Zimmerman to face Wrongful Death Civil Trial

[ballen0351]

As to the spanking thing its self I spank my kids I spank my dog I even spank my wife but that's a whole different reason
I think its kind of arragont for you to say a parent didn't do a good job in the beginning so now must resort to spankings.

 

[Tgace]

When done "right" I see no problem with spanking. I only had to spank each of my kids all of 1-2 times in their lives and that was when they were at that "cant reason with them" toddler age and when they did something like pull away and try to run across a parking lot...not out of personal anger at them spilling something or wetting the bed......

 

[Makalakumu]

FYI research shows spanking reduces IQ and increases aggressive behavior in children. Spanking has also been shown to provide only one benefit to parents. It stops the behavior NOW. It does not provide any long term behavioral correction.

I think all of this is demonstrating that spanking is an out dated tool for parenting.

 

[Steve]

Okay. I'll try to address things point by point.

Ok, so we'll forget about that. So, barring any physical contact, as I said, teach them right from wrong, in the beginning. As soon as there's a screw up, correct it! Don't let it slide, do something. Tell them in a firm tone. If it leads to taking away the car, the phone, a toy, whatever, then do it.

Would you agree/disagree with that? Feel free to list any other options that you have.

I think you're on to something, but there are limits to this. First, I would say that it's less about being strict as it is about being consistent.

Being a tyrant is as likely to backfire as not. I dated a judge's daughter in high school. He was as strict and stern as you can imagine. I've already told you what kind of a teenager I was. Why do you think she was dating me (other than my charm and sense of humor?) She was rebelling because her father was so strict it was oppressive.

I believe that most standards are a little fluid. Some are not. Treating every standard and expectation the same, holding the child absolutely accountable, will likely not have the intended results. It will muddy the waters to the point that they cannot distinguish between what is important and what is not important.

Being consistent means having standards that are reasonable while also picking your battles. The specific standards are less important, in my opinion, than the consistent application of those standards by both parents. It's not as much about what you say yes and no to as it is that both parents are a united front.

That's correct....my opinion is just that...an opinion. My apologies if thats what it implied. It would seem though, that if someone is allowing their kids to run around like animals, they a) think that behavior is perfectly normal or b) have no control over their kids. And I strongly disagree with that 'kids will be kids' BS. No, sorry, not all kids run around raising hell in a store. Shame that people with kids like that are so blind, and as I said before, should their little wild child get hurt, somehow its the stores fault. Again, I call BS on that. Its the parents fault!

I have a question. Can you think of some reasons why a parent doesn't have control over his or her kids? Just, if you had to guess, would you say that most of these parents with out of control kids don't know how to parent or don't care how to parent? I get the impression you think that it's more in the "don't care" column. Am I wrong?

I'm sure someone is bound to say that it's impossible to know what your kid is doing all the time. I'll agree that that's partially true, but you should know something. Seems to me...and quite a few others, that TM wasn't the angel he was portrayed to be. Either his parents are clueless, didn't care, thought that what he was doing was normal. The list goes on and on.

Okay, so let's say you've got a kid who's having trouble. You've removed him from the environment. You're doing some things to try and keep him out of trouble. What are you advocating? Should he have been on lock down? I mean, I'm not sure what you're suggesting. Your son is rebelling. He's doing things you know are not good. You've grounded him and it hasn't worked. What do you do? Ground him until he graduates? Give him a room with a cot and feed him gruel until he's ready to be released into the wild? Send him to military school and wash your hands of him? Seriously. What are you suggesting, because I know real people, good people, with kids who got in with some bad kids, who've been in this very same situation. What would you do?

I gave some suggestions earlier as well as in this thread. Not sure what else I can offer. Sounds like a lot of it is common sense and good judgement....things that sadly, seem to be lacking. Make no mistake about it...I've seen my share of kids out with their parents, in restaurants, in stores, etc, and you'd never know the kid was with them.

Maybe we're doomed and the kids coming up now will truly be the end of America as we know it.

 

[ballen0351]

FYI research shows spanking reduces IQ and increases aggressive behavior in children. Spanking has also been shown to provide only one benefit to parents. It stops the behavior NOW. It does not provide any long term behavioral correction.

I think all of this is demonstrating that spanking is an out dated tool for parenting.

OK I'll raise my kids how I want and you raise yours how you want.

 

[Steve]

As to the spanking thing its self I spank my kids I spank my dog I even spank my wife but that's a whole different reason
I think its kind of arragont for you to say a parent didn't do a good job in the beginning so now must resort to spankings.

Ballen are you talking to me? If so, I didn't say that at all. What I meant, if it didn't come through, is that a parent who is failing will likely resort to spanking and it will tend to make things worse.

I said earlier, "Also, I want to say that I have no issues with spanking a kid. I don't do it, and I personally don't see a need for it. It's the last resort for parents who have failed to address the issue in a better way, IMO. But I also understand that there are people who disagree with me, and that parenting is a pass/fail activity, in that a parent can (and will) make all sorts of mistakes, but if the end result is a happy, healthy, productive adult, you pass."

All of that is true. If I'm in a situation where I need to spank my kid, I've failed to handle the situation well from the beginning. But, as I said above, I understand that there are other opinions on the matter. I get that.

If you weren't responding to me, then disregard.

 

[Steve]

OK I'll raise my kids how I want and you raise yours how you want.

Ironically, that feeling you have now of being judged is an interesting role reversal.

 

[ballen0351]

Ironically, that feeling you have now of being judged is an interesting role reversal.

Not a matter of being judged it a matter of the "studies" always cited on this are junk.

 

[ballen0351]

Ballen are you talking to me? If so, I didn't say that at all. What I meant, if it didn't come through, is that a parent who is failing will likely resort to spanking and it will tend to make things worse.

I said earlier, "Also, I want to say that I have no issues with spanking a kid. I don't do it, and I personally don't see a need for it. It's the last resort for parents who have failed to address the issue in a better way, IMO. But I also understand that there are people who disagree with me, and that parenting is a pass/fail activity, in that a parent can (and will) make all sorts of mistakes, but if the end result is a happy, healthy, productive adult, you pass."

All of that is true. If I'm in a situation where I need to spank my kid, I've failed to handle the situation well from the beginning. But, as I said above, I understand that there are other opinions on the matter. I get that.

If you weren't responding to me, then disregard.

Again the use of a spanking does not = fail to handle the situation properly

 

[Steve]

Again the use of a spanking does not = fail to handle the situation properly

Does in my opinion. Absolutely. I understand that you have a different opinion. It means that somewhere along the way, you've lost control of the situation.

Except the wife. If she's into that, more power to ya.

Edit to add: I want to reiterate that parenting is pass/fail thing, IMO. In the scheme of things, if you're otherwise a solid parent, spanking the kid isn't going to cause any lasting trauma. However, if you are already failing as a parent, spanking the kid will likely do more harm than good.

Sent from my SPH-L710 using Tapatalk 2

 

[ballen0351]

Does in my opinion. Absolutely. I understand that you have a different opinion.

You know what they say about opinions.

 

[Steve]

You know what they say about opinions.

whats the problem? I understand that people don't like being judged, and I'm sure you are a fine parent, otherwise.

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[ballen0351]

whats the problem? I understand that people don't like being judged, and I'm sure you are a fine parent, otherwise.

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD

No problem. We differ on our opinion. Like I said opinions are like ...............
That statements applicable to your opinion as well as mine.

 

[Steve]

No problem. We differ on our opinion. Like I said opinions are like ...............
That statements applicable to your opinion as well as mine.

So, now apply this to the snapshot judgments you make toward other parents. If I saw you "smacking" your child in public, I would wonder why you can't control your child. Do you see the point here?

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[Tgace]

So, now apply this to the snapshot judgments you make toward other parents. If I saw you "smacking" your child in public, I would wonder why you can't control your child. Do you see the point here?

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I don't.

A smack when a child is actually misbehaving is an effort to discipline. And allowed in most states use of force statutes. When your kid is using dope..getting arrested...assaulting adults and being a general punk....THEN I start making judgments about parenting skills.

If there's anyone being a bit sensitive in this discussion I'm tending to see a very small crowd....

 

[Steve]

I don't.

A smack when a child is actually misbehaving is an effort to discipline. And allowed in most states use of force statutes. When your kid is using dope..getting arrested...assaulting adults and being a general punk....THEN I start making judgments about parenting skills.

If there's anyone being a bit sensitive in this discussion I'm tending to see a very small crowd....

We weren't talking about kids using dope, getting arrested or being punks. most of the comments in recent posts were about kids misbehaving in public.

The point, tgace, is that we all have snapshots that would make us look bad, taken out of context. You smack a kid, and people will judge you. You guys are quick to judge and aren't reluctant at all to presume the worst, but really get testy as hell when it happens to you.

 

[ballen0351]

So, now apply this to the snapshot judgments you make toward other parents. If I saw you "smacking" your child in public, I would wonder why you can't control your child. Do you see the point here?

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What snapshot judgment did I make? 1st I've never had to spank my kid in public. If it was needed we would go into a bathroom or out to the car. 2nd I'd be glad to see a parent busting a kids butt for being bad its better then the parents that do nothing and allow kids to go nuts in stores or restaurants and disrupt everyone else

 

[Tgace]

LOL..I don't get the part where I'm being testy. Disagreeing with you is not testiness...

 

[Tgace]

When it comes to kids misbehaving. If you haven't seen parents let kids act like unsupervised animals you haven't been in a Walmart recently LOL!

 

[arnisador]

OK I'll raise my kids how I want and you raise yours how you want.

Then let's back off TM's parents.