Yoga, a Martial Art?

[Edmund BlackAdder]

I saw a Canadian-made documentary series about a journalist, also with a dan in Aikido, I believe -- who visited some different countries and trained various arts. Kalarippayattu was one of the systems featured, and it appears to be very strenuous. The fighters look very much like long-term serious yoga practitioners -- very lithe and stretched out. They also incorporate a massage regimen.

Wish I could remember the name of the series. It was extremely well-done.

I'll have to look into that. Thank you.

 

[jarrod]

It's clear that a style of yoga likely grew out of a martial tradition and begun to be practiced on its own.
David

i'm not sure that's accurate. there are only so many ways the body can move, & body movements tend to be similar within certain cultures. savate has always looked sort of like ballet to me, but i don't think you can say that ballet grew out of the savate martial tradition & then was practiced on it's own.

likewise a lot of traditional japanese dance feature slow intense movement, deep stances, etc. that doesn't mean it's related to karate.

no offense intended, just mho,

jf

 

[Brian R. VanCise]

Having practiced Kalaripayattu a little while in India I can honestly say that some movement does seem to fit with some certain yoga postures. However, I would not call yoga a martial art by any means. Just look at yoga and tell me where the martial side is?

 

[MahaKaal]

I made a post about the types of yoga in a previous post, but I will re-iterate, there are two types of yoga in India, the most popular is Prayama Yog and the other is Waryam Yog. The first is what is used by Sadhus (holy men) and more recently Ayurvedic promoters, who believe that using yoga and breathing techniques they can heal various ailments and diseases (i.e high blood pressure, diabetics, cholesterol). The Sadhus use Prayama Yog to settle the mind and focus it towards meditation.

The other form is Waryam Yog, which is what is practised by warriors, wrestlers and swordsmen. This is a more dynamic type of yoga, where holding postures is less emphasised, but instead more repitition of cycles are done. The most common excercise being the Dand and Behtak (commonly known in the west as the Hindu Squat and Hindu Pressup) but there are many more traditional regimes and cycles which are learnt. These build up dynamic strength without the use of weights, increasing power, stamina, agility whilst also maintaining flexibility, the key aspects of a good warrior physique.

Is Yoga a martial art? No, but I see it as the key to building the body of a martial artist which will complement the fighting arts. Since I have been practising it, it has made my body much more fluid, increased my stamina, strength and agility.

 

[Brian R. VanCise]

I made a post about the types of yoga in a previous post, but I will re-iterate, there are two types of yoga in India, the most popular is Prayama Yog and the other is Waryam Yog. The first is what is used by Sadhus (holy men) and more recently Ayurvedic promoters, who believe that using yoga and breathing techniques they can heal various ailments and diseases (i.e high blood pressure, diabetics, cholesterol). The Sadhus use Prayama Yog to settle the mind and focus it towards meditation.

The other form is Waryam Yog, which is what is practised by warriors, wrestlers and swordsmen. This is a more dynamic type of yoga, where holding postures is less emphasised, but instead more repitition of cycles are done. The most common excercise being the Dand and Behtak (commonly known in the west as the Hindu Squat and Hindu Pressup) but there are many more traditional regimes and cycles which are learnt. These build up dynamic strength without the use of weights, increasing power, stamina, agility whilst also maintaining flexibility, the key aspects of a good warrior physique.

Is Yoga a martial art? No, but I see it as the key to building the body of a martial artist which will complement the fighting arts. Since I have been practising it, it has made my body much more fluid, increased my stamina, strength and agility.

Excellent post Mahakaal. Like you I see it as an excellent complimentary conditioning, flexibility routine.

 

[Bob Hubbard]

Is yoga a martial art today? I don't think so, no more than Tai Chi at the health club is. It's stretching and breathing and while you might see a lock or throw if you squint -really- hard, it's just not there anymore.

Was it at one point? Possibly. Just like there are effective martial tai chi branches still around today, you could possibly find an older yoga branch that has martial applications still.

I look at it as a limbering exercise that improves flexibility and proper oxygenation, which prepares your body and mind for martial training.

 

[jks9199]

I made a post about the types of yoga in a previous post, but I will re-iterate, there are two types of yoga in India, the most popular is Prayama Yog and the other is Waryam Yog. The first is what is used by Sadhus (holy men) and more recently Ayurvedic promoters, who believe that using yoga and breathing techniques they can heal various ailments and diseases (i.e high blood pressure, diabetics, cholesterol). The Sadhus use Prayama Yog to settle the mind and focus it towards meditation.

The other form is Waryam Yog, which is what is practised by warriors, wrestlers and swordsmen. This is a more dynamic type of yoga, where holding postures is less emphasised, but instead more repitition of cycles are done. The most common excercise being the Dand and Behtak (commonly known in the west as the Hindu Squat and Hindu Pressup) but there are many more traditional regimes and cycles which are learnt. These build up dynamic strength without the use of weights, increasing power, stamina, agility whilst also maintaining flexibility, the key aspects of a good warrior physique.

Is Yoga a martial art? No, but I see it as the key to building the body of a martial artist which will complement the fighting arts. Since I have been practising it, it has made my body much more fluid, increased my stamina, strength and agility.

Yogic systems and similar methods of stretching, strengthing, and healing the body are a great -- and probably essential! -- complement to hard martial arts training. It's a shame to see so many of the masters of yesterday who today are virtual cripples because they never had the opportunity to heal and compensate their bodies for the damage they've done to their bodies.

 

[kidswarrior]

Interesting I will have to look for more about Kalarippayattu

Thanks for the link. From said link, an interesting contrast with what I've learned and seen in most East Asian arts:

Once the practitioner has become proficient with all the wooden weapons, he/she proceeds to Ankathari (literally "war training") starting with metal weapons, which require superior concentration due to their lethal nature....Only after achieving mastery with all weapons forms is the practitioner taught to defend his/her person with bare-handed techniques. :mst:

This would certainly force the student to pay absolute attention at all times. The whole McDojo debate, for example, would go out the window if training partners were constantly swinging and lunging with hard and/or sharp objects, methinks.

But I've now drifted way OT, I'm afraid. Apologies as we return you to the regular yoga program.

 

[David Weatherly]

i'm not sure that's accurate. there are only so many ways the body can move, & body movements tend to be similar within certain cultures. savate has always looked sort of like ballet to me, but i don't think you can say that ballet grew out of the savate martial tradition & then was practiced on it's own.

likewise a lot of traditional japanese dance feature slow intense movement, deep stances, etc. that doesn't mean it's related to karate.

no offense intended, just mho,

jf

No offense taken. Perhaps I should have been more clear. I believe that yoga grew out of Indian martial traditions. Imagine taking a set of conditioning excersises out of a martial tradition and begining to practice them as a seperate set of forms. Over time of course it would evolve and as someone pointed out there are numerous forms of yoga today.

JMO but based on discussions and experience with Indian martial artists.

David

 

[zeeberex]

sure it runs counter to the generalized impression here in America.

in my system, their are said to be Indian influences and in fact we have a form that is called "taichi" but is most like an Indian warrior class form. it is not taichi, it is yoga.

legend or not, it is said that the buddha came from India.

He did

 

[zeeberex]

I'm gonna say traditional yoga...

not the new age'y crap that is all over the place

In a martial context I would see Yoga as a conditioning thing rather than technique, kinda like Chi Kung vs Kung Fu

 

[Xue Sheng]

Well yoga has postures named Warrior 1, Warrior 2 and proud Warrior so it must be a martial art

OK I just could not resist any longer, if it is any consolation I do a bit of power yoga and although I do feel yoga can benefit a martial artist I do not think any of the Yoga we do here in the west is a martial art.

 

[jarrod]

No offense taken. Perhaps I should have been more clear. I believe that yoga grew out of Indian martial traditions. Imagine taking a set of conditioning excersises out of a martial tradition and begining to practice them as a seperate set of forms. Over time of course it would evolve and as someone pointed out there are numerous forms of yoga today.

JMO but based on discussions and experience with Indian martial artists.

David

that makes perfect sense. kind of like how push ups were developed for the military (IIRC) then used more widely used.

jf

 

[hkfuie]

I'm gonna say traditional yoga...

not the new age'y crap that is all over the place

Am I the only one rolling on the floor, clutching my sides and trying to catch my breath?

"I'm gonna say traditional [substitute martial art of your choice]...

not the new age'y crap that is all over the place"



Sensei Bambi!

He's GOTTA be making that up!

 

[Brother John]

I saw a Canadian-made documentary series about a journalist, also with a dan in Aikido, I believe -- who visited some different countries and trained various arts. Kalarippayattu was one of the systems featured, and it appears to be very strenuous. The fighters look very much like long-term serious yoga practitioners -- very lithe and stretched out. They also incorporate a massage regimen.

Wish I could remember the name of the series. It was extremely well-done.

Agreed! There are training practices w/in the Kalarippayattu that seem a LOT like Vinyasana training in Yoga.
also: Varma Ati, an indonesian martial art, includes yoga like training as well.

Your Brother
John

 

[Bill Mattocks]

I know nothing of Yoga, but I found this:

http://bit.ly/bDmRvZ

 

[Tiberius]

As an avid and VERY advanced yogini I find this thread quite intriguing. I do yoga like almost everyday since I was 4. I am a yellow belt at judo and kind of used yoga when I ran out of ides, however with little success so far XD .

 

[Julian Figiel]

sure it runs counter to the generalized impression here in America.

in my system, their are said to be Indian influences and in fact we have a form that is called "taichi" but is most like an Indian warrior class form. it is not taichi, it is yoga.

legend or not, it is said that the buddha came from India.

Buddha came from India!?! Wow, how amazing!

 

[Julian Figiel]

Did some digging.....

"In sixth-century China, because Zen Buddhist monks who meditated for long hours were developing spiritually but weakening physically, Prince Bodhidharma introduced monks at the Shaolin Temple to what later became known as kung fu—a martial art based on Indian yoga. The monks were not only priests but warriors too, and practiced this first martial art on a daily basis."
http://www.yogajournal.com/practice/189_1.cfm

I've found many many sites where yoga and martial arts are linked or taught side by side. Seems like a good combination at least, proper breathing, relaxation, flexibility...all good things for a martial artist.

Your absolutely right!

 

[Julian Figiel]

I saw a Canadian-made documentary series about a journalist, also with a dan in Aikido, I believe -- who visited some different countries and trained various arts. Kalarippayattu was one of the systems featured, and it appears to be very strenuous. The fighters look very much like long-term serious yoga practitioners -- very lithe and stretched out. They also incorporate a massage regimen.

Wish I could remember the name of the series. It was extremely well-done.

If you ever do sir, please tell me!
Thanks!