honorary black belt

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jbclinic

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what's an honorary black belt?, is that a rank? GM parker issued this to elvis then he became ranked i think,but what kind of merit does this title hold?
 

Jonathan Randall

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jbclinic said:
what's an honorary black belt?, is that a rank? GM parker issued this to elvis then he became ranked i think,but what kind of merit does this title hold?
First question, it's a gesture of courtesy, friendship and respect. Second question; much harder to answer. It can mean many different things. For many years, Chinese styles did not use any type of ranking system and when my Kenpo teacher got a student with 15+ years of serious training, he had him wear a black belt. In other cases, it has ABSOLUTELY no meaning beyond - a gesture of friendship, courtesy or respect.

For instance, I believe that several Presidents of the United States have been awarded honorary black belts. I don't think there is anything wrong with this - the instructor (Jhoon Rhee, I believe) was simply acknowledging their position and also forwarding the interests of the martial arts.

HOWEVER, and there's always a however, isn't there? Some unscrupulous individuals will take purely honorary rank and misrepresent it as a legitimate instructor certification. Please, no names! We all know who these people are by now. If you don't, do a search on MT or any other large martial arts forums rather than re-ignite old flame wars. Pretty please, with a cherry on top...
 
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jbclinic

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thanks that was helpful, i'd struggled with that, a couple of instructors said this to me, i now undersyand that they appreciate my abilities in martial arts
 

jfarnsworth

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Do a search in the general section (I believe) as there was a very long discussion on this very topic. Happy reading.
 

Mark Lynn

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jbclinic said:
what's an honorary black belt?, is that a rank? GM parker issued this to elvis then he became ranked i think,but what kind of merit does this title hold?

Actually I think Elvis earned his rank in Kenpo under Parker (I think 2nd dan) and then some Korean Master gave him the honorary rank.

Mark
 

Grenadier

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The way I see it, it's a gesture of courtesy, and respect, but should always be taken with several grains of salt. Maybe the person receiving the honorary black belt has some skills in the martial arts, maybe not.

It's the same way with honorary degress from various colleges; just because someone has an honorary degree from a prestigious university, does not necessarily convey that they have any significant knowledge in that area.
 

arnisador

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The Boar Man said:
Actually I think Elvis earned his rank in Kenpo under Parker (I think 2nd dan) and then some Korean Master gave him the honorary rank.
If I understand correctly, he earned a low black belt rank from Mr. Parker and was given a higher honorary rank from him in order to help promote the art and/or for what he had already done to help promote the art.

A few relevant links:
http://www.martialtalk.com/forum/showthread.php?t=921
http://www.martialtalk.com/forum/showthread.php?t=22015
http://www.martialtalk.com/forum/showthread.php?t=23842
 

Mark Lynn

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Thanks for the links I'll check them out. I was basing my comment on a vauge recollection of an article I read in International Fighter Magazine in the 80's. I went to the State Fair of TX. a couple of weeks ago and they had an Elvis exhibit and in that exhibit they had that magazine displayed.

Mark
 

jfarnsworth

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Jeff Boler

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Simply put, it's a mistake. A rather famous Ninjutsu instructor gave an honorary 10th Dan to a rather infamous Judo instructor, and it was nothing but trouble. It was misused from the moment it was received, to the point that the "infamous" person in question created a Ninjutsu division shortly after.

There are other, more appropriate gestures of good will that wont bite you in the **** later.
 

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I don't really see anything about this that could be seen in a positive way. If someone already holds legitimate rank in one system, why would anyone from a different system need to give them honorary rank, even if it is in recognition of legitimate skills? If a person wants to train in another art and earn rank along the way, that is fine. But to have honorary rank just handed to them based on past training seems pointless.

Giving someone honorary rank as a social or professional courtesy seems just as pointless. Why add to the confusion by having a bunch of people who were awarded rank for which they have no knowledge and skills? There are enough people already running around with rank they don't deserve. Why compound that by deliberately handing out this kind of rank? Never made sense to me.
 

Gemini

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Flying Crane said:
Giving someone honorary rank as a social or professional courtesy seems just as pointless. Why add to the confusion by having a bunch of people who were awarded rank for which they have no knowledge and skills? There are enough people already running around with rank they don't deserve. Why compound that by deliberately handing out this kind of rank? Never made sense to me.
We had a 7 year old student who, as an orange belt was diagnosed with Leukemia and was terminal. We held a kick-a-thon in his honor as a fund raiser. At this event, he was awarded an honorary black belt because he was only expected to live a few more months. This year we did it again because I guess no one ever explained to him what "terminal" meant. He's still with us.

Heart of a Black Belt.
 

tshadowchaser

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I dislike the idea. I once gave a Honor Black Belt to someone that was only supposed to live a few more months. Well they didn't die and the organization i belonged to at the time said "nope he's a black belt with all privileges".

I can't tell you how much it burns me to see him strut around like he actually earned it. Worse after I left the organization he opened up school less than 5 miles from me
 

James Kovacich

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Gene Lebell recent received 2 (I think) 9th & honorary 10th Dan's from Japan and in the same Black belt article that wrote about it Gene called them "legitimate."
 

Flying Crane

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akja said:
Gene Lebell recent received 2 (I think) 9th & honorary 10th Dan's from Japan and in the same Black belt article that wrote about it Gene called them "legitimate."
why, in the name of all that is holy and sacred, would someone like Gene Lebell feel the need to accept an honorary rank?
 

James Kovacich

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arnisador said:
What were the organizations?
I don't remember the org's but I think I remember them being the big ones like JKA or something. It was in the last few months, I'll look and post it.
 

James Kovacich

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Flying Crane said:
why, in the name of all that is holy and sacred, would someone like Gene Lebell feel the need to accept an honorary rank?
Only he could answer that one. But he did, it was in Black belt in the last few months. I have the mag, I'll post more on it.
 

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