Tae Kwon Do in MMA

Kane

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Judo has been in MMA for quite some time, and it works quite well. Though not very big in the UFC, North America's biggest MMA organization, it thrives in Asia's Pride Fighter. Hidehiko Yoshida is a perfect example. Hidehiko Yoshida used to be one of the greatest in his prime, and he even has a victory over Royce Gracie as I heard. Hidehiko Yoshida is and Olympic gold medalist in judo. Judo though becoming a sport is still effective in street fights.

However, there is another big Asian martial art that is also in the Olympics, but it doesn't seem to have made it into the MMA. I actually have never heard of a Tae Kwon Do Master or Olympian in MMA. Why is this? Is Tae Kwon Do not an effective are for street fighting.

A lot of Tae Kwon Do is striking and may teach less practical fighting moves than let's judo or BJJ, but it is still and effective striking art in my opinion. Maybe it is not the best sole are, but I think it is great art for cross-training grapplers.

Why do you think there are not that many TKD MMArtists in MMA? Do you think it has to do with the effectiveness or do you think it has to do that TKD masters just don't want to do MMA? Do you think TKD would be a good striking art in MMA fighter? What do you think?
 
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SammyB57

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Put the top TKD guys in the world against the top boxers in the world, and let's see what happens....
 

Andrew Green

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Most TKD'ers aren't that good at staying on their feet, side effect of throwing all those kicks :D

as for the Gracie fight - It is rather questionable. The ref called it as him being out from a choke... But his popping up right away and arguing that kinda casts some doubt. There was a rematch, Gracie dominated.

It's a simple question, do the skills that the style use apply when the restrictions of that style are stripped away?
 
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Shawn C

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IMO, top athletes in other combat sports see no reason to enter MMA. The rewards (especially financial) aren't very good, and the risk (of injury and loss of prestige) is too high.

The only ones who reach the top levels in MMA right now are people who really love the sport...they'd do it for free if they had to.
 
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Kane

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Shawn C said:
IMO, top athletes in other combat sports see no reason to enter MMA. The rewards (especially financial) aren't very good, and the risk (of injury and loss of prestige) is too high.

The only ones who reach the top levels in MMA right now are people who really love the sport...they'd do it for free if they had to.
That is not necessarily true. A large amount of both UFC and Pride are either wrestlers or boxers, which are the biggest combat sports in the world. Judo also makes occasional visits in the sport of MMA. In fact if you look at it, BJJ and kickboxing, though not an Olympic sport, are still combat sports. Where as kempo, karate, or kung fu which we see extremely little of are combat arts but not sports to any degree.
 

Shu2jack

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Remember to seperate MMA from self-defense and street fighting. All three are different animals.

Like anything, it is how you train. Does TKD have "less effective" fighting techinques than other arts? I don't think so. We have punches, hooks, uppercuts, low kicks, knee strikes, elbow strikes, and the like. I read a book made in part by Renzo (I think) Gracie, which showed some of the techniques for their color belt ranks. Some of the stuff is what we use.

The problem comes in when TKD people (and people from other styles) begin to focus on jump kicks or pressure points or fancier techniques as part of their training and do not work with a lot of (resisting) partner drills. If you are training for self-defense or the cage, then you are training the wrong way. Imagine if your TKD school allows full-contact, full-contact punches to the face, a standing clinch (with points for a standing take down), and low kicks to the thighs. How much better off would TKDists be? How many would train with all those spinning and jumping kicks if they knew they would be grabbed or if their landing leg would be kicked out from underneath them?

Can TKD be used in the cage? Well, with the bad reputation TKD has, not too many people would admit to training in it. As far as the striking portion goes, kickboxing does decent and if TKDists train with more kickboxing-type rules and conditioning, then they would do fine in the striking game. The cage is not a real-life self-defense situation and you WILL probably fight at all ranges, so you need to have skill in all of them. Cross-training.

Can TKD be used in a street fight? If you are street fighting, you have not been learning TKD. We don't teach punks. (Though there are bad apples that slip through the cracks.)

Can TKD be used in self-defense? Yes, I have done so, and so has my sister and gf. Remember that self-defense is WAY more than just how well you fight.

So in summery, train like you fight so you will fight like you train. Or something close to that.
 
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ace

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There are no more singel Styel Fighters any more.
Yosdias Quote Victory over Royce was not MMA.

The did only 1 MMA Fight & it was a Draw
Ocording to Records.

The 1st 1 was a Jiu Jitsu Vs Judo Limited
Striking on the feet only match.

Verry simalr to the USJJF/JJIF Kumite Ju Jitsu.

For TKD fighter to have sucsess They Would
have to spend some time on the Ground.

Could it work of course.

But it would be the Fighter not the Art.
He/She Would Have to Feel comfertable Throwing
their Kicks knowing they May hit the Ground.

Mauris Smith has a TKD Back Round
But is Better known for His KickBoxing.

But he spent 2 Years With the Shamrocks
before He Fought.

For any Fighter To be Sucsseful They
have to Be able to Fight were ever the Fight goes.

Cross Training Is a Styel in it's self Today
 
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WilliamJ

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Sport TKD instills alot of habits that are very bad for MMA. The lack of punching to the head, getting points for questionable contact, bouncing all very bad in MMA fights.
 
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Storm911

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I study both TKD and BJJ. One of the main problems with TKD is that face and head contact with hands are not allowed in most tournaments. I have to say that I think this is stupid and dosen't represent a real fight. TKD is known for it's fast flashy kicks and if they are applied right, can be very devistating and hard. However, the sad reality is that mant TKD artists are only trained in
" sport TKD " following WTF or ITF rules. I train in both arts in addition to western style boxing. I kind of take the TKD kicks and strikes ,the BJJ take downs and submissions, mix it together and use both. I feel that the days of studying one martial art is over. However, there will always be people that say their style is the best. I guess they will have to find out what we all already know the hard way.
 
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Shawn C

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"That is not necessarily true. A large amount of both UFC and Pride are either wrestlers or boxers, which are the biggest combat sports in the world."

Wrestlers can make quick money in MMA; that's why most of them started competing. They are guys that were towards the end of their wrestling careers, too. Cael Sanderson isn't going to jump in the Octagon anytime soon.

No top boxers compete in MMA (or even B or C-level boxers).


"Judo also makes occasional visits in the sport of MMA."

Yoshida is the only one I can think of. I believe he'd retired from Judo anyway.


"In fact if you look at it, BJJ and kickboxing, though not an Olympic sport, are still combat sports."

BJJ and MMA have always been intertwined. Kickboxers can make more money in K-1 events. I don't know why they would get involved in MMA.
 

ace

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No top boxers compete in MMA (or even B or C-level boxers).


Not True at all
Luke Spencer is a Good Pro Boxer/MMA Fighter
Jens Pulver is undefeated Pro Boxer & a Good MMA Fighter

Don Frye was a Pro Boxer,Melton Bowen Was IBF Champion
While he Fought in the Octagon
James Warren. I could go on all Day :whip:
 

Shogun

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They are guys that were towards the end of their wrestling careers, too.
Matt Lindland won silver at 2000 olympics in Sydney in Greco roman. He is still actively involved in Greco Roman

as for Judo practitioners:
Karo Parisyan is a top notch Judo guy, and a top 10 welterwight, with a 3-1 UFC record.
 
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Shawn C

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No offense to guys like Pulver (who started boxing pro only recently) and Frye, but they aren't top boxers. They haven't been in a championship fight, nor are they anywhere close to getting a championship fight. If they had a career in boxing, why would they mess with MMA?

This goes back to my point that other combat sports are more rewarding than MMA. That's probably why Pulver crossed over to boxing anyway...the chance of making bigger money. God knows the UFC never paid him well.


"Matt Lindland won silver at 2000 olympics in Sydney in Greco roman. He is still actively involved in Greco Roman"

Lindland is an exception. I will be curious to see if he wrestles in the next Olympics. I don't see how he can compete in both sports in the future.

I don't know Karo's standing in Judo, but I don't believe he was an Olympian. He seems to be firmly planted in MMA, so I assume he gave up any Judo career he had for it.
 

phlaw

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Didn't Cal Worsham do pretty well in a couple of the UFC's, and he was a TKD practioner.
 

Andrew Green

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phlaw said:
Didn't Cal Worsham do pretty well in a couple of the UFC's, and he was a TKD practioner.
Different times ;)

Back in those days UFC was style vs style and the level of fighters was a lot lower. Not to many of the fighters from then can do much now. Tank was a main attraction, now he's an easy match up and I'm pretty sure he beat up Cal pretty bad at one point.
 

Shogun

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Karo Parisyan did attend the olympic trials. I dont think he qualified, no sure of the specifics. He is a very good judo guy, and plans on attending the 2008 olympics in Beijing.
 

Corporal Hicks

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I have not seen much UFC. Have they got any fight video clips with TKDers on? I mean they only really seem to grapple, I guess high kicking isnt really appliable. I mean are there any pre-dominant TKDers in UFC?


Regards
 

Shogun

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I give mention to 2 TKD blackbelts in the UFC, and one who used to be.

Bas Rutten- 3rd degree BB in TKD
Robbie Lawler- blackbelt
Yves Edwards- Blackbelt

these are some of the best fighters of past and present. mind you, they train MMA and stuff, but TKD seems to be good for MMA training.
 
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JDenz

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there will never be an olympic level TKD guy in UFC or Pride. They will have spent to long being geared for olympic level TKD and weill never be good enough in every position. There are alot of olympic level wrestlers in UFC and Pride anybody that won worlds (olympics in a non olympic year) or was an alternate they are the best of the best. There are a couple olympic level Judo guys in Pride. You will never see a top five guy in boxing in the cage because they can get 15 times the money to just box what they are good at. A guy that could just box would get eaten up in MMA. Botha is having a hard time just kickboxing and he was a contender once.
 

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