The great debate: strength, fitness and martial arts

[BaktoBasics]

Hello! Many of us disagree on training programs. I'd like to discuss what training all of you employ, and, where possible, what famous fighters employ (boxers, MMA, UFC champs, muay thai fighters etc).

We are getting into a time where MA's are taken seriously, and, thats great.

I say that olympic style weightlifting with compound movements and explosive strength is tops. It conditions the CNS and motor nerves for explosive power, builds muscle and teaches the bodies muscles to work together rather than in isolation. I also think sprints and interval training (HIIT) is a can't beat combo with lifting. I say lots of pushups and sit ups and 3 mile jogs are a waste for strength.

What do you all say - eager to learn how I can improve my program.

Also, good article at: http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/hale16.htm

 

[dsp921]

For pure strength training I agree with you, compound movements are the way to go. But I'm not sure that pure strength is what is necessary for powerful strikes. I'm taught to stay totally relaxed until impact whenever I throw a punch (blocks and kicks as well). I believe Ray Leonard used this technique. He stayed very loose until he made contact and then tensed up. If you are using that strength from the start of the movement you are just causing the strike to slow down. You will also be using up energy to overcome the tense muscle to deliver the strike.
I know that it's been proven to me in class time and time again that if I try to use brute strength to deliver a strike it is less effective (powerful) than if I stay loose and snap. I realize that might go against the generally accepted thoughts, but I've been convinced.
As for training, I do a mix of both compound and isolation movements. Basically all freeweight stuff with the exception of ab work. I also do cardio a couple of times a week.
I don't think this is exactly what you were looking for and I probably rambled too much. I guess my question would be; how does pure strength relate to martial arts to you and how do you apply the explosive power to delivering strikes?
I have a feeling this is going to be one of those discussions where everyone has a different opinion, should be interesting.

 

[FearlessFreep]

Actually, dsp921, I've heard and practice the same way. Stay loose through the strike and then tense at the moment of impact for maximum speed.

Another important part is balance at the base. If you are not striking with a good balance, a good stable platform, you will not get the most force into the target you can. It doesn't do you much good to strike fast and hard with the weapon (hand/foot) if most of the force is then transferred back through your one body because of poor stability. I mean, not matter how hard you strikem the force goes somewhere...better into them then back through you.

 

[dsp921]

Another important part is balance at the base. If you are not striking with a good balance, a good stable platform, you will not get the most force into the target you can. It doesn't do you much good to strike fast and hard with the weapon (hand/foot) if most of the force is then transferred back through your one body because of poor stability. I mean, not matter how hard you strikem the force goes somewhere...better into them then back through you.

Exactly correct.

 

[redfang]

We're kind of having this discussion on a couple of threads right now. My opinion is that raw strength (Which I am defining more or less as a muscle's overall ability to do work.) has some importance but not a whole lot. In my view, power and endurance are required for fighting. Relaxation plays a big part in power. Power is speed X force. Relaxed movements are quick movements. Force is some strength, but more it is the way that the body moves to deliver a strike. The strength of an arm is negligible compared to the strength of the whole body aligning properly to deliver a strike. This being said, I mix up muscular endurance days with power days, do a lot of movement training and try to get my cardio through circuit workouts. I'll still run distance sometimes, but this is more for variety than anything else. No matter how good a workout is, the body will adapt to it. The best way to keep this from happening is to change your workouts every so often. Keep the body guessing so to speak.

 

[Kenpo_man]

I used to think going crazy on the weights was the only way to gain strength but it isn't. I watched my muay thai trainer get faster and begin to hit harder when he quit doing weights for awhile. He lost about 20 pounds of muscle going from 220 to 200. He attributed his gained power to an increase in speed due to his leaner frame. He was very big and muscular and he noticed after dropping the weight that it had been causing him to be inflexible and a little muscle bound. He switched to calisthenics and did a LOT of it. Sit-ups, push-ups, skipping, burpees, everything, you name it he did it twice daily. When he was on his little workout spree I started working out with him when I wasn't instructing. No weights and I got faster, stronger and, me being small in frame to start with, I actually gained a few pounds of muscle. I still lift weights but I learned through my intructor that they are not as necessary as is often implied. There is a difference between being in shape and being in shape for martial arts.

Just something to think about.