Kempo/kenpo and yoga

[kosho]

Hello,
I was just wondering how many of you take Yoga along with your kempo/kenpo training? In Kosho Ryu Kempo Under Hanshi Juchnik it is a part of training and a way to help you over all in the Martial arts.

I have been doing it for a short time now and I find myself more relaxed and getting better flexabilty.

anyone else here in kempo/kenpo do this???

Kosho

 

[Bay Area's Best]

What type of yoga are you learning? Mostly meditation or the excercises and or streches?

 

[bushidomartialarts]

We have a yoga program at our school, and I try to get in two hours a week for myself.

It's absolutely fantastic exercise and meditation. Almost completely dissimilar to our own beloved kenpo, though.

Still, the strength and flexibility carry buku benefits.

 

[KenpoDave]

Hello,
I was just wondering how many of you take Yoga along with your kempo/kenpo training? In Kosho Ryu Kempo Under Hanshi Juchnik it is a part of training and a way to help you over all in the Martial arts.

I have been doing it for a short time now and I find myself more relaxed and getting better flexabilty.

anyone else here in kempo/kenpo do this???

Kosho

I do a 90 minute program once a week, and attend a 60 minute class once a week. I agree about the benefits. It is amazing and quickly becoming a workout that I really look forward to.

 

[KenpoDave]

Hello,
I was just wondering how many of you take Yoga along with your kempo/kenpo training? In Kosho Ryu Kempo Under Hanshi Juchnik it is a part of training and a way to help you over all in the Martial arts.

I have been doing it for a short time now and I find myself more relaxed and getting better flexabilty.

anyone else here in kempo/kenpo do this???

Kosho

Can you explain to me the difference between what Mitose called "japanese yoga" and other yoga?

 

[kosho]

Can you explain to me the difference between what Mitose called "japanese yoga" and other yoga?

I do not know that much about Yoga or Japanese yoga. But I will
ask Pat Kelly Sensei and get back to you.

Kosho

 

[Gentle Fist]

I learned all I needed to know about relaxing in BJJ. If you don't relax you get choked out. :anic:

 

[KenpoDave]

Can you explain to me the difference between what Mitose called "japanese yoga" and other yoga?

I do not know that much about Yoga or Japanese yoga. But I will
ask Pat Kelly Sensei and get back to you.

Kosho

Thanks!

 

[KenpoDave]

Found this at http://www.senninfoundation.com/japanese_yoga.html

"The primary and most vital area of study at the Sennin Foundation Center is the practice of Japanese yoga (Shin-shin-toitsu-do). This art, inspired by the teachings of Nakamura Tempu Sensei, includes stretching exercises, seated meditation, moving meditation, breathing exercises, healing arts, and health improvement methods. The goal of these techniques is the realization of one's full potential in everyday life through the unification of mind and body.
In Japan, a number of time-honored everyday activities (such as making tea, arranging flowers, painting, and writing) have traditionally been examined deeply by their proponents. Students study how to make tea, perform martial arts, or write with a brush in the most skillful way possible--namely, to express themselves with maximum efficiency and minimum strain. Through this efficient, adroit, and creative performance, they arrive at art. But if they continue to delve even more deeply into their art, they discover principles that are truly universal, principles relating to life itself. Then, the art of brush writing becomes shodo--the "way of the brush"--while the art of arranging flowers is elevated to the status of kado--the "way of flowers." Through these "ways" or "do" forms ("tao" in Chinese), the Japanese have sought to realize the way of living itself. They have approached the universal through the particular.

Yet grasping the ultimate nature of life--the principles and way of the Universe--is seemingly a large-scale undertaking. (The Universe is infinite after all.) For this reason, it isn't difficult to understand the traditional emphasis on approaching the universal via a profound, ongoing examination of a particular way. Still, we must wonder if it isn't possible to discover the essence of living, and universal principles relating to all aspects of life, directly?
In 1919, Nakamura Tempu Sensei, upon returning from studying yoga in India, began to share with others principles and exercises that he felt were universal and not dependent on a particular art; that is, concepts relating to all activities and all people regardless of age, sex, or race. Methods that have observable and repeatable results, along with principles and exercises that can withstand objective scrutiny, were of primary importance to him."

There is more at the website.

Thoughts?

 

[newGuy12]

Thoughts?

The website says that he has a medical degree, and has researched the nervous system and the unification of mind and body!

I practiced American Kenpo with a very good Teacher, and He mentioned the Yoga to me. He now only gives private lessons, and I instead am a student at a TKD school (my only core art). Yet, the Yoga has given me many good feelings, and I still practice it. He is the one who prompted me to learn about this wonderful thing!

If you seek out a way to practice Yoga poses, you will find one to your liking and personality. Some prefer the static poses (I do). Some prefer more vigorous dynamic sequences. There is a wealth of information available these days. Many great Yoga teachers have moved to the West, and are publishing books!

Just be careful to not give up your Martial Art if you start to "beam up" too much! You may prefer the Yoga to the Fighting Arts if you are not careful. It is that lovely at times!

 

[Jim Hanna]

The Way, whether it be through the tea ceremony, flower arranging, etc., is so simple and yet so profound.

For example, Haiku is a very short form of poetry. It's rules are so easy to comprehend that children can write it.

Yet Basho, whom many consider to be the greatest haiku poet to ever live, stated that if a person can write 10 haiku in a lifetime then he is a master.

There are many people out there that can write 10 "looks like haiku" in a day. Its the difference between a manequin and a man.

Jim

 

[tellner]

Yoga is wonderful stuff. Rickson Gracie says it's the one indispensable part of his routine. Guro Inosanto says he does it every day to help with the toll his career has taken on his body.

I'm a little skeptical of the "Japanese Yoga" though. It dates from a time when Japanese culture was on the whole xenophobic, insanely racist, more jingoistic than the PNAC fan club and determined to show that whatever it was Japan's version was inherently superior and comprehensible only to the Exalted Nihonjin. I can't say as I'm particularly impressed by his chief disciple. I have never met a member of Tohei's ryu who lacked a really appalling sense of smug superiority and condescension towards every other spiritual practice and martial art around. I'm sure there are some, but in thirty years in the martial arts I have yet to meet any. Seriously.

With that degree of self-imposed blindness I find it difficult to believe that the Ki Society yoga is any better than the traditional Indian versions. Besides, as many authoritative teachers have pointed out, Yoga as a mental and physical technology does not have to be welded to some sort of religious philosophy about unifying the cosmos or grasping the essential nature of reality.

Just as an example, take a look at Scott Sonnon's Prasara Flow stuff (or Ageless, Mobility, Intu-Flow, Be Breathed, Softwork, etc.) He doesn't claim it's the Unholy Ichor of Great Cthulhu. But it does get results without being encumbered by delusions of its own superiority and is specifically designed with martial artists in mind. There is all sorts of other excellent yoga out there for MAists such as Bikram and Ashtanga.

 

[KenpoDave]

Tellner, you make some excellent points. I have studied yoga off and on for a number of years, and have been hitting it pretty regularly for a while. I don't know if you are familiar with James Mitose, but one of the facets of his family art mentioned in his book was "japanese yoga." I have been looking into that term recently and the site and quote I posted are, so far, the only references to that term I have come across.

What I am trying to find is either the particular poses that Mitose would have been taught, or as close an approximation as I can find. Not necessarily because I believe in any sort of superiority of a japanese yoga, but because I would like the opportunity to see how it would influence my art of kenpo. If there is indeed a particular yoga tied historically to my art, I'd like to find it.

Until I ran across that site, I was operating under the assumption that by "japanese yoga," Mitose was describing something that may not actually be "yoga" in a strict sense of the term. Perhaps a formalized stretching or calisthenic routine, whatever. As I said, other than Mitose's book, this website is the only reference I have come across yet.

 

[Benjp]

My kempo instructor teaches yoga as part of our training. I found it somewhat helpful and several years ago started serious yoga training with a yogi that teaches at my workplace.

I've found non-kempo yoga to be much more beneficial and helpful. Stretching and flexibility are key components to martial movement.. However, with the yoga I've been learning at work I've been able to draw on more significant benefits than just flexibility.

 

[KenpoDave]

My kempo instructor teaches yoga as part of our training. I found it somewhat helpful and several years ago started serious yoga training with a yogi that teaches at my workplace.

I've found non-kempo yoga to be much more beneficial and helpful. Stretching and flexibility are key components to martial movement.. However, with the yoga I've been learning at work I've been able to draw on more significant benefits than just flexibility.

Could you please elaborate on "non-kempo yoga" vs. "kempo yoga."

Thanks!

 

[Benjp]

Could you please elaborate on "non-kempo yoga" vs. "kempo yoga."

Oops, I didn't mean to make a distinction of types. The primary difference between the two is the style of teaching. (And based on my experiences with substitute yoga instructors, every yogi teaches differently )

In "kempo yoga" my kempo instructor is leading us in 10 minutes of yoga that might encompass a sun salutation and some triangle postures. He's taught yoga professionally but his current profession is teaching high school.

In "non-kempo yoga" my yogi leads us in an hour of yoga that is focussed on form and ultimately better yoga. This instructor teaches yoga full time and has just published a book on teaching yoga to children.

As far as Japanese yoga is concerned, the instructional issue aside, there are a few odd "asanas" that appear from time to time..

There is an asana called the Mitose sun salutation that differs greatly from any version of sun salutation I've ever seen.

There is also another asana that involves alternating leg kicks that follow the sequence: front kick, roundhouse kick, side kick, back hook kick, and back kick. It can be done by alternating after each kick or alternating after each sequence.

Unfortunately, I don't know the history of these.. I'll try to ask in my next class.

 

[KenpoDave]

In "kempo yoga" my kempo instructor is leading us in 10 minutes of yoga that might encompass a sun salutation and some triangle postures. He's taught yoga professionally but his current profession is teaching high school.

In "non-kempo yoga" my yogi leads us in an hour of yoga that is focussed on form and ultimately better yoga. This instructor teaches yoga full time and has just published a book on teaching yoga to children.

Thanks!

As far as Japanese yoga is concerned, the instructional issue aside, there are a few odd "asanas" that appear from time to time..

There is an asana called the Mitose sun salutation that differs greatly from any version of sun salutation I've ever seen.

There is also another asana that involves alternating leg kicks that follow the sequence: front kick, roundhouse kick, side kick, back hook kick, and back kick. It can be done by alternating after each kick or alternating after each sequence.

Unfortunately, I don't know the history of these.. I'll try to ask in my next class.

That would be great. Any info would be appreciated. Do you by any chance have any graphic references to the Japanese Yoga asanas, or a reference from which I may find them?

 

[Benjp]

That would be great. Any info would be appreciated. Do you by any chance have any graphic references to the Japanese Yoga asanas, or a reference from which I may find them?

This site has a version of the Mitose sun salution that looks very similar to what I practice in my dojo..

Regards,

Ben

 

[KenpoDave]

This site has a version of the Mitose sun salution that looks very similar to what I practice in my dojo..

Regards,

Ben

Thanks. I was wondering if that was what you may be referring to.

What about the "kicking asanas?"

 

[Benjp]

Hi Dave,

I've been following the yoga posts in both this forum and Dr. Sumner's forum.

As for the "kicking asanas", I'll break them down in to more detail--

1. right front kick
2. left front kick
3. right front roundhouse kick (my instructor teaches a roundhouse that resembles stepping over an obstacle and is ).
4. left front roundhouse kick
5. right side kick
6. left side kick
7. right back hook kick
8. left back hook kick
9. right back kick
10. left back kick.

notice there are 10 kicks total. Repeating this sequence ten times gives one hundred kicks. It's a great exercise for developing good kicking, but it's even better for developing a good sense of balance.

Even better for balance is doing it this way:
1. right front kick
2. right front roundhouse kick
3. right side kick
4. right back hook kick
5. right back kick
6-10. repeat first 5 with left leg.

Some other oddities that we do that might fall in to this category of yoga:
zig zag jumping patterns (both side to side and back and forth)
frog jumping (jumping as high as possible while pulling feet towards the body then landing quietly)
height jumping (jumping from a position considerably lower to a 2'-4' platform)

I've emailed my sensei's instructor, Larry Kraxberger, for information about the Japanese yoga that we do. I'll try and relay the information as best I can.

Regards,

Ben