You always attack first

[FriedRice]

Well I already made it clear that trying to preempt someone outside of face-to-face range is not only near impossible but UNNECESSARY. If a person is not in attacking range then he is may not be an immediate threat which means one should not feel that he has to or want to preemptively strike someone. This is what I was saying in my last post.



What to do then? I already expressed what NOT to do and that is preemptively attack that person since 8ft is NOT face-to-face range. If that person menacingly closes that distance in a threatening manner then you have to survey the situation and make a decision. Preemption being a possible decision.



It may have escaped your notice but people dressed in a suspicious manner and approach others in the dark away from the rest of society are usually up to no good. Too many people have ended up in the hospital or (worse still) the morgue for having the forgiving and lax mindset that you have espoused in your post. No matter what anyone else says or feel about it I will NEVER adopt that kind of mindset and absolutely no one can convince me otherwise. In a self protection situation where I really feel that my life is on the line I'd much rather be tried by 12 instead of carried by 6.



EXACTLY! I couldn't agree more. Add to that the fact that action is ALWAYS FASTER than reaction and you have a recipe for disaster for the so called counter fighter. I'm not one to try and convince others or get people to change their minds. To each his own. All I can say is I know better than to adopt the romantic idea of being a counter fighter in a situation on the pavement arena where I stand to lose more than just "a fight".

This may come off as arrogant, condescending or even stand offish (though this is not my intention), but I can read some of these posts in this thread and can tell that some people posting here do not know what a life or death situation outside of the training hall is really, really like. I can tell when I am reading the posts of a person who doesn't have that brutal, raw, "it's your life or mine" type of experience but have, instead, romantic ideas about defeating someone on the streets using his Martial Arts skills. Believe me I can tell. Just like any NFL Football fan can tell that another person who says Jay Cutler is a much better QB than Tom Brady or they think it looks like Greenbay will play Dallas IN THE SUPERBOWL doesn't know NFL Football. You just know.

Take Care everyone and have a great day,
OSU!

Can you describe how a Counter-Fighter, fight? Thanks.

 

[drop bear]

the advantage of counter fighting on the street is that your opponent very likely untrained and will over reach go off balance or present you with a leg to grab, chances are that he is also drunk

you are certain he actually means you harm and not just showing off to his friends girl friend and so havent got his blood on your shirt for no reason

it puts you in a much stronger position legally
and you havent just punched some who was lost and looking for directions

He should have asked for directions from across the street.

Counter fighters don't fight nose to nose. They use space and movement to create the opportunities to see punches coming and react. If the space isnt there you are decidedly unsafe.

So how do you counterpunch at conversational range?

 

[jobo]

He should have asked for directions from across the street.

Counter fighters don't fight nose to nose. They use space and movement to create the opportunities to see punches coming and react. If the space isnt there you are decidedly unsafe.

So how do you counterpunch at conversational range?

He should have asked for directions from across the street.

Counter fighters don't fight nose to nose. They use space and movement to create the opportunities to see punches coming and react. If the space isnt there you are decidedly unsafe.

So how do you counterpunch at conversational range?

in much the same way he punched you ?

 

[jobo]

In general, you're still going to lose vs. faster fighters, regardless of whether you go first or not.

there are plenty who rely on talking ng a punch to give one and boxers reply on points not knock outs

 

[drop bear]

in much the same way he punched you ?

Sorry whut now?

 

[drop bear]

Ok. here we go. Some striking second some striking first and bad guys moving out of range while still being a threat.

 

[jobo]

Sorry whut now?

your question was, how do you counter punch someone who is close up. He punched you you punch him, if you can get you arm up to block his punch that's better

 

[FriedRice]

there are plenty who rely on talking ng a punch to give one and boxers reply on points not knock outs

This would be a return and not a counter.

 

[FriedRice]

your question was, how do you counter punch someone who is close up. He punched you you punch him,

This is a "return", not a "counter".

if you can get you arm up to block his punch that's better

This would also be a "return".

 

[CB Jones]

This is a "return", not a "counter".



This would also be a "return".

Just because you use certain terms and definitions, does not mean everyone else is required to use them.

 

[FriedRice]

Just because you use certain terms and definitions, does not mean everyone else is required to use them.

Somewhat true, but in this case...the "return" has a separate definition than a "counter" when talking about Counter-Fighting....and very, very much so, when you want to argue between "going first" and "counter-fighting". The terminology makes a huge difference. A lot of people don't really know what a Counter-Fighter is.

There are still grey areas, but in general, if you block and then punch back...that's a "return", not a counter.

 

[jobo]

This would be a return and not a counter.

I think your making your own definitions' up now

 

[drop bear]

your question was, how do you counter punch someone who is close up. He punched you you punch him, if you can get you arm up to block his punch that's better

You let him punch you?

 

[Buka]

In general, you're still going to lose vs. faster fighters, regardless of whether you go first or not.

I disagree.

Or I seriously got screwed in life. I was faster than anyone you've likely seen. So, I should have beat just about anybody. Alas, I did not. I lost to better fighters, not faster ones.

As to the whole "ask you for directions" thing. I like to fight in the kitchen. Up close. When somebody walks into my kitchen, like when asking directions, it's kind of like pizza delivery.

 

[CB Jones]

Somewhat true, but in this case...the "return" has a separate definition than a "counter" when talking about Counter-Fighting....and very, very much so, when you want to argue between "going first" and "counter-fighting". The terminology makes a huge difference. A lot of people don't really know what a Counter-Fighter is.

There are still grey areas, but in general, if you block and then punch back...that's a "return", not a counter.

The terminology means little.

And using your definition Floyd mayweather would be considered a return puncher not a counter puncher.

 

[jobo]

You let him punch you?

You let him punch you?

no i let him try, that's what counter fighting is. He has to go first. I'm pretty certain id block it, if not the closer he is the harder it is to throw a power full punch

 

[FriedRice]

I disagree.

Or I seriously got screwed in life. I was faster than anyone you've likely seen. So, I should have beat just about anybody. Alas, I did not. I lost to better fighters, not faster ones.

Obviously, I'm meant that if all things were equal other than they being faster, they'd still beat you due to their speed advantage.

As to the whole "ask you for directions" thing. I like to fight in the kitchen. Up close. When somebody walks into my kitchen, like when asking directions, it's kind of like pizza delivery.

???

 

[Steve]

This may come off as arrogant, condescending or even stand offish (though this is not my intention), but I can read some of these posts in this thread and can tell that some people posting here do not know what a life or death situation outside of the training hall is really, really like. I can tell when I am reading the posts of a person who doesn't have that brutal, raw, "it's your life or mine" type of experience but have, instead, romantic ideas about defeating someone on the streets using his Martial Arts skills. Believe me I can tell. Just like any NFL Football fan can tell that another person who says Jay Cutler is a much better QB than Tom Brady or they think it looks like Greenbay will play Dallas IN THE SUPERBOWL doesn't know NFL Football. You just know.

LOL. Dude, if you're about to say something that you know is arrogant and condescending, you should own it.

 

[FriedRice]

The terminology means little.

And using your definition Floyd mayweather would be considered a return puncher not a counter puncher.

That's the gray area I was talking about, because Floyd does both. But his taking single pot shots with lots of footwork and evading, is very indicative of counter-fighting.

Many actually labels him a Defensive Fighter which is what his Crab Defense is more known for.

 

[FriedRice]

I think your making your own definitions' up now

Describe to me what a counter is then. Let's see how long as you google and search on YouTube b/c I know you're online right now