March on the Pentagon

[Cryozombie]

In a bizzare and surreal turn of events, I found myself in D.C. on Saturday marching on the pentagon to end the war.

I have several activists in the family, and one of them, my nephew, called me up friday night and asked if I wanted to road trip to DC for the protest. I knew there was a pro war group who was going to be there as well, so I decided it would be good to get a perspective from both sides, and I agreed to go along for the ride.

So I arrived in D.C. at approximately 9am on saturday after a night of travel... There was, of course a huge protest march, and a large group of anti-protest protesters. I couldn't get close to the latter, as I approched them a D.C. riot cop shoved me away from the line, so I moved on further down. I approached one of the bikers who were "hired" by the Government to provide security (why they hired a biker gang is beyond me, perhaps that was just propganda by the anti-war protesters, and they weren't hired, or maybe they were...) and said "Hey man, I'm not against the war, can I join you guys?" and was grabbed from behind by another Riot cop, shoved into a group of protesters walking down the street twords the Anti-war protest and told if I stopped Marching I would be arrested. So I followed the general ebb and flow down to the anti-war march, while being called a coward and a homosexual by the People lined up against the protest, to where socialists of all kinds were selling (?) socialist newspapers for a dollar, and hawkers sold everything from anit-war buttons to signs denouncing bush. Someone noticed my lack of Propaganda and offered me a free button. Speeches were made, and a march ensued on the pentagon. I wandered along with the crowd taking pictures of protesters and riot cops... It was a very surreal experience... and in the process discovered somthing odd about the licence plates on the cars in D.C.:

Did you know thier tagline is "Taxation without Representation"?

Absence of the word "No". Just "Taxation without Representation"

Somthing to think about.

I did learn quite a bit from the experience... about both sides of the argument, just as I had hoped for. While I was disturbed by the amount of socialist propaganda going around, and I did grab a couple of socialist newsletters to read. Interesting, if, in my opinion, slightly misguided political ideas. I met some oldskool Yippies, some who claimed to have been present when they levitated the pentagon, and who claimed to be friends with Abbey Hoffman. I would reccomend the experience to anyone who's ideas are set in stone, on either side, as well as to anyone who is on the fence...

I'm resizing and uploading photos now, when the are done I will post a few.

 

[FearlessFreep]

and in the process discovered somthing odd about the licence plates on the cars in D.C.:

Did you know thier tagline is "Taxation without Representation"?

Absence of the word "No". Just "Taxation without Representation"

Somthing to think about.


That's a complaint of the citizens of D.C. They pay federal taxes but do not have representation in the federal government, hence the statement "Taxation Without Representation" is accurate and is a rueful protest comment on D.C license plates

 

[Cryozombie]

Here are some Photos from the March

 

[Cryozombie]

And just a couple more

 

[Mariachi Joe]

That is one of the beauties of this country. So many different ideologies marching, everyone got heard and no one got hurt.

 

[Cryozombie]

That's a complaint of the citizens of D.C. They pay federal taxes but do not have representation in the federal government, hence the statement "Taxation Without Representation" is accurate and is a rueful protest comment on D.C license plates

I see... it struck us as very odd.

 

[Mariachi Joe]

Now I have to say anyone who considers G.W. Bush to be worse than Mao or Stalin does not have a very good grasp on reality. Or is seriously lacking in their education.

 

[Blotan Hunka]

Looks like most of them were protesting barber shops and razors.

 

[Kacey]

Now I have to say anyone who considers G.W. Bush to be worse than Mao or Stalin does not have a very good grasp on reality. Or is seriously lacking in their education.

I agree.

I also found the wide variety of issues represented to be interesting.

 

[Cryozombie]

Now I have to say anyone who considers G.W. Bush to be worse than Mao or Stalin does not have a very good grasp on reality. Or is seriously lacking in their education.

There were some very Strange cats there... but on the flipside there were some fairly well educated, well informed and generally realistic people there as well.

Blotan, the same can be said on both sides... you should see the bikers who were there to "Stop" the protest.

 

[michaeledward]

There were some very Strange cats there... but on the flipside there were some fairly well educated, well informed and generally realistic people there as well.

Thank you.

I was going to point out that the images you post are a 'self-selected sample' of images. I would imagine that a wide spectrum of people would attend such a protest. You, like the rest of us, would probably take pictures of those things that interested you. Often times, it is the fringes that are most interesting.

 

[Cryozombie]

Thank you.
You, like the rest of us, would probably take pictures of those things that interested you. Often times, it is the fringes that are most interesting.

This is quite true... I took some pics of the general masses as well, but did not post them, as they were not the most interesting pics in the group.

 

[Jonathan Randall]

Now I have to say anyone who considers G.W. Bush to be worse than Mao or Stalin does not have a very good grasp on reality. Or is seriously lacking in their education.

So very true - there's no way of comparing the murderers of tens of millions to ANY American leader, past or present. That being said, I do consider Bush to be one worst presidents in a long time (he's tied, IMO, with LBJ).

One thing that always annoys me about the far left is to see Che Guevara photos, t-shirts stickers etc. Guevara was a ruthless killer and proponent of a totalitarian system, Communism, that has killed far more folks in the past century than any other ideology and thus he is no role model, IMO, for anyone.

 

[Cryozombie]

One thing that always annoys me about the far left is to see Che Guevara photos, t-shirts stickers etc.

There was a LOT, a LOT of socialist party stuff going around, and many of the Che Guevara posters you see were being distrbuted by the same guys handing out copys of the "Revolution" newsletter, which is a socialist publication.

 

[Jonathan Randall]

There was a LOT, a LOT of socialist party stuff going around, and many of the Che Guevara posters you see were being distrbuted by the same guys handing out copys of the "Revolution" newsletter, which is a socialist publication.

That's a major reason why, although I have been opposed to the Iraq War from the beginning, I avoid such demonstrations and limit my activism to writing letters to my elected representatives and supporting sites that carry a message against this war. I do NOT want to be aligned with the far left anymore than I would wish to be aligned with the far right.

 

[Cryozombie]

Sorry, My mistake Voice of Revolution was the Marxist paper i got.
​

 

[Last Fearner]

there's no way of comparing the murderers of tens of millions to ANY American leader, past or present.

That is absolutely true! Sometimes I believe present day citizens of most countries do not study their history enough to have anything valid to say about wars, politics, or international affairs. We all know there is corruption in the leadership of most any country, and in both major parties of American politics, but it is wise, in these troubled times, to not lose sight of who really are the good guys and the bad guys, and realize that we are not going to win against terrorists, or survive against a "jihad," without getting our hands dirty.

That being said, I do consider Bush to be one worst presidents in a long time (he's tied, IMO, with LBJ).

Well, I personally disagree with this. While I do not agree with everything President Bush has said or done, nor the way he presents himself when speaking, I believe he is doing what is best for America, and for other nations who believe in democracy in the long run. Wars are not pretty, nor desirable by decent people. However, to avoid war when pursuing a just cause in the over-view is foolish, and futile.

Consider General George Washington, who led a rebellion against a legal authority. He made many mistakes as a military leader, but his fortitude, and stubbornness kept him going until victory made him a hero and our first President. Abraham Lincoln (#16) sent union soldiers to kill fellow Americans in order to squash a rebellion in the southern United States. One of the main issues contested - - slavery. Not weapons of mass destruction, nor mass murder of an entire race, but owning people for slave labor. An unpopular decision, but Honest Abe stuck to his guns on the issue.

And let us not forget the tough decision that Harry S. Truman (#33) had to make when he authorized to dropping of two bombs on Japanese cities that killed millions of people, and animals. All this to end a war that we did not want to be in, in the first place. What would have happened if the U.S. did not join the Allied forces to stop Hitler. France refused to help their neighboring countries when Hitler invaded in the 1930s. Then Hitler proceeded to invade France.

If Hitler had his way, Americans would all be speaking German today. If the Japanese had their way, Americans would all be speaking Japanese by now. If Al Qaeda, the Taliban, Osama Bin Laden, Saddam Hussein, and these insurgents in Iraq had their way all Americans would be dead. They don't care if we leave Iraq or not, they still want us all dead, and will stop at nothing to accomplish that.

These rallies are good, if nothing more than to prove we are a true democracy. You couldn't have gone to this protest in many other countries without a high risk of being killed (typically by government officials).

Cheers to America for not being like those other countries.

Cheers to President Bush for not being a wimp.
(Inarticulate goof-ball, maybe - - but not a wimp!)

Last Fearner

 

[Sukerkin]

Lots of potentially volatile material here, most of which I'm going to stay well away from as I'm already 'wound up' with some work related stress right now.

However, quick question, I've heard several mentions of Communist/Socialist groups being active and propogandising around such issues as the one this thread is about. At the risk of being off-topic, can someone explain to a far away Englishmen what these groups think they're going to achieve? I don't know if they've noticed but every major player on the world stage that has tried Communism either has abandoned it or is in the process of abandoning it. I hardly think that the major protagonist of Communist regimes is going to change it's economic system because a few 'socialist' newspapers get shoved in peoples faces.

One other aside, you chaps do realise that your major ally (i.e. us ) technically has a 'socialist' government? I think perhaps we're using the same word to mean different things and would welcome any light that can be shed into this corner :tup:>

 

[Empty Hands]

At the risk of being off-topic, can someone explain to a far away Englishmen what these groups think they're going to achieve?

Permanent, worldwide revolution, the dictatorship of the proletariat, and a beautiful, neverending era in a worker's paradise.

Things are not going according to plan.

I don't know if they've noticed but every major player on the world stage that has tried Communism either has abandoned it or is in the process of abandoning it.

Ask most Marxists about this, and they will tell you that the countries in question didn't implement "real" Marxism. They have a point, in that a corrupt oligarchy wasn't in Marx's game plan. However, they don't seem to realize the massive problems inherent in achieving a "real" communist system without getting the above oligarchy or similar problems. Anarchists are even worse in this regard. Just because it worked in small communes for a few years, or in the countryside during the Spanish Civil War, doesn't mean it will work in all places for all time.

I hardly think that the major protagonist of Communist regimes is going to change it's economic system because a few 'socialist' newspapers get shoved in peoples faces.

Same for any activist groups, really. Do you think the world will stop eating meat because PeTA parades around naked models? Not likely.

One other aside, you chaps do realise that your major ally (i.e. us ) technically has a 'socialist' government? I think perhaps we're using the same word to mean different things and would welcome any light that can be shed into this corner :tup:>

This is a truth best ignored, everyone knows those Brits and Continentals are a bit off. :flame:

 

[Sukerkin]

ROFL

Cheers for that EH, I needed a grin after a long hard day at the capitalist grindstone .

My first degree is in Economics, so I'm fairly up to speed on how the different socio-economic systems are grounded. My question was really rather more weighted towards the 'why' such activist groups persist in pursuing a lost cause, when all they really achieve is to undermine the credability of any other 'cause' they latch themselves on to?

Definitely new thread material I think before we get taken outside and given a right good moderating . Unless of course the thread-meisters feel that this is close enough to topic to remain?