We did a few rounds of 2 on 1 sparring (moderate contact continuous) last night. I'm still trying to decide if I liked it or not. Any of you do this regularly? Do you have any tips, and what do you consider to be the benefits of this exercise?
2 on 1 Sparring
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Bruno@MT
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We used to spar x to 1 on exams when I did modern jujutsu.
The point is not to see if you can win. You can't if both are at the same level or higher than you. The point was to keep the pressure up to see how you dealt with that.
The point is not to see if you can win. You can't if both are at the same level or higher than you. The point was to keep the pressure up to see how you dealt with that.
We do what Sensei calls 'randori' which for us is one guy in the center and three or four attackers in free kumite, all strikes allowed, light padding.
Did it the other night. Sucked at it. Caught a yoko geri dead in the chest; still bruised.
One tip - you'd think getting your back to the wall or in a corner would be good, but it's not. Then your attackers crowd you in until you can't move and then beat you down. So try to stay out in the open. Wish I could recommend more, but I stink at this.
I like it, though.
Some tips are:
1. To keep the opponents in an "I" formation. That is one in front of you and the other behind the one in front of you. You will have to move and you will have to use your hands to manipulate the one in front of you.
2. Also it is best to move towards the weakest opponent and keep that one in between you and the stronger or better fighter.
3. Move, move, move.
Should help a bit. Like other of said you most likely won't win, but every now and then you will pull off the incredible.
I once took out the first guy with a side kick as he was attacking and he stayed down quite awhile and it gave me one on one time with the other guy. That was the exception though and not the norm, but it looked sweet.
1. To keep the opponents in an "I" formation. That is one in front of you and the other behind the one in front of you. You will have to move and you will have to use your hands to manipulate the one in front of you.
2. Also it is best to move towards the weakest opponent and keep that one in between you and the stronger or better fighter.
3. Move, move, move.
Should help a bit. Like other of said you most likely won't win, but every now and then you will pull off the incredible.
I once took out the first guy with a side kick as he was attacking and he stayed down quite awhile and it gave me one on one time with the other guy. That was the exception though and not the norm, but it looked sweet.
Blade96
Senior Master
Hah, we do that, everyone makes a circle with each of taking turns being in the middle with one shmuck in front of you and two or three to both sides and you dunno who's gonna punch at you and you have to block them.
Im not bad at it, first time I tried that though I sucked! lol
Very fun though. Love doing that.
Yeah, we did both - the blocking thing and the whole attack/defend thing. When we were just blocking, the person in the middle was blindfolded and was required to apply three techniques when the person on the outside tapped them. Any three techniques. The person on the outside was not blindfolded, but they'd better get out of the way - if the person in the middle got a piece of you, too bad for you! The only rule was no leading the person in the middle into a wall or something. I'm bad at all of them; hope to get better in time.
During my Black Belt test, the three of them came at me, I got them lined up, so only one was smacking me at a time, and put my butt into the corner and was pushing all three back, then my Sifu yelled stop, moved us back to the middle of the floor and had us start again. They kicked the s out of me.
Disco
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This type of sparring/training is an exercise in futility. It serves no real purpose except to show you what will happen if you can't/don't put attackers down. Learning how to line folks up is about the only real applicable application derived from this, but again, if you can't/don't put people down, you'll have a constant supply of attackers you really can't deal with. Now as far as being blindfolded and in a circle having folks attack you, well somebody has been watching to many old kung fu movies.
Not attack - touch. We did 'attack the guy in the middle' when we were doing randori. When wearing a blindfold, we just took turns touching him and he had to launch three techniques towards the direction of the touch. Tested balance, speed, and even the ability to track a person's direction by sound, air pressure, etc. I sucked at it, others were better.
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The instructor did mention something about learning how to take a punch. I think his point was that you can't block everything when you have two attackers, so you have to learn to absorb the blows and keep fighting. I did 3 rounds with 2 other brown belts, and 2 rounds with one other brown belt and a yellow belt. The brown belt rounds were a lot rougher, of course; we were being careful not to hurt the yellow belt since she's new to sparring. I would just push her away with a gentle side kick now and then and concentrate on not getting killed by my other opponent.
I had heard about the I formation before; I tried to get there, but couldn't manage to keep them in place for long. Neither one of these brown belts is a woman you want to close with; one of them just won her point sparring division at the U.S. Open in Orlando a couple of weeks ago. She's got kicks like anvils. The other one is a 16 year old who is about 6 feet tall and has legs that bend in unnatural directions.They are also both very aggressive (like me), and hard to "push" around the ring.
I'm pretty sure I'll be doing this on my black belt test, so I'm going to try to get more time in with it over the next few weeks.
I had heard about the I formation before; I tried to get there, but couldn't manage to keep them in place for long. Neither one of these brown belts is a woman you want to close with; one of them just won her point sparring division at the U.S. Open in Orlando a couple of weeks ago. She's got kicks like anvils. The other one is a 16 year old who is about 6 feet tall and has legs that bend in unnatural directions.They are also both very aggressive (like me), and hard to "push" around the ring.
I'm pretty sure I'll be doing this on my black belt test, so I'm going to try to get more time in with it over the next few weeks.
Bruno@MT
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True.
The Togakure ryu scroll contains strategies for dealing with x to one attacks. I haven't read them myself, but Chris Parker mentioned that it is mostly a matter of creating an opening to escape. There are no sensible strategies for actually fighting multiple opponents if you cannot use the surroundings to create an advantage.
Stacking your attackers is important, doing it on an open floor is tough and damn tiring. I will often clinch with one opponent and then try to manuver him around as a shield, as I work knee shots on the guy I clinched with. Pick the smaller guy if you have to try it. 
I also like to do this with a goal, like "get through the door" which you can represent with two pads on the floor or something. It forces a strategy for both the pair of attackers.
I also like to do this with a goal, like "get through the door" which you can represent with two pads on the floor or something. It forces a strategy for both the pair of attackers.
ap Oweyn
Brown Belt
Oh I don't know about all that. Seems to me that sparring more than one person is much more than an exercise in futility. For one thing, it'll teach you very quickly that mobility is king. There was a video a while back of one man taking on three or four. Furiously backpedaling and landing good solid jabs on one nose after another. He moved backward, but laterally as well. Very effective. And very trainable. (Yeah, not a word. Sue me.)
Even if it goes badly, it's a good lesson in keeping your head about you under duress. And that's an invaluable lesson in and of itself.
Now, if someone does multiple sparring hoping to look good, now that is futile.
Stuart
2 on 1 is a whole new game. Your senses broaden and it's almost as if you're in survival mode for a little bit, waiting to see where the next attack comes from in order to counter.
I think it's good if both attackers attack at once, not 1 at a time like demo style.
My technique is to try to be at an angle where they are both lineup and I'm using one attacker as a defense to the one behind.
I think it's good if both attackers attack at once, not 1 at a time like demo style.
My technique is to try to be at an angle where they are both lineup and I'm using one attacker as a defense to the one behind.
or four...
Blade96
Senior Master
Did the blindfold thing,. I stood in front of 3 shmucks. One middle one either side of me. I'd close my eyes while they'd pick one to punch at me. Then I opened my eyes. Then one punched. Of course I didnt know who would do that. Of course someone usually gives themselves away if you're looking.
It's also a good way to minimize the anticipation and give an element of surprise that may not be available otherwise...
Skpotamus
Brown Belt
My instructor used it to help emphasize that there was no such thing as a "fair fight". AKA, get something you can use as a defensive tool and get out ASAP or get pounded on. Realistically speaking, taking on two or more people of similar size is hard to do, and with similar skill levels, you're gonna get whupped on. Escape is the best option, but if you have to fight, fight "dirty" and get something to help you even the odds a little bit. This actually lead ot a lot of the guys carrying their training drones with them during regular class so they could grab them if this came up.
Sometimes he'd have a line on the other side of the gym that if we could get to, we were "safe" and could essentially say we escaped. Of course, that line was always on the complete opposite side of the gym and usually had the 2 or 3 guys between you and it, which sucked.
Sometimes he'd have a line on the other side of the gym that if we could get to, we were "safe" and could essentially say we escaped. Of course, that line was always on the complete opposite side of the gym and usually had the 2 or 3 guys between you and it, which sucked.
