I need some help!

[blue_star_17]

I have been taking TKD for three years now and we have a diffrent belt system then most.

white
white green stripe #1 for Kibon Poomse
White green stripe #2 for taeguk #1
White Black stripe#1
White Black stripe #2
Green belt
Green belt blue stripe #1 for Taeguk #2
Green belt blue stripe #2 for taeguk # 3
Green belt black stripe #1
green belt black stripe #2
Blue belt

I have learned at the moment taeguk # 4 and am having a hard time with #5. It is a little confusing to me because of how diffrent it is getting and I keep second guessing my movements for taeguk oh jang
Can anyone tell me what the exact movements are for #5 so I know that I have it?

Thanks!

A Humble Student:
Blue_star_17

 

[Last Fearner]

Hi Blue Star 17, and welcome to Martial Talk.

This seems like a bit of an unusual request for on-line help. Usually, students have questions about a specific technique, or concept, but to explain an entire form is typically the job of your instructor. Perhaps you could help by telling us what your instructor has taught you, and what, specifically, you are having trouble with.

Most of your questions about forms can be answered by your teacher if you approach him or her. I'm sure that members here can help you with gaining a better understanding of the form, and its movements if you ask specific questions.

Look forward to your reply.
CM D.J. Eisenhart

 

[cali_tkdbruin]

For step by step poomse Taeguek Oh Jang instructions try the Kukkiwon's web site at:

http://www.kukkiwon.or.kr/english/information/information04_03_5.jsp?div=04

It's very informative.

 

[FieldDiscipline]

Beat me to it there! The advantage of that is you know the movements are those currently sanctioned by the WTF.

 

[TKDmel]

I would have to second both Last Fearner and Cali in that your instructor could help you understand why and what each movement is for, and the kikkiwon site mentioned is an excellent source of info on how and where each movement goes. It helped me understand the movements better when I realized that each form builds upon the previous one. For example, kibon poomse teaches the most basic stances and punces. The next form builds on those skills by adding a new technique to incorporate and learn. I don't know if this helped but keep at it, and it will all make sense. Welcome to MT.

 

[terryl965]

I would have to second both Last Fearner and Cali in that your instructor could help you understand why and what each movement is for, and the kikkiwon site mentioned is an excellent source of info on how and where each movement goes. It helped me understand the movements better when I realized that each form builds upon the previous one. For example, kibon poomse teaches the most basic stances and punces. The next form builds on those skills by adding a new technique to incorporate and learn. I don't know if this helped but keep at it, and it will all make sense. Welcome to MT.

I can only say what others have said

 

[ajs1976]

I use an older version of this book to help me out between classes while i'm practicing at home. http://www.amazon.com/Official-Taek..._bbs_sr_1/105-4146982-5018816?ie=UTF8&s=books

 

[blue_star_17]

ok the part I am having a problem with is:

I know its forward stance down block then walking stance hammer fist to the left, then to the right, then its inside block, inside block, left side in forward stance then right side front snap kick outside right hand block in forward stance then inside block left hand then front snap left then outside block left then inside block right then slideing forward on the right side with a back fist right hand. but after that I can't figure out which way to turn in order to get in to left back stance.....I think I turn keeping the left leg on the ground but wouldn't that make me go in to right side back stance???

 

[Miles]

Welcome to MT!

You are going to pivot counter-clockwise on your forward right leg into the right back stance (i.e. right leg is back). It is a 270 degree turn.

This is the same way you pivoted in TG2, TG3, and TG4. It is not a new concept to TG5.

BTW, after the first set of inside blocks, the next 2 series of hand combinations start with a front backfist strike (first right, and then left side, respectively). Go to the Kukkiwon website that was mentioned previously and watch GM LEE, Chong Kwan perform the poomsae.

Good Luck in your training!

Miles

 

[blue_star_17]

Thank you for your help!

A humble student:

Blue_star_17

 

[Last Fearner]

Hello again, Blue Star 17

I am glad you got the help you wanted, but I still missed the part about your instructor. Your profile says you have been studying Taekwondo for three years. Do you study from a teacher? What did your teacher say in regards to these issues. The direction of pivot, and the fact that your hand techniques in #6 and 7 are Front Back-Fist Strikes followed by an Inward Body Block after each Front Kick should have been covered in your class.

I mean no disrespect to you, nor am I attempting to discourage you or others from asking questions here at MT (so please, no negative reps for my being honest here), but what puzzles me is that these are simple Q & A that are usually resolved by classroom instruction, or asking your instructor when confused. I am a teacher, and as such, I would hope that my students would get the correct movements from me in class. If they are confused, they should ask me. If they are not ready to learn the next form, or the next part of a form, then I would expect them to be patient, and wait until I teach it to them.

I am just wondering what the relationship is with your own instructor, and why it seems to have broken down in this case. I am attempting to be helpful to you here more than critical, and rather than to just give you an answer. I value the respect, and relationship a student should have with their teacher over finding out the answer to a simple question on the internet.

What do you think?

Respectfully,
CM D.J. Eisenhart
______________________
Last Fearner

 

[zDom]

I would *definately* check with your instructor.

While the Web site above may give the latest "official" version of the form, your instructor MIGHT want you to do it another way.

For example, I was taught Oh Chong with midsection sidekicks followed by midsection elbow strikes, explained as "sidekick folds them over, hand pulls the head into an elbow strike."

Also, the last X-stance was taught to me with supporting foot pointing AT the opponent, instead of 90 degrees to the side as shown on the Web site.

The forms are changed periodically. It is best to do them as taught to you by your instructor.

 

[blue_star_17]

I do study under a instructor.
Last Fearner thank you for telling me what you think and I hope you know that I figured you meant no dis respect. The problem with me is I always second guess myself and I did talk with my instructor about the poomse.. She told me that I got the movements down and that the only thing I need to do now is improve the movements..(make them have more power and better timing).

she said I need to not think so much about the movements because when I think WAY to much I forget what I am doing.. she said "I know to you this sound's a little strange...but don't think about it just do the poomse".... I'm an over thinker...if that makes any sense at all.....My instructor also said I think to low of myself and I need to work on that as well.... I have trouble asking for help, I have always had that issue... it's funny that she said I know the movements because I kept second guessing myself maybe that is the problem...

I agree with you by the way:

A humble student:_Blue star_17

 

[blue_star_17]

I look up to my teacher a lot.
I respect her and in a lot of ways I hope to one day be as full of knowledge as she.
I know what you are saying yet I want to make sure you understand that I respect my teacher more then anyone would ever know..... I was a little offended but it's ok.. we have a strange system when it comes to poomse's anyway atleast with what I have seen..

Most other classes I know of only do Taeguk poomse's and my teacher said she is not getting rid of Kibon poomse because it is a very basic poomse...

we only have about 7 belts in are belt system excluding the stripes

it goes white, green, blue, adv. red, adv. brown, black, 1st dan black belt


she got rid of yellow belt orange belt and purple belt as well, she also required me to test for my white belt... each belt we are expected to learn 2 poomse's .
I have learned the movements in kibon poomse , taeguk 1, taeguk 2, taeguk 3, taeguk 4, and now taeguk number five and might test for my poomse stripes next month..... She said if she does not see stronger movements by next month I will not test (which is fair.)

I have been practicing a lot and I alway get scared when it comes to testing....I always expect to fail for some reason even though I train everyday...... I don't understand why I am that way but I don't think it is helping me much to think in that way at all.

My teacher said she thinks I will one day make a wonderful teacher and when I heard that I was so happy! I love helping others in class and my teacher seems to expect a lot from me because she knows I REALLY want to teach someday... one time she didn't like my side kick so she put a sand weight around my leg and told me to do that kick until I could not kick anymore.... that took an hour.

 

[terryl965]

Blue star glad to hear you respect your teacher and also glad you are under formal training, just remember practice make perfect and perfect needs practice. One cannot exsist without the other.
Last Fearner always gives great advice he is a wonderful man and has alot of knowledge, we have alot of great TKD practnitioers here on MT> I hope you find your training to be enlighting as well.
Terry

 

[Last Fearner]

I look up to my teacher a lot.
I respect her and in a lot of ways I hope to one day be as full of knowledge as she.
I know what you are saying yet I want to make sure you understand that I respect my teacher more then anyone would ever know.....

Blue star, I am glad to hear that you have a good relationship with your teacher and respect her so much. She sounds like a wonderful teacher and a positive influence on you.

I was a little offended but it's ok..

I am sorry if I offended you. Sometimes I get a sense of what I believe a student is lacking, or seriously needs as far as redirecting their focus and priorities. I do this with my own students. Occasionally, I use a very abrupt, straight-forward approach which gets right to the heart of the problem. Sometimes I am off on my first hunch, which is easier to have happen on the internet, but I ask the tough questions, and get to the root of the problem.

I have been practicing a lot and I alway get scared when it comes to testing....I always expect to fail for some reason even though I train everyday...... I don't understand why I am that way but I don't think it is helping me much to think in that way at all.

Being scared, nervous, or apprehensive about testing is a common experience for most students. I still have some of these feelings when I test. In time, you learn how to control your emotions, fears, and distractions while still performing at your peek abilities. You will gain confidence in yourself, and testings will get easier to face, even as they become more difficult and challenging.

she said I need to not think so much about the movements because when I think WAY to much I forget what I am doing.. she said "I know to you this sound's a little strange...but don't think about it just do the poomse".... I'm an over thinker...if that makes any sense at all.....

This makes a lot of sense to me. I have had many students who do the same thing. Your instructor is giving you good advice, and you just need to relax and do the techniques with confidence.

My instructor also said I think to low of myself and I need to work on that as well.... it's funny that she said I know the movements because I kept second guessing myself maybe that is the problem...

Remember, you are the product of your instructor multiplied by the number of times you do what your instructor says. More than confidence in yourself, if you have confidence in your instructor, you won't second guess her by second guessing yourself. Don't believe that any failure, or shortcoming on your part will cause you to fall short of her expectations, but that her abilities as a teacher will help you rise to your potential in spite of yourself. In time, you will come to realize that you had it in you all the time, and your instructor simply drew it out to the surface.

I have trouble asking for help...

I sensed this the most, which is why I was so adamant about going to your instructor with these questions.

My teacher said she thinks I will one day make a wonderful teacher and when I heard that I was so happy! I love helping others in class and my teacher seems to expect a lot from me because she knows I REALLY want to teach someday...

I am glad to hear that you desire to teach. Students should jump at the opportunity to be a class leader, or assist instruction any chance they get. We tend to get better ourselves as we teach, and demonstrate the art to others. It takes a better understanding of the subject to teach it rather than to just be a student which makes us try harder. It is difficult to demonstrate how to do techniques and self defense skills to a class of students if you can't perform them well yourself. Teaching puts the pressure on you to look good and know your stuff.

It sounds like you are on the right path, and have a good instructor to guide you! I hope you stick with it, and do well!

CM D.J. Eisenhart

P.S. Thank you, Master Stoker, for your kind words! :asian:

 

[exile]

BlueStar, I would add only one thing to the excellent advice you've already gotten. It's definitely the case that if you `think too much' while you're doing the poomsae, you're going to lose track of where you are—especially as you advance and the poomsae you learn become longer and/or more intricate. So one part of your mind has to in effect train itself to just internalize the movements and work on getting them to flow smoothly...

... but it's also the case that these poomsae, these patterns of martial techniques, contain a wealth of information about actual combat tactics guided by the overall strategy that TKD embodies as a martial art. It is useful and profitable to analyze these various patterns in a way that gives you a number of battle-tested scenarios you can use to respond to a variety of moves by an attacker. That's one of the great benefits of poomsae, or kata in karate, or the comparable forms learned by students of Chinese and Filipine martial arts. It's difficult not to be curious about why one move is followed by another—why a particular strike follows a particular block. Often the answer is at first surpising: both the block and the strike movements correspond to different applications in real combat than you think they do at first—the block movement may be intended to be applied as a strike, the strike movement may be intended to be applied as a throw, and so on. So kata/poomsae analysis is important, and should be encouraged, once you're introduced to it.

The key thing, I think, it to learn how to compartmentalize performance and analysis so that you learn how to execute the form exactly the way your instructor wants you to (she has her reasons for having you do it that way, regardless of what the Kukkiwon says! ), but also learn to think about the possible fighting applications of the poomsae you learn. At this stage of your training, you'll almost certainly find it easier to keep the two activities separate. But eventually you will want to understand the logic of the combat scenarios that the poomsae are providing for you. The idea isn't that you should stop thinking about poomsae... just do that thinking later on, after your training session, and use that time during that session to `groove' the poomsae into your muscle memory.