A different question about shin conditioning

[Jagermeister]

Just so nobody blasts me, I searched and read all the threads relating to shin conditioning before posting here, and I still have a couple questions, regarding short-term shin conditioning, which I believe have not yet been addressed.

After all I've read, it seems pretty clear that shin conditioning, especially when done incorrectly and over long periods of time, can be pretty dangerous to your long-term health. However, if you're gonna do Muay Thai, there is a certain amount of abuse that your shins will take regardless. I'm new to MT, so I'm wondering if just a month or 2 of shin conditioning (light rolling, not hitting, with a padded bar or rod) would have long-term effects.

My second question is, if I do this every other day for a month or two, would this be enough time to become slightly desensitized?

I'm definitely not going to continue shin conditioning once I feel that the pain isn't as intense, but I'd like to just get a general idea of how long I can expect to work at it before I get the results I want, and what the lasting effects (20 years from now) may be, if any. By the way, I'm planning on working on pads and bags as well, so the conditioning wouldn't come entirely from the "rolling."

Thanks, everyone.

 

[green meanie]

I think you'll see some results after a month or two but you'll probably have to work at this for six months to a year to get the kind of results you're really looking for. Deep bone bruising is serious business so you have to be careful not to get carried away and over do it when you're doing this type of conditioning. But if you're careful and patient you shouldn't have any problems in the short or long run.

 

[Henderson]

Shin conditioning?.....hmm....to be honest, I don't buy it. You're not going to de-sensitize the shins. A better way to look at this is that to are training your mind to ignore the pain, or at the least...build up your tolerance to the pain.

Respects,

Frank

 

[Andrew Green]

Kick the bag, kick the forearm pads, spar.

That should cover your shin conditioning right there. Shin conditioning can be very dangerous, bone cancer dangerous, and should not be done. Your body will adapt to what you do, no need to force it into things in that way.

 

[7starmantis]

Its not about "de-sensitizing" at all. It does work and help, but like others have said, you must go slow, do it right, and have lots of patients. If you bruise badly or hurt yourself you un-do what you have been working for and must stop building, so its a delecate process. I would do it every day not every other and I would go at least 6 months. During that time you can increase but go very slowly.

7sm

Note: If done correctly the dangers such as bone cancer can be avoided, but it is a risky behavior that needs to be done correctly, I would seek out the instruction of a qualified instructor to learn how to do it right.

 

[AdrenalineJunky]

Kick the bag, kick the forearm pads, spar.

That should cover your shin conditioning right there. Shin conditioning can be very dangerous, bone cancer dangerous, and should not be done. Your body will adapt to what you do, no need to force it into things in that way.

Agreed. If you don't have a bag, go to the local tire shop and see how much a throw away will cost you. I've paid as little as 10 bucks; add some cheap rope and a tree. . .you have a bag. Tie the tire off at two places (10 and 2 o'clock) to restrict movement. There are lots of uses for old tires in Muay Thai.

 

[green meanie]

Kick the bag, kick the forearm pads, spar.

That should cover your shin conditioning right there. Shin conditioning can be very dangerous, bone cancer dangerous, and should not be done. Your body will adapt to what you do, no need to force it into things in that way.

Does shin conditioning cause bone cancer? I've never heard of that. What scientific medical evidence is there to support this?

 

[AdrenalineJunky]

Does shin conditioning cause bone cancer? I've never heard of that. What scientific medical evidence is there to support this?

He meant that wrecking your shins is comparable to bone cancer; not that it causes bone cancer.

 

[green meanie]

He meant that wrecking your shins is comparable to bone cancer; not that it causes bone cancer.

Okay. Thanks for the clarification.

 

[7starmantis]

He meant that wrecking your shins is comparable to bone cancer; not that it causes bone cancer.

How so?

7sm

 

[AdrenalineJunky]

How so?

7sm

He was using it as an analogy, not to be taken literally. The point: extreme conditioning methods trash your shins, not condition them. The term "condition," itself, implies building tolerance over time; this can be done through bag work, pad work and sparring, first with shin protectors, then light without, finally, full-contact without shin protectors.

 

[Jagermeister]

...this can be done through bag work, pad work and sparring, first with shin protectors, then light without, finally, full-contact without shin protectors.

Are you serious? We don't use shin protectors at my school for pad and bag work, and there are a couple of beginners there, myself included. Is this unusual? I thought the shin protectors were just for sparring. I'd like to know now if my teacher is actually a MT nazi. We've also already done some blocking drills that have my shins bruised as hell. He's a Muay Thai nazi, isn't he?

 

[green meanie]

He was using it as an analogy, not to be taken literally. The point: extreme conditioning methods trash your shins, not condition them. The term "condition," itself, implies building tolerance over time; this can be done through bag work, pad work and sparring, first with shin protectors, then light without, finally, full-contact without shin protectors.

Agreed but does "light rolling, not hitting, with a padded bar or rod" qualify as extreme? Couldn't this be considered conditioning if it was done carefully, over a given period time?

 

[green meanie]

Are you serious? We don't use shin protectors at my school for pad and bag work, and there are a couple of beginners there, myself included. Is this unusual? I thought the shin protectors were just for sparring. I'd like to know now if my teacher is actually a MT nazi. We've also already done some blocking drills that have my shins bruised as hell. He's a Muay Thai nazi, isn't he?

The real question is, do you like the training?

 

[AdrenalineJunky]

Are you serious? We don't use shin protectors at my school for pad and bag work, and there are a couple of beginners there, myself included. Is this unusual? I thought the shin protectors were just for sparring. I'd like to know now if my teacher is actually a MT nazi. We've also already done some blocking drills that have my shins bruised as hell. He's a Muay Thai nazi, isn't he?

You mis-read that.

". . .and sparring, first with shin protectors, then light without, finally, full-contact without shin protectors."

No he is not. I routinely have beginners do light blocking drills w/out pads, just so they realize what degree of conditioning they will need to be able to spar w/out shin protectors.

 

[Jagermeister]

The real question is, do you like the training?

Don't get me wrong. I love the training. It's more fun than I've had sober in a looooong time. But I'd just like to know if I should totally trust my teacher (he's a professional fighter) or if I should be thinking of ways to train more safely since I've got no aspirations of fighting pro. I've read more than one nightmare story on this site about the consequences of improper shin conditioning. I don't mind the pain - I just want to be sure I don't have any regrets about this training years down the road.

 

[AdrenalineJunky]

Agreed but does "light rolling, not hitting, with a padded bar or rod" qualify as extreme? Couldn't this be considered conditioning if it was done carefully, over a given period time?

I see very little purpose in doing so. Heck, if it makes you feel better, have at it.

 

[green meanie]

I don't mind the pain - I just want to be sure I don't have any regrets about this training years down the road.

I say keep going then.

 

[Jagermeister]

You mis-read that.

No he is not. I routinely have beginners do light blocking drills w/out pads, just so they realize what degree of conditioning they will need to be able to spar w/out shin protectors.

Gotcha. I was a little worried for a minute. Thanks.

 

[AdrenalineJunky]

Don't get me wrong. I love the training. It's more fun than I've had sober in a looooong time. But I'd just like to know if I should totally trust my teacher (he's a professional fighter) or if I should be thinking of ways to train more safely since I've got no aspirations of fighting pro. I've read more than one nightmare story on this site about the consequences of improper shin conditioning. I don't mind the pain - I just want to be sure I don't have any regrets about this training years down the road.

If you think you are doing too much, well. . .don't. But I'm thinking that your teacher's not insane. Most MT workouts are heavy duty. Maybe go for a month, take a month off to train on your own; go a month, take a month off. Like I've said before, there's only so much to learn in Muay Thai, the rest is training. I train on my own, with a few other guys, and have for years. I usually don't go to a gym unless I want some pointers on improving my strategy from the big-dogs; that and sparring guys I don't normally spar with. If you're not bashing your shins with sticks or kicking trees, and whatnot, your shins will be fine. If there is something wrong, like serious bruising, tell your Kru, he should be able to redesign a workout for you to give your shins a break. If not, then maybe you might think about training on your own, primarily.