The lonely Volt...

[billc]

Is the volt really doing as badly as this article suggests?

http://dailycaller.com/2011/10/25/volt-drains-power-from-economy-obamas-2012-campaign/

The White House’s green technology revolution is sitting in an auto lot in Butler, Pa., and nobody is buying.
“Nobody comes in to ask, nobody comes in to look … The American people are smarter than the government — they’re not buying that car,” said Republican Rep. Mike Kelly, who owns the auto lot where one of General Motors’ combined electric-and-gasoline powered Volt autos sits unwanted, unsold and unused.
The Chevy Volt would cost its buyer almost $40,000 — even after a $7,500 federal check — and that’s more than twice the price of a comparable Chevy Cruze, Kelly told The Daily Caller. “I just pay interest on it, insure it, and in another week or month, we’ll scrape snow off it.” (SEE ALSO: Obama to go around Congress on ‘regular basis’ to ‘heal the economy&#8217
His lonely Volt, however, isn’t truly alone. There are 3,370 Volts sitting in auto lots around the country, up from 2,600 on Oct. 3, according to cars.com, one of the nation’s largest [COLOR=green !important][COLOR=green !important]automotive[/COLOR][/COLOR] classified sites

And as to the other parts of the "Green Agenda," how many of those projects will no longer be declared "projects," but called scandals...Solyndra, and the others come to mind...Fisker, SunPower and the ones that just recieved a billion dollars in loan garauntees that are scandals waiting to be discovered.

On the SunPower scandal...

http://www.humanevents.com/article.php?id=46761

How did a failing California solar company, buffeted by short sellers and shareholder lawsuits, receive a $1.2 billion federal loan guarantee for a photovoltaic electricity ranch project—three weeks after it announced it was building new manufacturing plant in Mexicali, Mexico, to build the panels for the project.

The company, SunPower (SPWR-NASDAQ), now carries $820 million in debt, an amount $20 million greater than its market capitalization. If SunPower was a bank, the feds would shut it down. Instead, it received a lifeline twice the size of the money sent down the Solyndra drain.

Two men with insight into the process are SunPower rooter Rep. George R. Miller III, (D.-Calif.), the senior Democrat on the House Education and Workforce Committee and the co-chairman of the Democratic Steering and Policy Committee, and his SunPower lobbyist son, George Miller IV.

 

[billc]

On the Fisker scandal...

http://www.scpr.org/blogs/economy/2011/10/21/3665/electric-car-scandal-new-solyndra/

ABCNews and the Center for Public Integrity have teamed up to investigate DOE loans guarantees, focusing on two marquee EV companies, Tesla Motors and Fisker Automotive, which together have received about a billion in government-backed financing. The takeaway isn't pretty:

The loan to Fisker is part of a $1 billion bet the Energy Department has made in two politically connected California-based electric carmakers producing sporty -- and pricey -- cutting-edge autos. Fisker Automotive, backed by a powerhouse venture capital firm whose partners include former Vice President Al Gore, predicts it will eventually be churning out tens of thousands of electric sports sedans at the shuttered GM factory it bought in Delaware. And Tesla Motors, whose prime backers include PayPal mogul Elon Musk and Google co-founders Larry Page and Sergey Brin, says it will do the same in a massive facility tooling up in Silicon Valley​

 

[Steve]

Don't know about these things. Superficially, there are crooks everywhere, particularly where there's a lot of money to be had.

But I love my Nissan LEAF, and haven't been to a gas station since June. Just shy of 5000 miles now.

 

[Rich Parsons]

As I work for GM, and I am not a spokeperson I will not respond to the Volt portion.

To the Fisker and Tesla, I had job offers , yes they called multiple times and made multiple offers, from Fisker. Fisker thought they could buy an engine and have someone else do the software and then drop it into their vehicle and have the subcontracting company be responsible for emission testing and certification as well as for warrenty. This is not how it works. The name plate and company that builds and sells it is responible. They wanted to have all this done in 3 months. 3 Months is difficult for proper responses with the Fed even if you have a working relationship. Fisker had unrealistic goals and while I am glad they have a product on the market, I am also glad to see that I was not wrong in my experience of timing and expected workload were real close to when they did bring the product online and in production. (* They actually were about 6 months late from my epxectation - but that could be learning curve and other issues. *)

The more we have people working on this better it will be. Just my thoughts on that idea.

 

[Steve]

Volt did really well in the Consumer Reports ratings.

 

[ballen0351]

But I love my Nissan LEAF, and haven't been to a gas station since June. Just shy of 5000 miles now.

Thats pretty impressive I wish these cars looked and sounded cooler

 

[Jenna]

Thats pretty impressive I wish these cars looked and sounded cooler

Like this you mean?

http://www.teslamotors.com/goelectric

 

[cdunn]

If I had the money, and a place to plug it in, I would happily purchase a Volt. Since I'm not paid enough to purchase new vehicles, I'll have to wait.

 

[Sukerkin]

The only electric car that I've seen in motion was a Tesla Roadster - it was most odd to see a car whipping past on the track and only hearing the tyre and aerodynamic noise .

 

[seasoned]

Like this you mean?

http://www.teslamotors.com/goelectric

Now thats what i'm talking about.

 

[granfire]

The only electric car that I've seen in motion was a Tesla Roadster - it was most odd to see a car whipping past on the track and only hearing the tyre and aerodynamic noise .

I am sure they can add the soundtrack digitally at a later date.
(I mean...part of the appeal of a muscle car is to hear the muscle, no?)

 

[Sukerkin]

Quite so - tho I prefer the refined song of a V12 to the throaty roar of a V8 ... unless said V8 is in a TVR of course .

 

[Steve]

The quiet is definitely a plus. Another thing I really like about the EV is the smooth ride. It's running on an electric motor with no transmission and 100% torque all the way through. That all translates to very smooth acceleration and reliable punch when you need to pass or get up to speed. As for the sound, I have grown very fond of the quiet. I drove my wife's Ford Fusion and after 4 months in the EV, it felt loud, clunky and slow.

Looks wise, the Nissan isn't the most handsome car around, but it's not the worst thing on the road, either. The LEAF is a family 5 door. I get my wife and three kids (one carseat) into the car at the same time and still have room for groceries and a stroller. But this is strictly subjective. I think the Tesla Model S is a sexy looking sedan, and I've seen several Tesla Roadsters. Very nice. Reminiscent of the Lotus Elise. The Model S has three different battery options, which will extend range from 160 up to 300 miles, which will put the range right up there with many gas cars.

The Volt is a good looking car, but it's just not my cup of tea. I'd rather drive a TDI, but that's just me. I don't know how well the Volt is doing, but I have some problems I've already posted about the entire concept of it. It just seems to be gimmicky and impractical, representing a tentative step into alternative fuels.

Bottom line for me. I love it. While circumstances might require that I buy another gas car, I will never do so willingly. In every way, the EV has turned out better than I had expected. I pay about 2.7 cents per mile for electricity. I have zero concerns about range. It's comfortable. It's big enough for my family. It's exceeded my expectations to such a high degree that I'll probably pay off the residual and buy out the lease.

 

[cdunn]

think the Tesla Model S is a sexy looking sedan, and I've seen several Tesla Roadsters. Very nice. Reminiscent of the Lotus Elise.

There's a reason for this: The Roadster shares its platform with the Elise, gliders are produced by Lotus on contract for Tesla, Tesla produces only the powertrain.

 

[ballen0351]

Like this you mean?

http://www.teslamotors.com/goelectric

Its ok just not my style. I only drive vehicles with 4 wheel drive that say Jeep on them. I own 5 jeeps right now and over the last few years Ive owned close to 25 of them and none of them newer then 1979. My current ride of choice is my 1978 Jeep Cherokee. Ive been restoring it for 2 years. Its knida my hobby.

Dont get me wrong I have nothing against electric or hybrid cars I just wish they were more Manly I guess for lack of a better term.
I drive 50 miles each way to work everyday but I have a company car so I dont pay gas but if I ever loose it I would consider maybe a hybrid of some kind maybe the Yukon Hybrid or something.

 

[ballen0351]

I have zero concerns about range. It's comfortable. It's big enough for my family. It's exceeded my expectations to such a high degree that I'll probably pay off the residual and buy out the lease.

How far can you get with that thing? And how long does it take to recharge? You couldnt like take it on a family trip or anything for long distance could you? Forgive my ignorance I really dont know much about EV cars

 

[Steve]

How far can you get with that thing? And how long does it take to recharge? You couldnt like take it on a family trip or anything for long distance could you? Forgive my ignorance I really dont know much about EV cars

On one charge, I can go about 90 miles, if most of those miles are on the freeway. Longer, if I stick to side roads. Unlike a gas car, the EV actually performs better in the city.

The LEAF has a 24 kWh battery pack. The Model S is supposed to be effectively tripling the range, but here's my take. When I first considered buying an EV, I knew range would be an issue. I started logging my miles and keeping track of my expenses. I did this for about 6 weeks. I discovered two things. First, I don't drive as far as I thought. Second, things aren't as far away as I thought. Turns out that my one hour drive into Seattle is really only 25 miles. A trip to Edmonds, which can take 2 hours in rush hour, is only about 48 miles. I'm not saying that this will be sufficient for everyone. I do believe, however, that it's sufficient for most people.

Regarding family trips, I don't know how often you go on family trips, but while we drive all over the Seattle area, road trips are infrequent. If I plan a road trip, I wouldn't take the LEAF. One thing to consider, though, is that I save over $150/month on fuel. I used to fill up my gas tank once per week and it would cost me about $50. I've been averaging about $35 per month in electricity for the EV. So, if I'm a road tripper, I figure I can use some of that $1800 I'm not spending on gas in a year to rent whatever kind of car I want.

Time to charge from a completely dead battery. At 120 volts about 20 hours. At 240 volts, about 6 hours (I usually plug in at home). At 440 volts, 80% in about 30 minutes. That's current technology, but that's changing fast.

Believe me, while I can't imagine anyone who actually gives an EV a fair shake not loving it, I completely understand that cars are an expression of who we are. In many ways, we make decisions about cars based on things other than practicality. I don't intend to come across as a zealot who's trying to convert people. Drive what you want. I expect that I'll get cooler looking, faster, sportier cars in the future, but I can't in any way imagine that I'll ever buy a car with an internal combustion engine again.

 

[Rich Parsons]

Like this you mean?

http://www.teslamotors.com/goelectric

Tesla had a very expensive model over $100,000 USD and it took about 27 to2 9 hours to charge from empty. We figured if you owned three and had two charging all the time you would have one to drive every day until the charge ran out. But it would be a fun ride. :~D

 

[Steve]

Tesla had a very expensive model over $100,000 USD and it took about 27 to2 9 hours to charge from empty. We figured if you owned three and had two charging all the time you would have one to drive every day until the charge ran out. But it would be a fun ride. :~D

The Tesla Roadster is spendy, but the times you're referring to are from a 120 volt outlet. The Roadster advertises a 265 mile range, and like every other EV I've seen, including the EV portion of the Volt, it can charge at 240 or 440 volts, as well. From zero to full at 240 volts takes about 6 hours. And it's SUPER fast. The Model S is also spendy, at around $57k before any incentives. But it's also a luxury sedan that seats 5+, goes from 0 to 60 in about 4.5 seconds and can be upgraded to around 300 miles range.

 

[Steve]

Oh.. And can I plug a reduced dependence on foreign oil? Hehe... "plug".

Seriously, though. Foreign oil bad. I mean, yeah. Hippies like green cars, but it's American electricity, guys. I think that's awesome!


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