People who live in glass houses should'nt throw rocks!!

[DAC..florida]

there was a lot of fairly hardcore "fraud busting" a while back

I would say alot of 'attempted' fraud busting. In truth and in one particular situation, no fraud was ever proven, because no fraud ever existed. And interestingly enough, several of those that tried were themselves exposed as, shall we say, not being honest themselves. In fact, one of the fraud busters accidentally exposed his fellow buster's deceit very recently on a different board.

Not a case of genuine fraud busting in that incident, just personality conflicts and pointless agendas. Fortunately quite a few now know the truth that a former member stated early on.

 

[Aegis]

I would say alot of 'attempted' fraud busting. In truth and in one particular situation, no fraud was ever proven, because no fraud ever existed. And interestingly enough, several of those that tried were themselves exposed as, shall we say, not being honest themselves. In fact, one of the fraud busters accidentally exposed his fellow buster's deceit very recently on a different board.

Not a case of genuine fraud busting in that incident, just personality conflicts and pointless agendas. Fortunately quite a few now know the truth that a former member stated early on.

Personally I believed and still believe a lot of the accusations. There was far too much secrecy, topic misdirection, answering questions with "how dare you" style questions, etc for me to believe that certain claims were 100% true. Note that this is my opinion only, I'm not looking to restart any fraud busting, just disagreeing with your use of the words "attempted" and "truth"

 

[paihequan]

I recently experienced a person slagging off about me on another list. Fortunately that person resided in the same country as I so I invited him to meet me, see how I train and teach and treat my students. This he (a 2nd Dan) did and was to respond afterwards just how much he enjoyed our down to earth approach and that in his eyes I was the "real deal" (Whatever that means). He stated that he had trained with some very high profile people, martial historians who were very arrogant to others and who basked in the ego-glorification they received. Just goes to show that high rank and a supposed high profile reputation does not always make for a good person on the mats.

It's very easy to make assumptions of others based upon past actions and words ..... especially on the internet.

I guess a good rule of thumb is to treat others how you would like to be treated.

 

[DAC..florida]

Personally I believed and still believe a lot of the accusations. There was far too much secrecy, topic misdirection, answering questions with "how dare you" style questions, etc for me to believe that certain claims were 100% true. Note that this is my opinion only, I'm not looking to restart any fraud busting, just disagreeing with your use of the words "attempted" and "truth"

I don't know what there is not to believe? Dave posted the name of his pangainoon instructor in the old chatroom, pm's and even here in this forum. A poster on ebudo confirmed this independently and knew his instructor. His other BB's are registered with the WIF and are on their public forum. His L.E. credentials and awards are registered with FDLE and are open to the public. He was the victime of e-mugging plain and simple. He stated that his accusers were not being truthful and this came out recently on another board as well. People are to quick to believe the worst about someone based on peoples comments on the internet. I KNOW him personally and train with him. Those others never did. They never bothered to check his credentials, They just kept pounding away with misleading information. If I got half a dozen buddies I could attack anyone here and make them look bad with my buddies chiming in.....

When given the chance he was an excellent poster. Even some of his attackers admitted this here in print. He brought a few folks here as well, I'm one of them. He should be asked to come back :asian:

 

[Don Roley]

Personally I believed and still believe a lot of the accusations. There was far too much secrecy, topic misdirection, answering questions with "how dare you" style questions, etc for me to believe that certain claims were 100% true. Note that this is my opinion only, I'm not looking to restart any fraud busting, just disagreeing with your use of the words "attempted" and "truth"

Especially when things like this happen.

http://www.budoseek.net/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=5279

I never, ever trust people on the internet anymore unless I can check their facts off line, and their existence.

 

[KennethKu]

You can never keep a con-man down. lol

 

[Aegis]

I can't see the link, can someone give the the gist of it by PM?

 

[Aegis]

ok, got it now. And just as I recieve the private message detailing the contents of the link I find myself able to access the site again.... Weird!

 

[Robert Carver]

Aegis:

BudoSeek! is having some minor problems due to the server we are hosted on being subjected to a Denial of Service attack yesterday. We are up and running, but service is a little sporatic right now.

 

[Aegis]

Thanks Robert. It's been inaccessible for me for a couple of days but I managed to get on today. I know I don't contribute much to your forum, but I do occasionally read the subjects that interest me

 

[8253]

in the end it dosent really matter what they say. What you do is what will matter in the end.

 

[someguy]

Actions speak louder than words basiclly.
Who ever said that forgot that speaking is an Action though but eh oh well.

 

[Don Roley]

I can't see the link, can someone give the the gist of it by PM?

Since Budoseek sometimes has troubles, let me post the important points.

Webmaster 04-03-2004 17:23
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Lie to me, and you will pay.
†
Break my rules, and you will pay.

Everyone here has been repeatedly reminded of the "real name rule" as well as other rules like not having duplicate accounts. People have even asked "what if I just use a fake name?" I have told them to go ahead, but if I catch you lying about using your real name, you will pay. This is the case of Mr. Buster.

Mr. Buster like another member, A.R.K., frequently posts from an IP address registered to the (edited out by Don Roley). One of our members inquired about Mr. Buster and if there was a "Pat Russell" employed there. I subsequently received a nice email from an official with that department informing me that no "Pat Russell" exists in their department as a deputy or any other employee. So we have Mr. Buster using a fake name. Strike one.

Mr. Buster in his very first post on this board was banned for making an inflamatory posts. He informed me at that time his name was "Pat Russell". I reinstated his membership with the understanding that he would obey our rules. He lied directly to me. Strike Two.

Also, IP addresses are unique to each computer on a network. Thus, any two computers in a company would have unique IP addresses. Since Mr. Buster and A.R.K. are posting from the same computer at the (Edited out by Don Roley), and no "Pat Russell" exists, my only conclusion is that Mr. Buster is actually A.R.K. posting under a fake name. Strike Three.

Now both Mr. Buster and A.R.K. are banned.

Webmaster 04-05-2004 08:28
------------------------------------------------------------------------

After I made the original post in this thread, I learned some more interesting facts in discussion with admin at other boards. It turns out that the identity of Mr. Buster may indeed not be Mr. Shultz. Instead, I have discovered that Mr. David Craine, another member of the (edited out by Don Roley), may be the culprit. He posts under the username "DAC..florida" on several other websites, and his IP address is the same as Mr. Shultz. Now here is the funny part. Mr. Buster in his public profile here at BudoSeek! lists a birthday of March 9, and his interests as fishing. If you look at Mr. Craine's (aka "DAC..florida") public profile on these other sites, he lists his birthday as March 9, 1975 and his interests as fishing. I guess it is hard to keep your story straight when you post all over the internet.

This is what I call a "special kinda stupid".

 

[KennethKu]

What's that I hear? Oh, it's the sound of glass breaking! lol

These jokers must have thought that they could pull the same con game on other boards and got away with it.

Its rediculous that MT lost a bunch of knowledgeable and experienced members because of the bullcrap pulled by this bunch of liars.

 

[Don Roley]

What's that I hear? Oh, it's the sound of glass breaking! lol

These jokers must have thought that they could pull the same con game on other boards and got away with it.

Its rediculous that MT lost a bunch of knowledgeable and experienced members because of the bullcrap pulled by this bunch of liars.

Ah yes. Especially when you compare the current biography

http://cqdt9d1.freeservers.com/about.html

With that of just a year ago thanks to Archive.org.

http://web.archive.org/web/20030405080946/http://cqdt9d1.freeservers.com/about.html

In just one year, can you see how many claims had to be dropped after people started asking questions? And how many new ranks were gained to cover the ones that were dropped? In just the time between now and April 5th of last year?

Last year at this time, someone was claiming to be a tenth dan in Mya Ryu Jitsu. Now, they are too humble to be anymore than an eighth dan- which of coure they were awarded in Pangainoon but can not show any proof for. :uhyeah:

I would like to thank David Craine for starting this thread. It really has helped a lot of people understand his teacher better.

 

[KennethKu]

Heck, the MA community owes it to all the decent and honorable men such yourself, Rousselot, the Yili folks and the mods of other MA boards who don't suffer fools and con artists easily. You all work relentlessly and tirelessly to expose all those scam artists who are disgrace to the martial community.

:asian:

 

[Rich Parsons]

Heck, the MA community owes it to all the decent and honorable men such yourself, Rousselot, the Yili folks and the mods of other MA boards who don't suffer fools and con artists easily. You all work relentlessly and tirelessly to expose all those scam artists who are disgrace to the martial community.

:asian:

I did not have a personal problem with anyone asking the questions.

I did not and do notahve a problem with a few follow up questions.

I did and do have a problem when people derail every thread a person posts on. This in my mind is stalking on line. As most of what you speak of occured during the time before I was a Mod, and soon after I became a mod, I am replying now from the perspective of member. It was not productive. It was not a positive way to approach.

I also had some person issues with some of those you praise. They would not answer me. Nor would the be polite or not triple team me and others. I found their presence as disruptive and negative as anyone who may or may not have presented a falsehood.

Just my opinions. Sorry for the off topic reply, yet I thought it might be considered a stone in my mind as some of those mentioned were just as disruptive and unhonorable to me. Yet, I have been told I was wrong to think this way. So, I guess I have been told.

I am not defending anyone. I just do not think everyone came out of that confratation clean.

Oh Well :idunno:

 

[KennethKu]

You reminded me of those foolish bleeding hearts defending the Evil Empire, making excuses and providing cover to the KGB agents, while brave men and women worked relentlessly to defeat the tyranical communists oppressing the innocent people of Eastern Europe and the USSR.

 

[Bob Hubbard]

I never had a problem with a question being asked.

The problem was with the asking of the same question a thousand times, from a dozen people creating a gang-enviroment.

Those so fixated on the busting activities that they crossed the lines of decorum.
How many police investigations have been thrown out due to the 'zeal' of those investigating it, which resulted in the guilty going free?

That happened here.

Evidence couldn't be simply posted and allowed to work. No, a confession must be made, the guilty ridden until the entire universe sees the rightness of the holy cause.

Well...the busters all left. and..you know what?

The guilty folks, after being given enough rope, hung themselves.
In a few cases...badly!

All without frothing at the mouth, hundreds of warnings, suspensions, bannings or public beratings.

And, the guilty parties are now either banned, booted , barred or watched ver closely on a dozen forums.

All we ever asked those interested in verifying credibility to do was work within our guidelines and rules. They couldn't, hense the problems.

Would you applaud the rogue cop, who breaks the law repeatedly in his pursuit of what he sees as 'justice'? How about the self-appointed cop, who breaks the law while chaising his prey?

Follow our rules, present your evidence, then let things run their course. Was all we ever asked....but, we asked too much of the 'heros' it seemed.

 

[Rich Parsons]

You reminded me of those foolish bleeding hearts defending the Evil Empire, making excuses and providing cover to the KGB agents, while brave men and women worked relentlessly to defeat the tyranical communists oppressing the innocent people of Eastern Europe and the USSR.

Sir,

I do argue just yo argue.

I do take sides I do not agree with to play devil's advocate.

I am not a bleeding heart liberal

I respect those men and women who served our country. :asian: THis is not about being pro USA or not. (* Good knee jerk arguement there - I agree it does get people thinking I am hateful of our Military boys and girls. I do not *)

This about individuals and me. And how I Saw it go down.

I could read it from your point of view that you believe it ok to kill the school kids with automatic weapons as the police are storming a drug house. So it is ok for innocent people to also be hurt in the pursuit of the quest.

So I could take you sir as a NAZI willing to kill those for your goals of superiority. Yet, I choose not too, for I believe that you may not wish to have presented your self as such. Just like you thought I was a Bleeding heart Liberal. That still makes me laugh.

Enjoy and Have a Nice Day
:asian: