New to Martial arts and I have a few questions.

[cay22]

My questions are more along the lines of what is "normal". A little background: My son started TKD 2.5 yrs ago at the age of 5. He is currently a 2nd gup with about 1.5 yrs to go until he may be ready to test for BB. I just started myself about 6 mo. ago. When my son started the school was a lot smaller, class size for junior class was about 15-20 students and 3-5 BB's instructing/helping. Well over the past few years their business has grown. The Junior classes now can have up to 45 students but with only 1-2 BBs helping and maybe some pooms(Jr. BBs). A lot of the BBs that helped moved out of the area and such. They just expect the BBs to help with Jr classes. I believe the main instructor for the class is paid but the other BBs are just expected to show up and help. Is the the basic idea in TKD? Is it the norm to expect it of your BBs to give their time to the school? They are moving into a larger school soon, which they really need. I really like the owners and the school but it is like they grew too fast. A lot of the younger students are forming bad habits because there are not enough eyes on the floor to correct the mistakes when they happen. What is the normal instructor/student ratio for a junior class? How much time are BBs expected to put into "Teaching time"? Just wanting to know what we may be in for down the road
Thanks!

 

[SahBumNimRush]

It is a common responsibility of all black belts to teach. However, this responsibility differs depending on the black belts' rank, age, maturity, and interest in teaching. At my school black belts help teach the beginners class and then workout in the advanced class, but I run them back to back, so the first hour is spent with more focus on teaching than working out, and the second hour is more focused on working out than teaching. This way everyone gets a workout in, and still learns how to become a teacher.

You will find that you learn a great deal about the art and about yourself through teaching it to others. The problem for the head instructor is finding the appropriate balance for his/her black belts. You don't want to over burden them with teaching responsibilities at the cost of their own physical growth. If a black belt is giving more than they are getting, then it is a problem.

 

[Cyriacus]

Sometimes, especially during the Holidays, ill occassionally be the Highest Ranking Student present, entirely due to the majority of us being Yellow Belts. On those days, ill usually be singled to hold up bags/pads, or count out drills.
But it doesnt bother me, because after that first hour, the second hour is Green Belts and above, so i get my own training regardless, in the process.

What i learn from this is, is that Black Belts help out, because they probably get their own Black Belt Classes in which to improve (I know they do here - Dont know if thats universal), and as such can afford to help out, and more often than not join in.

 

[cay22]

Thanks, what is your average student/instructor ratio?

 

[granfire]

It is certainly part of the tradition that BBs help teach or assume some form of teaching function. Also that a lot of that is performed 'pro bono' for the honor of being a BB.

We have had classes with 35/45 juniors before...it was pretty crowded and you had to be creative with your drills....and it certainly helps when you have more eyes on the floor to find mistakes and correct them.
However, from what I can tell most of those assisting BBs are late teens and about to face life changing events, graduating highschool and going to college, getting jobs...

One of our instructors joined the Navy after graduation...and we are not that close to the beach!

 

[Gemini]

It is common practice for higher ranks to assist. whether they get paid or not depends on the school. If a school is experiencing growth, I'm surprised the assistants aren't being paid. Realistically, it does add a level of responsibility that doesn't exist otherwise. Learning to teach is the next step in progression, but as in any learning it has to be done under proper supervision. The higher ranks didn't just magically know how to do this. It sounds like your school is suffering from a good problem, being growth. Unfortunately, those higher ranks need to be taught their role, just like the students they're watching. From your description, The students aren't being supervised correctly, because their supervisors themselves aren't being supervised correctly. The why doesn't matter. There is no good reason. It needs to be addressed. The good news for your child is that while it's true untraining bad habits is harder than training inexperience, at that age, they really don't retain as much as older students do and this is not something that is likely to have long term affects. As for a ratio, you'll know the right answer by watching the results. As a rule of thumb though, young supervisors should not be watching more than a few students. That'll expand with experience.

 

[Earl Weiss]

I like to keep the student to instructor ratio at 10-1 or less with a spread of no more that 4 gup ranks.

This can be finessed somewhat by assigning senior color belts to assist with beginners. I do this in 10 minute increments as needed. That way they studnet loses only 10 minutes of training time but still benefits from the teaching experience.

Another way to finess it is have the Instructor assign some bag or target practice to one group while they work with another.

A third is to have one group sit and observe the other and swap out every 5 minutes or so. If the 5 miutes is rigorous the breakl is welcomed and juniors can benefit from observing seniors.

 

[granfire]

I like to keep the student to instructor ratio at 10-1 or less with a spread of no more that 4 gup ranks.

This can be finessed somewhat by assigning senior color belts to assist with beginners. I do this in 10 minute increments as needed. That way they studnet loses only 10 minutes of training time but still benefits from the teaching experience.

Another way to finess it is have the Instructor assign some bag or target practice to one group while they work with another.

A third is to have one group sit and observe the other and swap out every 5 minutes or so. If the 5 miutes is rigorous the breakl is welcomed and juniors can benefit from observing seniors.

Sounds like a good idea. especially when the class is full.

 

[StudentCarl]

To the original poster:
I recommend that you share your concerns with the master of the school. He or she is responsible both for the quality of instruction and for supporting the continued progress of your child (and you as a student). Do not let your role as student interfere with your role as parent. The master should be able to explain what he/she is doing to insure quality. You can evaluate the answer for yourself. It's also true that black belt students sometimes move or change directions in their lives, so instructor/assistant instructor turnover isn't unheard of. At the school I attend, the ratio is around 10:1, with bigger classes when students are close in ability to each other. When we have larger classes, there are assistants who circulate to work individually with the most junior students.

 

[cay22]

Thanks you all for the quick replies! It sounds like the place we are at is pretty normal. They have been talking about starting to run training classes for the JR. BBs to help teach them how to teach. I am hoping the moving to the larger school gives them the ability and momentum to fix some things. I have not said anything recently because they have been really busy building the new school. I will give them a few months there then if nothing has changed go in and talk with them. I have learned a lot just reading the posts here, glad I found the forum!