I'm happy to see this Zhou Jia (Jow Ga)

[JowGaWolf]

One week of no training gave me some free time to check out some Jow Ga videos. I came across this. To see people train like this makes me happy.

 

[Kung Fu Wang]

One week of no training gave me some free time to check out some Jow Ga videos. I came across this. To see people train like this makes me happy.

Is that instep front kick only be used for groin kick?

In my long fist front kick, all the non-groin kicks are "downward curve" and not "upward curve".

 

[JowGaWolf]

Is that instep front kick only be used for groin kick?

Not for me and the type of training I do. It's been about 10 years since I've trained a groin kick like that.

In your clip my kicks like that would be directed at the ribs either vertically, horizontally, or inward. Striking is either done with the heel or the ball of the foot. I have front kicks that strike upward and downward. I'm not sure how the other schools trained there front kicks. Maybe only has a groin kick, but I don't know.

 

[JowGaWolf]

Is that instep front kick only be used for groin kick?

In my long fist front kick, all the non-groin kicks are "downward curve" and not "upward curve".

This is during a light sparring session.

 

[Kung Fu Wang]

I have front kicks that strike upward ...

How do you kick on heavy bag like this? The heavy bag is a vertical target and not a horizontal target? Many CMA guys kick like this and I don't understand why?



I have always believed that when people kick like this (upward front kick), they are not considering application at all. When people train front kick like this in their form, how will they use this kick for? Kick with toes?



This is the way I use my front kick. I don't know there are other ways (except heel kick).

 

[JowGaWolf]

How do you kick on heavy bag like this? I have always believed that when people kick like this (upward front kick), they are not considering application at all.

No I don't kick the heavy bag like that. I don't even kick like that in my forms. I don't know what the purpose of that kick is, unless it's a step and not a kick.

 

[Kung Fu Wang]

No I don't kick the heavy bag like that. I don't even kick like that in my forms. I don't know what the purpose of that kick is, unless it's a step and not a kick.

I always want to discuss the correct way to do the long fist front kick.

I had this problem before. During my long fist beginner level training, I was taught to kick like this. When I kicked on heavy bag like this, my toes hurt big time. I truly didn't believe to kick with toes was a good idea.



Until my long fist intermediate level training, I was taught to kick the correct way. One day I asked my long fist teacher why didn't we kick right during the beginner level training, I didn't get a satisfied answer from him.

IMO, if one has developed bad habit, it's hard to remove it.

 

[JowGaWolf]

I always want to discuss the correct way to do the long fist front kick.

I had this problem before. During my long fist beginner level training, I was taught to kick like this. When I kicked on heavy bag like this, my toes hurt big time. I truly didn't believe to kick with toes was a good idea.



Until my long fist intermediate level training, I was taught to kick the correct way. One day I asked my long fist teacher why didn't we kick right during the beginner level training, I didn't get a satisfied answer from him.

IMO, if one has developed bad habit, it's hard to remove it.

That's a big difference between the two. I would have never come to that conclusion. I don't know why systems do that to their forms. Because the student will train the incorrect way only to have to go back and correct it after it's become a habit. Not to mention that it's now time lost that could have been used to train it correctly.

 

[Damien]

In Shaolin we would use a flicking front kick to kick the groin and the head if it is lowered, say after hitting the groin! One thing to remember is that CMA always used to be trained with everyday shoes. That offers a certain level of protection that allows you to hit targets without hurting your toes.

I've seen it done in MMA too, but they pull the toes back and hit with the ball of the foot. A bit more awkward, but get it right and its a powerful kick.

If you want to talk weird upwards kicking habits, how about Muay Thai guys always (slight exaggeration) training with the pads held at an angle close to horizontal. You end up just kicking mostly upwards, which for a kick with the shin is not very helpful at all.

 

[JowGaWolf]

This is the way I use my front kick. I don't know there are other ways (except heel kick).

I use the heel when my opponent's torso is vertical and in range. I use the ball of my foot when my opponent's torso is at an angle or if the torso is vertical and slightly out of range. It's important to be good at pulling the toes back. The ball of the foot can be used when kicking force moves upward or forward. It just depends on your opponent's body position as to which force will be delivered.

The video of your kick reminds me of a Muay Thai teep

 

[Holmejr]

In Muay Thai the teep is a front kick where the foot pushes out then suddenly rolls forward then down. Combined with hip thrust it’s a powerful kick.
We would practice groin kicks similar to karate other MAs then immediately follow up with the teep chest/solar flex level. Left left, left right, right left and right right.

 

[JowGaWolf]

I always want to discuss the correct way to do the long fist front kick.

I had this problem before. During my long fist beginner level training, I was taught to kick like this. When I kicked on heavy bag like this, my toes hurt big time. I truly didn't believe to kick with toes was a good idea.



Until my long fist intermediate level training, I was taught to kick the correct way. One day I asked my long fist teacher why didn't we kick right during the beginner level training, I didn't get a satisfied answer from him.

IMO, if one has developed bad habit, it's hard to remove it.

If that's the kick, then what is the follow up movement in the form? Is it a new technique or is it the next thing that you do after the kick?

 

[Kung Fu Wang]

If that's the kick, then what is the follow up movement in the form? Is it a new technique or is it the next thing that you do after the kick?

In the form, after that kick is a palm strike (or fist punch) on the face.

 

[JowGaWolf]

In the form, after that kick is a palm strike (or fist punch) on the face.

Thanks

 

[punisher73]

How do you kick on heavy bag like this? The heavy bag is a vertical target and not a horizontal target? Many CMA guys kick like this and I don't understand why?

I have always believed that when people kick like this (upward front kick), they are not considering application at all. When people train front kick like this in their form, how will they use this kick for? Kick with toes?



This is the way I use my front kick. I don't know there are other ways (except heel kick).

As it was explained to me, that motion was used with shoes and was to the groin or under the chin. If you are targeting the pelvic or abdomen you would use the ball of the foot or the heel of the foot depending on application (thrust vs. snap).

 

[Kung Fu Wang]

As it was explained to me, that motion was used with shoes and was to the groin or under the chin. If you are targeting the pelvic or abdomen you would use the ball of the foot or the heel of the foot depending on application (thrust vs. snap).

I agree that the instep front kick can be used for groin kick and chin kick. But the usage is limited. Also the roundhouse kick can be used for groin kick and chin kick too.

IMO, the instep front kick can be considered as upward roundhouse kick. There is no extra benefit to train the instep front kick like the roundhouse kick.

 

[Damien]

I agree that the instep front kick can be used for groin kick and chin kick. But the usage is limited. Also the roundhouse kick can be used for groin kick and chin kick too.

IMO, the instep front kick can be considered as upward roundhouse kick. There is no extra benefit to train the instep front kick like the roundhouse kick.

Front kicks use different muscles than roundhouse and have a different trajectory, so depending on your abilities and your opponents, you might find uses. Plus the closed hip position means it has a shorter effective range than a roundhouse, and is less telegraphed id done well.

Different tools for different jobs as they say.

 

[JowGaWolf]

Front kicks use different muscles than roundhouse and have a different trajectory, so depending on your abilities and your opponents, you might find uses. Plus the closed hip position means it has a shorter effective range than a roundhouse, and is less telegraphed id done well.

Different tools for different jobs as they say.

Front kick works under the field of vision so most people won't won't see it until it's too late.

 

[isshinryuronin]

When people train front kick like this in their form, how will they use this kick for?

It's tricky to second guess the practicality of any move taken out of context from a form!!!!

An upward front kick seemingly to the body (a glancing blow at best) is likely a kick to the head. If you rewind to the previous move or two you would likely see a technique that results in the opponent bending over so the head is actually at body height. This type of thing is very common in forms and leads to the uninformed being confused about the effectiveness of the moves.

 

[Kung Fu Wang]

Find this front kick clip.