Can an underweight man realistically protect himself/fight his way out of a situation?

[drewtoby]

I keep coming back to this question. I'm 6 foot and weigh in at a scale-tipping 140lbs (I run) :mst:, and have been training in hapkido the past several years. I know hapkido is designed to not be dependent on strength, but being so light gives me a lot smaller margin of error with my locks/throws/ect. Also, it makes several throws/locks not viable in a real life scenario.

Then we come to the striking issue: if I am unable to throw or lock my opponent for whatever reason, my strikes have significantly less force than that of a larger person. While it comes down to vital targets, I would take a wrecking ball over a hammer. Oh, and I don't have muscle/fat to help protect me.

The only two things I have going for me are endurance and determination. That and the element of surprise, 2 fold (the side of me most don't know exist, and hapkido). Which, surprise is crucial for hapkido, as most don't expect someone to be able to do some of the things we do.

But, back to the main question: is it realistic for someone like me to be able to protect himself/fight his way out of any surprise situations? Especially against a larger opponent? (multiple opponents are subject to debate for heavier people, so I'll leave this one out for now)

(By fight I mean being cornered, and having no choice but to take the guy(s) down)

 

[skribs]

Couldn't find the fight on Youtube, but there is a 400-pound difference here and the bigger guy gets TKO'd. I'm not as small as you (5'6, 165) but I'm not the strongest or fastest, and I am having trouble with hapkido sparring. They say I need to snap more, wrestle less, but it's a steep learning curve for me right now, so I know what you mean. I have small hands, too, which makes getting the proper grip a bit more difficult.

I think in a real fight, small guys like us have to pick our targets. Eyes, nose, groin, and neck are all prime targets that we should be able to hit fairly hard.

 

[David43515]

As long as you 1) focus on the real goal (getting out of the bad situation and getting home safe), and 2) don't try to forget your short-comings and fight the other guy's fight you should be okay.
Obviously you need to be more aware of range and footwork because you can't expect to stand toe-to-toe with a big guy and trade punches, but none of use should be doing that anyway. Work with your strengthes and try to improve some of your weaknesses a bit at a time...just like everyone else.

 

[DennisBreene]

While I'm not small 5'9" 195, I have cardiomyopathy and don't have the stamina I used to, and it has caused me to reassess how I would approach personal defense against someone stronger. I really enjoy working with someone bigger and stronger because it forces me to be precise with techniques to be effective. There is always someone stronger. You have to make your art your own and hone the skills you can use effectively even when it requires that you modify the technique.

 

[Hanzou]

I keep coming back to this question. I'm 6 foot and weigh in at a scale-tipping 140lbs (I run) :mst:, and have been training in hapkido the past several years. I know hapkido is designed to not be dependent on strength, but being so light gives me a lot smaller margin of error with my locks/throws/ect. Also, it makes several throws/locks not viable in a real life scenario.

Then we come to the striking issue: if I am unable to throw or lock my opponent for whatever reason, my strikes have significantly less force than that of a larger person. While it comes down to vital targets, I would take a wrecking ball over a hammer. Oh, and I don't have muscle/fat to help protect me.

The only two things I have going for me are endurance and determination. That and the element of surprise, 2 fold (the side of me most don't know exist, and hapkido). Which, surprise is crucial for hapkido, as most don't expect someone to be able to do some of the things we do.

But, back to the main question: is it realistic for someone like me to be able to protect himself/fight his way out of any surprise situations? Especially against a larger opponent? (multiple opponents are subject to debate for heavier people, so I'll leave this one out for now)

(By fight I mean being cornered, and having no choice but to take the guy(s) down)

From a Bjj/Judo perspective, yes you can. I don't know how Hapkido does things, but in my art (Bjj) I see it all the time. Royce Gracie dominated larger opponents throughout the first and second UFC.

 

[Touch Of Death]

I keep coming back to this question. I'm 6 foot and weigh in at a scale-tipping 140lbs (I run) :mst:, and have been training in hapkido the past several years. I know hapkido is designed to not be dependent on strength, but being so light gives me a lot smaller margin of error with my locks/throws/ect. Also, it makes several throws/locks not viable in a real life scenario.

Then we come to the striking issue: if I am unable to throw or lock my opponent for whatever reason, my strikes have significantly less force than that of a larger person. While it comes down to vital targets, I would take a wrecking ball over a hammer. Oh, and I don't have muscle/fat to help protect me.

The only two things I have going for me are endurance and determination. That and the element of surprise, 2 fold (the side of me most don't know exist, and hapkido). Which, surprise is crucial for hapkido, as most don't expect someone to be able to do some of the things we do.

But, back to the main question: is it realistic for someone like me to be able to protect himself/fight his way out of any surprise situations? Especially against a larger opponent? (multiple opponents are subject to debate for heavier people, so I'll leave this one out for now)

(By fight I mean being cornered, and having no choice but to take the guy(s) down)

To be blunt, this is more about you not knowing what you are doing. Quit worrying about your weight and get to work on the training floor.

 

[Xue Sheng]

Both of these guys hit pretty hard, and I am betting could knock down larger opponents, and they are far from heavy weights

 

[sopraisso]

Both of these guys hit pretty hard, and I am betting could knock down larger opponents, and they are far from heavy weights

^To the op.
And they could also hit their opponent's eyes, throat or groin quite easily and wouldn't even think about it, it seems. ;-)
Never forget self defense fighting is not like sparring of any sort. The goal is not to win, but not to lose (you may be cornered but as long as you create an opening to escape and you use it, you probably "won"); there are no forbidden techniques (specially for your opponent aggressor); there is no guarantee it will be a 1x1 fight; there's no rule or referee to prevent you from using a pen, a brick, a chair or whatever improvised weapon if you need, and surely there won't be anyone to prevent your aggressor from using weapons as well; and no matter how it ends, it is always a bad experience. But if you watch your back carefully you can probably pretty much avoid every possibility of going through that terrible experience in your life. A good practitioner trains to be ready to use the art, but a better practitioner also makes sure he/she will never need to use it. You may possibly know everything I'm saying here, but just in case... ;-)

Enviado de meu GT-I9300 usando Tapatalk

 

[drewtoby]

To be blunt, this is more about you not knowing what you are doing. Quit worrying about your weight and get to work on the training floor.

Partly true. I transferred dojangs and am now neither master of new or old. I'm feeling lost sometimes in the new material.

 

[Balrog]

If I may....

Keep in mind some basic concepts:

1. If they can't see you....
2. If they can't touch you...
3. If they can't breathe....
4. If they can't stand up....

....they can't hurt you.

Concentrate on training to where you can make one or more of those things true. Your size doesn't matter. A 12 year old girl might be attacked by a 250 pound male. But she can generate enough power to blow out one of his knees (making #4 true) and escape. If she can do it, so can you.

 

[TaiChiTJ]

Partly true. I transferred dojangs and am now neither master of new or old. I'm feeling lost sometimes in the new material.

Honesty. Always a good first step on the road to sorting things out! Hang in there and good luck.

 

[oftheherd1]

Partly true. I transferred dojangs and am now neither master of new or old. I'm feeling lost sometimes in the new material.

So you were a master of the previous techniques you learned? Use them in a fight if you must.

I am curious as I don't understand what you mean by needing more "snap." Could you explain that? As to Hapkido, at least the Hapkido I learned, speed and accuracy are needed. A certain amount of strength is needed, but mostly you are working against muscles that are weak themselves. You don't therefore, need the strength of a body builder. You should be working against weaker muscles on joints, using techniques.

We had a throw at a very basic level that required slipping out of a grip to a wrist and grabbing the opponents wrist, pulling the opponent off balance, and pulling him over your shoulder. It helped the technique that we used our free arm under the crotch to lift the opponent. Used forcefully, that arm will make the opponent want to jump over your shoulder.

Much of Hapkido works that way. We had a break where we moved under the opponent's grabbing arm, around behind the opponent and putting him in an arm lock, then pulling the head back to a painful position. What made it work was the use of a pressure point on the opponent's elbow. We never try to get into a contest of who is stronger. But for sure, who is faster and more accurate. Are you being taught things like that?

You are not going to be a TKD striker or kicker, but you should be close so that your strikes and kicks are effective. Are you being taught how to strike and kick with power and Gi, or just told to hit and kick?

You should be taught many techniques so on those (rare) occasions where size might make one technique less effective, another will make differences in size of no importance.

 

[lklawson]

I keep coming back to this question.

I hate to be Daisy Downer, but you worry too much. "Under weight" is a very flexible term and should be judged in context of the situation. Further, it is only one variable in a vast pantheon of variables, ruling the odds in any encounter. 140 lb might be "under weight" when compared to a 250 lb C.O. but it might be a different thing entirely when stacked against a 98 lb kid. Other variables include length of bones, and endurance.

And even the modern pseudo-medical definition of "under weight" has way too many assumptions built in. "Ideal weight" is an overly simplified "idealism" of what the mean weight should be among a give population. It doesn't do a good job of taking human body types into account such as endomorph, or ectomorph, nor does it take into account body-mass ratio or strength-to-weight ratio.




Stop worrying so much. Train smart and often. Eat a good diet. Pretty much end of story there.

Peace favor your sword,
Kirk

 

[MJS]

I keep coming back to this question. I'm 6 foot and weigh in at a scale-tipping 140lbs (I run) :mst:, and have been training in hapkido the past several years. I know hapkido is designed to not be dependent on strength, but being so light gives me a lot smaller margin of error with my locks/throws/ect. Also, it makes several throws/locks not viable in a real life scenario.

Then we come to the striking issue: if I am unable to throw or lock my opponent for whatever reason, my strikes have significantly less force than that of a larger person. While it comes down to vital targets, I would take a wrecking ball over a hammer. Oh, and I don't have muscle/fat to help protect me.

The only two things I have going for me are endurance and determination. That and the element of surprise, 2 fold (the side of me most don't know exist, and hapkido). Which, surprise is crucial for hapkido, as most don't expect someone to be able to do some of the things we do.

But, back to the main question: is it realistic for someone like me to be able to protect himself/fight his way out of any surprise situations? Especially against a larger opponent? (multiple opponents are subject to debate for heavier people, so I'll leave this one out for now)

(By fight I mean being cornered, and having no choice but to take the guy(s) down)

Size and strength do play a part, but IMO, not as big of a part as some like to say. But to answer your question...yes, a smaller person could be capable of defending themselves.

 

[Gnarlie]

OP: Do you believe that it's possible for a woman to defend / fight her way out of a situation?

Gnarlie

 

[ballen0351]

When my wife was a cop she would take big guys down often. She's 5'4. 120 pounds. So yeah its not the size of the dog in the fight it's the size of the fight in the dog.

 

[Dirty Dog]

All the platitudes aside, the truth is that size does matter. It's certainly not the only factor, but it matters.

Two people, roughly the same degree of training, skill and physical abilities. One is 5'7, 120lbs, the other is 6'4", 250lbs.

Which one do you prefer to get hit by?

Obviously, the smaller.

That being said, a self-defense situation is rarely about who can hit harder. It's about mindset. It's about speed. It's about taking advantage of opportunities.

Mindset:
Are you willing to win? By that I mean, are you willing to do whatever is required to end the conflict in whatever manner is the safest for you? Sometimes that can mean putting your opponent on the ground and subduing them till they calm down, or until help arrives. Sometimes it can mean causing them a significant injury. Sometimes it can mean crippling them. Sometimes it can mean killing them.
While we all (I assume) hope that none of the latter cases ever applies, they're possible. And there are people who are absolutely psychologically incapable of killing, crippling, or maiming. These people are at a distinct disadvantage in the survival game, but it's important to honestly evaluate what you are and are not willing to do to another human being, and train accordingly. It wouldn't do you any good to learn the Dim Mak Death Touch if you simply couldn't bring yourself to use it.

Speed:
When I first started training I was a little guy. Even after I grew, I still spent a fair bit of time sparring with people who were considerably larger than me. I am pretty sure that some of them could have hit me so hard my kids would have gotten bruises. But big means more mass. Which means they're going to be a little slower and not be able to change direction as quickly. And of course, there is a very good reason body builders make rotten marathon runners.
The biggest advantage a small person has vs a larger one is speed. Learn to use it not just for striking, but evading.

Opportunities:
Can you distract them? Can you attract attention from others who might help? Did your attacker slip, giving you the chance to push him down/sweep his legs/whatever, dropping him to the ground and allowing you to escape? Keep in mind that the goal of most self-defense scenarios is to escape with minimal or no injuries. That doesn't necessarily mean beating them down. Keep the real goal in mind and don't get stuck fighting when it's no longer necessary.

How hard you can hit only really matters if you're going toe to toe exchanging blows. And that's just about the last thing you want to do.

 

[Touch Of Death]

All the platitudes aside, the truth is that size does matter. It's certainly not the only factor, but it matters.

Two people, roughly the same degree of training, skill and physical abilities. One is 5'7, 120lbs, the other is 6'4", 250lbs.

Which one do you prefer to get hit by?

Obviously, the smaller.

That being said, a self-defense situation is rarely about who can hit harder. It's about mindset. It's about speed. It's about taking advantage of opportunities.

Mindset:
Are you willing to win? By that I mean, are you willing to do whatever is required to end the conflict in whatever manner is the safest for you? Sometimes that can mean putting your opponent on the ground and subduing them till they calm down, or until help arrives. Sometimes it can mean causing them a significant injury. Sometimes it can mean crippling them. Sometimes it can mean killing them.
While we all (I assume) hope that none of the latter cases ever applies, they're possible. And there are people who are absolutely psychologically incapable of killing, crippling, or maiming. These people are at a distinct disadvantage in the survival game, but it's important to honestly evaluate what you are and are not willing to do to another human being, and train accordingly. It wouldn't do you any good to learn the Dim Mak Death Touch if you simply couldn't bring yourself to use it.

Speed:
When I first started training I was a little guy. Even after I grew, I still spent a fair bit of time sparring with people who were considerably larger than me. I am pretty sure that some of them could have hit me so hard my kids would have gotten bruises. But big means more mass. Which means they're going to be a little slower and not be able to change direction as quickly. And of course, there is a very good reason body builders make rotten marathon runners.
The biggest advantage a small person has vs a larger one is speed. Learn to use it not just for striking, but evading.

Opportunities:
Can you distract them? Can you attract attention from others who might help? Did your attacker slip, giving you the chance to push him down/sweep his legs/whatever, dropping him to the ground and allowing you to escape? Keep in mind that the goal of most self-defense scenarios is to escape with minimal or no injuries. That doesn't necessarily mean beating them down. Keep the real goal in mind and don't get stuck fighting when it's no longer necessary.

How hard you can hit only really matters if you're going toe to toe exchanging blows. And that's just about the last thing you want to do.

Well, you just start singing that Aerosmith song, "Chip Away At The Stone" and then you physically explain the joke.

 

[lklawson]

All the platitudes aside, the truth is that size does matter. It's certainly not the only factor, but it matters.

Two people, roughly the same degree of training, skill and physical abilities. One is 5'7, 120lbs, the other is 6'4", 250lbs.

Which one do you prefer to get hit by?

You've heard the old saying, right?

"The bigger they are, the harder they hit!"

Peace favor your sword,
Kirk

 

[Xue Sheng]

For the record my taiji shifu is half my size and over 20 years older than I am and can throw me around like a ragdoll, knock me to the floor, joint lock me and move me all over the place....and he does it all while looking way to relaxed to be doing it all....that in an of itself can make you nervous