Bite me

[DeLamar.J]

Ha ha funny thread name. Anyway, my point here is the importance of bitting. You have all of these martial arts techniques that require some time to learn to use effectively. But, to bite comes very natural. Why do you think people are afraid of dogs? Its not because a dog will punch you, shoot you, or stab you. Its because they will bite, well we can also bite. People just seem to forget about it.
I was recently playing around with a grappler who is alot better than me, but everytime I was in his guard and he pulled my head close, I would give him a little nibble. People dont really want to grapple you much after that. If someone gets close enough to you, and you start to clinch, I say forget everything else and just bite there eybrow off or go for the jugular vein in the neck.
Against a bigger stronger person, a bite could change the situation to your advantage very quicky. I think that is something people should keep in mind if your ever attacked on the street. You have roundhouse kicks and spinning backfists, but dont forget your most natural weapons.
There is also a psychological advantage here. If you are acting like a ravaging beast during the bite, shaking and tearing, growling, seeming to enjoy the fresh meat, they will get the heck out of there as soon as possible. You dont see people starting trouble with a big dog, there is a reason for this. A person can be just as deadly. You can strike fear into your opponent this way.

 

[Adept]

Three words. Blood borne disease.

 

[MJS]

Ha ha funny thread name. Anyway, my point here is the importance of bitting. You have all of these martial arts techniques that require some time to learn to use effectively. But, to bite comes very natural. Why do you think people are afraid of dogs? Its not because a dog will punch you, shoot you, or stab you. Its because they will bite, well we can also bite. People just seem to forget about it.
I was recently playing around with a grappler who is alot better than me, but everytime I was in his guard and he pulled my head close, I would give him a little nibble. People dont really want to grapple you much after that. If someone gets close enough to you, and you start to clinch, I say forget everything else and just bite there eybrow off or go for the jugular vein in the neck.
Against a bigger stronger person, a bite could change the situation to your advantage very quicky. I think that is something people should keep in mind if your ever attacked on the street. You have roundhouse kicks and spinning backfists, but dont forget your most natural weapons.
There is also a psychological advantage here. If you are acting like a ravaging beast during the bite, shaking and tearing, growling, seeming to enjoy the fresh meat, they will get the heck out of there as soon as possible. You dont see people starting trouble with a big dog, there is a reason for this. A person can be just as deadly. You can strike fear into your opponent this way.

Biting certainly has its place. However, its something that I would do as a last resort, given the fact that I'm not too crazy about possibly getting someones blood in my mouth. Then again, if involved in a fight, we run the risk of getting blood on our hands due to strikes.

Its still an effective more though. I would imagine that once they feel you begin to clamp down, even if skin hasn't been broken yet, we're going to get a reaction that may buy us time to escape.

Mike

 

[MA-Caver]

What Tyson did to Hollyfield was a natural (animalistic) borne instinct. Should anyone be surprised that he did. (Hollyfield certianly gave Tyson an earful didn't he? :lol2: ). But then Tyson is more close to being an animal than most of us humans are.
Biting certianly is IMO, a great SD technique when in extreme close quarters.

Blood borne disease? Well, better than being dead or raped. Besides the chances are miniscule according to a anesthesia expert I talked to. Besides unlike Tyson we don't have to swallow the part that we bite.

Call it a last ditch resort should things really go south. I'd say use it when you have to.

 

[tshadowchaser]

Give the right cicumstance i would not think twice about bitting someone. If It might save my life or keep me out of the hospital I might just do it

 

[Jade Tigress]

Call it a last ditch resort should things really go south. I'd say use it when you have to.

Give the right cicumstance i would not think twice about bitting someone. If It might save my life or keep me out of the hospital I might just do it

I agree here..under the right circumstances it is a very effective way of defending yourself. The same could be said for pinching.

 

[MartialIntent]

I'd also agree that a bite may be a valid tactic as a last resort [eg. chokehold] and in a real-world situation with everything to lose [especially for women as MA-Caver has already suggested] the potential for blood disease is surely not the position we should be taking when teaching practical SD ?

I've also heard of hepatitis infection through a knuckle laceration after a punch that made contact with the attacker's teeth.

These are very real threats. Hepatitis B in some cases can be serious [not to mention HIV of course] but seldom do we have time to evaluate what might actually be instinctive responses to dangerous situations. In these cases I'd probably agree and say bite first and hope you're still around to ask questions later.

Respects!

 

[Rich Parsons]

While I agree with the current lean of this thread of biting being on the list just not at the top becuase of the obvious reasons.

I would add in pinching, and fish hooking and gouging and poking, all of these are not allowed in competition, but they get people to react.

 

[Grenadier]

For defensive purposes? Use whatever is needed to survive the encounter. If that means biting the arm of someone who tries to apply a choke, or biting off the fingers, then so be it. You can live to deal with the consequences another day. I would rather be alive, and have to live with a Hep B infection (which you can live a normal life), than to be dead and not have to deal with it.

If it's not needed, then don't do it, but if your very survival is at stake, deal with the present. At the risk of sounding like some Jedi Master, I'm going to say that yes, you should be mindful of the future, but never at the expense of the present.

 

[DeLamar.J]

I think techniques should be develped for the most effective bitting. Once you clamp down on a jugular vein, grab the back of the head and apply just enough pressure to hold them, sort of like a police dog.
That would be a great way to restrain someone, I know I wouldnt move to far if I felt more pressure everytime I moved.

 

[bushidomartialarts]

bites are a way of getting somebody's attention. they hurt, they horrify, they demoralize. but unless you can actually get the the jugular you're going to have a hard go of hitting anything that will really take out your attacker in real time.

on the other hand, you bite a guy's arm in a scrum, their attention goes to the bite. while their attention is there, you find somewhere soft to put an elbow, knee or other weapon of choice.

you sacrifice range to bite. you risk disease to bite. your teeth are not as effective a weapon as your elbows or hands (try eating a steak with no utensils while somebody's trying hard not to let you). but if somebody gives you the target it can be helpful.

 

[cali_tkdbruin]

My thought is bite if you must. For me it would be a defense of last resort, but if you're attacked in the street and must defend yourself, then all bets are off because in that situation there are no longer any rules. Biting, eye gouging, nose rippies, etc., everything is open game. It becomes survival of the fittest at that point... :erg:

 

[Marginal]

Ha ha funny thread name. Anyway, my point here is the importance of bitting. You have all of these martial arts techniques that require some time to learn to use effectively. But, to bite comes very natural. Why do you think people are afraid of dogs? Its not because a dog will punch you, shoot you, or stab you. Its because they will bite, well we can also bite. People just seem to forget about it.

Dogs are also much better at it. Ranks up right there with indian sunburns IMO.

 

[kickcatcher]

I think it's fine to add biting to the list of add-ons to good basic techniques which you know from training already work under pressure. But when it is presented as some sort of magic answer to this or that disadventageous position, I think there's a real risk of a false sense of security, especially since you cannot practice bites to the same extent as say punches - when you get in a real situation you may have already punched someone hard in the face 1000 times in training, but if you are going to bite, it will be the first time you've ever actually done it.

 

[CuongNhuka]

i have a funny story that is slightly on topic. i was at training camp (think giant seminar with lots of classes all at the same time). i was doing randori (judo freestyle), every-so when i got her (yes a girl, not that way) in gaurd or near a lock, she would scratch me. and she got her long, sharp nails deep into my skin. it got to a point were my left cheack was bleeding. i didn't want to horse around with her anymore. and she does know the rules.
the point of the story is: will it work? yes. should you do it in compition: no
if you bite, scratch, or pintch (i've heard it happening), you might get in trouble. but in a fight if you get close, do it. remember the mandable (muscle that closes the jaw) is the strongest in the body.

 

[MJS]

I think it's fine to add biting to the list of add-ons to good basic techniques which you know from training already work under pressure. But when it is presented as some sort of magic answer to this or that disadventageous position, I think there's a real risk of a false sense of security, especially since you cannot practice bites to the same extent as say punches - when you get in a real situation you may have already punched someone hard in the face 1000 times in training, but if you are going to bite, it will be the first time you've ever actually done it.

I agree that nothing should be looked at as the 'magic tool' considering that nothing is guarenteed that it will work. We always need to leave some margin for error.

Question for you: Perhaps you could detail your training methods a bit. You state that you can't train a bite the way you can train punches. When you're training your punches, is the puncher or punchee wearing gear of any type? I ask this because with the use of gear, there will be a considerable difference when punching someone w/o gear. In addition, if we always trained everything we do to its fullest extent, we're going to be causing some serious wear and tear on our bodies.

A bite can be trained, but of course, you're not going to clamp down so hard you break skin. Its no different than pressure testing a knee break, arm break or neck break. We'd run out of training partners real fast if thats the case.

Mike

 

[Jimi]

If the fight is for your life, as a near last resort, or to help with an escape, I AGREE, BITE! I also believe if possible, spit after the bite, right in their face. Blood born disease, spit it right back at them. I realise many of you responding to this may not agree, but it is what i think is a natural follow up from a bite. Old Filipino Masters are said to have used tobacco or some other chewing root or weed as a make shift spitting mace. I used chewing gum in a school age fight in a similar way, and it gave me quite the advantage, spit, hit and run, enough to make it out from behind Tic Toc Liquors and get home safe. Chewing tobacco can sting like hell if sprayed in the face. Granted a lot of us do not chew, but if you bother to bite, why not spit? Just my opinion.

 

[kickcatcher]

My point is that with say punching you can reasonably spar heavy contact with boxing gloves or lighter contact with MMA gloves (MMA comp obviously gets closer), you hit a bag full tilt wearing your choice of gloves or even no gloves (wrist injuries at your own discretion) etc etc. I'm not going to say that punching someone in sparring wearing gloves is exactly the same as in a real fight without - but it's not so great a step-up (yes I have punched people...).

Bites you can start but not sink and then count it as a 'virtual victory' if you like, but in terms of step-up between punching and biting, you can (IMO) get closer with punching. Same problem with eye pokes, throat strikes, groin strikes - you go through training pulling them short or throwing them into thin air visualizing and whatnot.... it's a far cry from actually doing it for real.

How much your gameplan relies on these various moves that are "too deadly" to practice in an alive manner is up to you. I base my gameplan around stuff I have practiced against high resistance - it's not as "deadly" but it's robust enough IMO. When I'm in a clinch tie-up I often think "hmmm... I could bite his ear from here", but when it hits the fan, I expect I'd forget all about that because I don't actually do it in training.

 

[shesulsa]

So should you find an arm around your face you will not bite???

Sorry - you are applying punching and MMA and sport to all kinds of self-defense situations as though they are all going to be toe-to-toe street fights and that's just not the case.

If you're in favor of punching and MMA, then good for you - keep at it. But the ladies here who have been attacked FOR REAL and men who have been attacked FOR REAL - and not just for brawling but for HARM'S SAKE ... haven't got time to put gloves on and bash it out unless it comes down to it, and really, people who want people for something other than fighting generally don't fight.

Thanks anyway.

 

[MJS]

My point is that with say punching you can reasonably spar heavy contact with boxing gloves or lighter contact with MMA gloves (MMA comp obviously gets closer), you hit a bag full tilt wearing your choice of gloves or even no gloves (wrist injuries at your own discretion) etc etc. I'm not going to say that punching someone in sparring wearing gloves is exactly the same as in a real fight without - but it's not so great a step-up (yes I have punched people...).

Bites you can start but not sink and then count it as a 'virtual victory' if you like, but in terms of step-up between punching and biting, you can (IMO) get closer with punching. Same problem with eye pokes, throat strikes, groin strikes - you go through training pulling them short or throwing them into thin air visualizing and whatnot.... it's a far cry from actually doing it for real.

How much your gameplan relies on these various moves that are "too deadly" to practice in an alive manner is up to you. I base my gameplan around stuff I have practiced against high resistance - it's not as "deadly" but it's robust enough IMO. When I'm in a clinch tie-up I often think "hmmm... I could bite his ear from here", but when it hits the fan, I expect I'd forget all about that because I don't actually do it in training.

1) Please detail your typical training session.

2) When you are training your punches, are you and your partner wearing any type of protective gear?

3) Do you dismiss things such as biting, knee breaks, arm breaks and neck breaks because you can't "pressure test" them?

4) Sorry, but unless you're throwing full power, full contact punches w/o gear, there will be a distinct difference.

Mike