they should police thier own and stop this stuff from within and the westerners won't get involved....as much.
BUT...you live here,you abide here!
I could care less what your beliefs are and your opinions on the world,but in a sense,any government is like your momma and daddy.
When you live under thier roof,you abide by thier rules.
You don't like them....move.

 

[Gemini]

I agree that Muslims, being mostly peaceful, need to intervene in their own affairs. To some degree, I think this may well be happening. I just heard (CNN) that they have had serveillance on this individual for some time, just waiting for him to make his move. That information came from somewhere, right? :idunno: How many more tips are coming in? How many more individuals are being watched?

 

[Flatlander]

Mod Note:

Duplicate thread tossed.

-Dan Bowman-
-MT Moderator-

 

[Bammx2]

Mod Note:

Duplicate thread tossed.

-Dan Bowman-
-MT Moderator-

Thanks for that.
I have no idea how it happened.

 

[kenpochad]

Oops......
I could care less what your beliefs are and your opinions on the world,but in a sense,any government is like your momma and daddy.
When you live under thier roof,you abide by thier rules.
You don't like them....move.

Amen brother
I hop every thing works out

 

[sgtmac_46]

Greetings y'all.....

I just woke up to the news here in the UK of the police chasing,shooting(5x's) and killing a suspected suicide bomber in a tube station.....just under 2 miles from me.
As was one of the tube station bombs yesterday.
The news is saying the armed response unit apparently has been given the OK to shoot to kill now as far as this "terrorsit" stuff is concerned.
An east london Mosque has been surounded by armed police as well.
But this seems the hot spot for recruiting these people.
The muslim community is in a MAJOR uproar right now and already talking about marching on london in protest.
THAT will get nasty.
There's some things that have happened that won't make the news.
The image the UK is giving the rest of the world is NOT the image of whats going on here inside.
It's going to get worse.

One dead Terr killed...now that's at least a good start. And here I thought British cops could only chase people and blow their whistle. Lets hope their first dead Terr, won't be their last. I think it's telling how the "peaceful" islamic community is talking about marching for a dead terrorist and a surrounded terrorist recruiting depot. Kind of telling about where their loyalties and sympathies lay. I guess it's un-PC to call any group of even the most radical muslim extremists anything but "mostly peaceful" huh? Follow the money.

 

[KenpoEMT]

I think it's telling how the "peaceful" islamic community is talking about marching for a dead terrorist and a surrounded terrorist recruiting depot. Kind of telling about where their loyalties and sympathies lay.

I wish politicians wouldn't be so cowardly.
If it walks like a duck, violently prosthylitizes like a duck, commits coweredly acts of mass murder like a duck, it must be a muslim duck.
Islam is not a "peaceful" anything.

 

[sgtmac_46]

I wish politicians wouldn't be so cowardly.
If it walks like a duck, violently prosthylitizes like a duck, commits coweredly acts of mass murder like a duck, it must be a muslim duck.
Islam is not a "peaceful" anything.

Many western politicians are so afraid of being labelled some sort if ...ist that they can't effectively deal with certain realities. The enemy has no such weakness. It's a self afflicted weakness of western societies.

We have blinded ourselves through our own pretentous "sophistication" to the point we can't even see what is directly in front of us. It's a sick, twisted version of the "Emperor's new clothes". To actually see the threat, is to be labelled an unsophisticated, war-mongering bigot. You have to be willfully blind to be considered sophisticated and worldly.

 

[KenpoEMT]

that should be spelled: proselytize
I have an education...really, I do.

edit funtion isn't showing up for some reason.

 

[Kane]

I wish politicians wouldn't be so cowardly.
If it walks like a duck, violently prosthylitizes like a duck, commits coweredly acts of mass murder like a duck, it must be a muslim duck.
Islam is not a "peaceful" anything.

I agree with you that it is very obvious that all these attacks are done by muslims. However I wouldn't condem the religion as being totally violent, because there are a lot of muslims who hate these radicals that using their religion for their means.

It seems though many politicians are obsessed with politcal correctness more than the security of the people. For example the only thing Tony Blair talks about is muslims effected by the attacks, not ALL Britons.

 

[Knarfan]

One of the problems that the brits are facing is that they have weak anti terrorist laws . Tony Blair is trying to get a law passed that is similar to the US anti patriot act , so they can atleast arrest these people before they act . According to the experts , they know who these people are & what their up to , but they have no legal leverage to arrest these people , until they act . Basically , they just follow them around until they act . Atleast they are finally shooting them , but I think the more logical answer is to have better anti terrorist laws

 

[sgtmac_46]

I agree with you that it is very obvious that all these attacks are done by muslims. However I wouldn't condem the religion as being totally violent, because there are a lot of muslims who hate these radicals that using their religion for their means.

It seems though many politicians are obsessed with politcal correctness more than the security of the people. For example the only thing Tony Blair talks about is muslims effected by the attacks, not ALL Britons.

The problem isn't just the muslims committing the acts, but the large number of muslims that are showing more support for the terrorists and those that recruit them, than they are for the victims of terrorism. I don't see large numbers of muslims marching to oppose terrorism in their name. I do see the threat of large scale marches in response to the surrounding of terrorist recruiting depots commonly called madrasas. That's the problem.

Until I see a large scale movement among muslim groups in places like the US and Europe to castigate and condemn those who not only commit these acts, but those that fund, support and endorse these acts, in their name, it's hard to buy the claim that "it's not most muslims". It seems just as likely at this point that those who condemn, whole-sale, the acts of these terrorists are themselves the minority in the muslim community. I am starting to wonder if the luke warm condemnation that we have heard is nothing more than window dressing.

 

[Feisty Mouse]

The problem isn't just the muslims committing the acts, but the large number of muslims that are showing more support for the terrorists and those that recruit them, than they are for the victims of terrorism. I don't see large numbers of muslims marching to oppose terrorism in their name. I do see the threat of large scale marches in response to the surrounding of terrorist recruiting depots commonly called madrasas. That's the problem.

Until I see a large scale movement among muslim groups in places like the US and Europe to castigate and condemn those who not only commit these acts, but those that fund, support and endorse these acts, in their name, it's hard to buy the claim that "it's not most muslims". It seems just as likely at this point that those who condemn, whole-sale, the acts of these terrorists are themselves the minority in the muslim community. I am starting to wonder if the luke warm condemnation that we have heard is nothing more than window dressing.

I disagree - I have seen quite a good deal more of Muslim discussion and demonstration against acts of terror than for, or lukewarm platitudes.

Holding the majority, who may practice in different sects, responsible for violent extremists is just not possible. Were all Christians held accountable when David Koresh did his whole hostage-holding thing? Are all Catholics personally responsible for the Spanish Inquisition?

One dead Terr killed...now that's at least a good start. And here I thought British cops could only chase people and blow their whistle. Lets hope their first dead Terr, won't be their last.

Was the person who was chased and shot to death a terrorist? I didn't see any reports on who he was or what he was wanted for. I didn't realize that shooting a suspect was better than taking him or her into custody and hopefully finding out what it is that they know - unless they are ready to blow themselves up, of course.

 

[sgtmac_46]

I disagree - I have seen quite a good deal more of Muslim discussion and demonstration against acts of terror than for, or lukewarm platitudes.

Name a few.

Holding the majority, who may practice in different sects, responsible for violent extremists is just not possible. Were all Christians held accountable when David Koresh did his whole hostage-holding thing? Are all Catholics personally responsible for the Spanish Inquisition?

They are responsible whenever they provide funds for those organizations. They are responsible when they show support for those institutions. They are whenever they do their best to shield and protect the recruiting centers for those institutions. Far from being a few nuts operating in a generally good group, islamic terror groups are recruiting among the youth of these very same muslims. Perhaps if they spent a good deal of time convincing their children that these terror groups are satanic, and do not represent the ideals of their faith, then the local mosques and religious schools wouldn't be able to operate as recruiting centers. It's no small wonder that many of the terrorists operating in Great Britain are home grown.

Your analogy about Koresh and Catholics would be applicable, if large numbers of christians were supporting those activities and an even greater number were remaining quietly ambivalent. In that case, they would be responsible.

I hope i'm wrong. I really wish that many muslims would STRONGLY condemn, not only the terrorists themselves, but the madrasas and the clerics that produce and incite them. That's something I don't see nearly enough.

Was the person who was chased and shot to death a terrorist? I didn't see any reports on who he was or what he was wanted for. I didn't realize that shooting a suspect was better than taking him or her into custody and hopefully finding out what it is that they know - unless they are ready to blow themselves up, of course.

lol. Sorry, but I really don't feel to sorry about one dead terrorist. It's a good start. The only, and I mean ONLY down side, is the loss of whatever minor intelligence information this person might have possessed. Of course the way these cells operate, this low level operative's information would probably have been negligble.

I do regret that the officers who shot him didn't risk their lives further to capture him alive....or something. In all seriousness, i'm sure that if the police shot him, he created a situation where it was not feasible to take him alive. I'll give them the benefit of the doubt and not mourn for a dead terrorist.

 

[Jonathan Randall]

I disagree - I have seen quite a good deal more of Muslim discussion and demonstration against acts of terror than for, or lukewarm platitudes.

Holding the majority, who may practice in different sects, responsible for violent extremists is just not possible. Were all Christians held accountable when David Koresh did his whole hostage-holding thing? Are all Catholics personally responsible for the Spanish Inquisition?


Was the person who was chased and shot to death a terrorist? I didn't see any reports on who he was or what he was wanted for. I didn't realize that shooting a suspect was better than taking him or her into custody and hopefully finding out what it is that they know - unless they are ready to blow themselves up, of course.

I have too. It's ironic, but a week after a Muslim group in the area protested against the Madrid bombings, a local talk show host demagogue railed the he "... wanted, one, just one Muslim group to come out against Islamic terrorism".

Feisty Mouse, regarding the subject shot; it depends upon the context. You don't always have the option of taking a person into custody. Apparently he was given multiple opportunities to surrender to ARMED officers and refused, then went into a train wearing heavy clothing that may have concealed a suicide belt. His actions dictated the outcome, I'm afraid. I can't fault the police here.

Nevertheless, you are the Lady, Feisty Mouse. I love your posts. You always sound very intelligent and your comments are always well considered.

To the UK members; I am so thankful that you escaped injury or death in this attack. I'm a portrait artist and I love British art. Sir Thomas Lawrence, Reynolds, Raeburn, Gainsborough, etc!

 

[sgtmac_46]

I have too. It's ironic, but a week after a Muslim group in the area protested against the Madrid bombings, a local talk show host demagogue railed the he "... wanted, one, just one Muslim group to come out against Islamic terrorism".

Feisty Mouse, regarding the subject shot; it depends upon the context. You don't always have the option of taking a person into custody. Apparently he was given multiple opportunities to surrender to ARMED officers and refused, then went into a train wearing heavy clothing that may have concealed a suicide belt. His actions dictated the outcome, I'm afraid. I can't fault the police here.

Nevertheless, you are the Lady, Feisty Mouse. I love your posts. You always sound very intelligent and your comments are always well considered.

To the UK members; I am so thankful that you escaped injury or death in this attack. I'm a portrait artist and I love British art. Sir Thomas Lawrence, Reynolds, Raeburn, Gainsborough, etc!

I hope you are correct that the vast majority of muslims strongly condemn these types of attrocities. If that is the case, then they will surely be able to throttle back the young men in their midst who have delusional fantasies about martyrdom and committing attrocities to achieve it.

I came across this article in my research http://www.detnews.com/2001/editorial/0110/12/a11-315728.htm
It's an interview with Sheik Muhammad Hisham Kabbani. He makes some interesting points, but it is clear that he believes that while the majority of muslims are peace loving people, he see's a significant minority of muslims who support radical activities.

The issue I take exception with isn't the idea that the majority of muslims are peace loving people, I agree with that, the majority are peace loving people. But many people attempt to paint that statement as proving only a small, very minor minority of muslims support the types of radical agendas espoused by the terrorists, and I believe that thinking is dangerous, it underestimates the threat. I believe a clearly large minority of muslims in the US and Europe support an extremely radical agenda and support the extremely radical measures to get that agenda through. We need a clear voice from the silent majority of muslims making it clear to this large minority that they don't speak for Islam.

 

[Bammx2]

I am doing my best to keep an eye out for these protests the muslim community are talking about,mainly becuase I want to see just exactly what they are protesting about.
The most common thread I have seen these people is,and I am quoting word for word the most common reason given so far,:

"Terrorists are completely wrong in there endeavor.The killing of innocent people is not the way of islam and it is making the rest of us look bad.
BUT......
we will NEVER sellout our muslim brothers to a western society".

Ok.Fine.
Then police your own.
Oh wait......
Muslims are not allowed to "turn against" other muslims,especially for something as minor for killing the "infedels". caws it sez so in da ko'ron!

If WE can police our own,they damn well can do the same thing!