Would you label this a spinning back kick or side kick or hybrid?

[dvcochran]

If I simply wrote back kick, I would start with my back towards the target. The english term we use in TKD is spinning back kick or side kick whenever there is a turn.

???What???

 

[dvcochran]

maybe, but your giving up power for mobility , which may be a trade off worth making, but thats not why he is doing

Not necessarily. That is where the practice comes into play.

 

[dvcochran]

By using your definition, this can be called as back kick too.

IMO, if you kick back and then turn, that's back kick. If you turn and then kick, that's side kick. But if you turn and kick at the same time, it's hard to call whether that's a back kick, or a side kick.

I am not certain what that is but it landed very awkwardly.

 

[jobo]

For various justifiable reasons, by your own admission you have greatly reduced to selection of kicks available to you. Which is fine and done by everyone for one reason or another.
But to then arbitrarily bash a kick because it doesn't work well for You it not good. Take the spinning kick in the OP.

If the average person practiced that kick as often as they practiced say a generic front kick it would at the very least be useful.

To drill down a litter further; a person who began training in their earlier years who practiced the same kick with frequency will have made it a very effective kick.

Drill down further still and you can see that competitive and elite fighters use this kick often Because of it's effectiveness. It is a recorded fact that many people can throw a spinning side faster than most people can throw a front kick. The rotational velocity greatly increases speed and power.
A lot of the refinement is in the spatial alignment. It simply takes some people more time to get comfortable with the spinning motion than others. Some people never really get comfortable with it.
Add to this the sheer number of variations in just the kick shown in the OP and it has great value in almost every situation.

Now, it a person never practices the kick or for whatever reason (other than laziness) cannot perform the kick well then by all means it does not need to be in their tool bag if/when they really need a good kick.

your argueing with things i havent said, im taking about that kick, vague assurances that some extremly efficient peopke can make that kick faster and more effective, is obviously true, but he isnt one of them.

or does it appear he started as a young child, so that not applicable,

really all yoyr saying is if he practises it he will get better, again probebly true, but that not to say it will ever meet the standards of these people you quote, so ever be highly effective !

but my comments stand on kicks in general and the back kick isnt one of the kicks i cant do, the front kick is, well a front kick above knee high anyway, which is why ive replaced with a soccer kick, if im kickibg low i may as well as its harder, with boots or shoes on

the more moving parts a kick has and the longer it takes to exicute the higher the chances that it will fail, if that matters is dependent on where and why you are fighting, who you are fighting and what happens next,

clearly people who can throw a spinning side quick quickly can also throw a side kick quickly, is the spinnibg version quicker? maybe, but i doubt it commonly is, does it matter? only if they use the tine to move or catch your leg

and yes i know, you wete supperdupper as a youbg man, but thats not representative

 

[Acronym]

For the record, I don't think it was a good delivery and the thread wasn't about that.

 

[dvcochran]

your argueing with things i havent said, im taking about that kick, vague assurances that some extremly efficient peopke can make that kick faster and more effective, is obviously true, but he isnt one of them.

or does it appear he started as a young child, so that not applicable,

really all yoyr saying is if he practises it he will get better, again probebly true, but that not to say it will ever meet the standards of these people you quote, so ever be highly effective !

but my comments stand on kicks in general and the back kick isnt one of the kicks i cant do, the front kick is, well a front kick above knee high anyway, which is why ive replaced with a soccer kick, if im kickibg low i may as well as its harder, with boots or shoes on

the more moving parts a kick has and the longer it takes to exicute the higher the chances that it will fail, if that matters is dependent on where and why you are fighting, who you are fighting and what happens next,

clearly people who can throw a spinning side quick quickly can also throw a side kick quickly, is the spinnibg version quicker? maybe, but i doubt it commonly is, does it matter? only if they use the tine to move or catch your leg

and yes i know, you wete supperdupper as a youbg man, but thats not representative

I am definitely with you and my limited options on kick these days. There are some kicks I used to do very well that I cannot do at all now. Some kicks I can still do but not well. And some kicks I can still count on.
But I do not want to take those kicks away from anyone else until their own circumstances force that to happen.

 

[Gerry Seymour]

That would be correct. But I am not certain you originally made the comparison of two entities under identical conditions except accel time.

Given that was the only direct variable discussed, I'm not sure how a different assumption would be drawn.

 

[jobo]

Given that was the only direct variable discussed, I'm not sure how a different assumption would be drawn.

its also a variable that is near impossoble to vary independently (or measure )in either human kinetics or freefall, so not at all a logical conclusion when discusing kinetics or free fall or even balistics come to that

 

[Gerry Seymour]

its also a variable that is near impossoble to vary independently (or measure )in either human kinetics or freefall, so not at all a logical conclusion when discusing kinetics or free fall or even balistics come to that

Accleration can't be varied in human kinetics???

EDIT: Had to correct spelling. Jobo, your habits are infecting me!

 

[jobo]

Accleration can't be varied in human kinetics???

EDIT: Had to correct spelling. Jobo, your habits are infecting me!

it was two identical objects, where do you get two identical people from, and yes it can be varried but not indepedent of other variables. you change the duration of the acceleration and lots of other things change as well

 

[Gerry Seymour]

it was two identical objects, where do you get two identical people from, and yes it can be varried but not indepedent of other variables. you change the duration of the acceleration and lots of other things change as well

Nice try. Just admit you made an incorrect statement. We all do it at times, and admitting it is a lot easier than denying that theoretical physics applies to kinesthetics.

 

[jobo]

Nice try. Just admit you made an incorrect statement. We all do it at times, and admitting it is a lot easier than denying that theoretical physics applies to kinesthetics.

no my state ment was clear and accurate, you cant change the variable on lengh of acceleration with out changibg other variables,

thats clear,

for instance how would you change the variable on the time inder accelation of a push, you cant, your arms are only so long, so you would need to shorten one, push ,which would alter the power curve of the joint

so now you have two variables in play

 

[dvcochran]

Given that was the only direct variable discussed, I'm not sure how a different assumption would be drawn.

Because using it as you did is an uncommon way to use the formula. Other than in maybe quantum physics there are not many ways to actually use the acceleration formula where the external factors do not have to be considered. That is why I mentioned 'ramp'. Mass and momentum will work against you more than it will work for you in a mechanical environment.

 

[Gerry Seymour]

Because using it as you did is an uncommon way to use the formula. Other than in maybe quantum physics there are not many ways to actually use the acceleration formula where the external factors do not have to be considered. That is why I mentioned 'ramp'. Mass and momentum will work against you more than it will work for you in a mechanical environment.

I didn't use the formula. I simply stated the variable that would be changing: time under acceleration. That's a pretty straightforward statement, and I'm not sure how it confused you.

 

[jobo]

I didn't use the formula. I simply stated the variable that would be changing: time under acceleration. That's a pretty straightforward statement, and I'm not sure how it confused you.

because its not the only variable that would change, in anything but that which was self propelled by an engine and even then??? your also increasing mometum and wind resistance, which means your parameter of constant uniform acxeleration is impossible to achieve, and of course the power charecteristic of the engine

 

[dvcochran]

I didn't use the formula. I simply stated the variable that would be changing: time under acceleration. That's a pretty straightforward statement, and I'm not sure how it confused you.

Not confused at all and I agree your statement is true regarding acceleration/time. But in application it has a very limited purpose. Until you do something with it, it is a theoretical fact of physics. Nothing more.
This is exactly the point that I have seen so many college graduates get to but never acquire the ability to cross. Can they set in a chair and learn how to write the formula and get a result on paper? Sure. Can they apply this tool to something in the real world? Not very often. Conversely, I have seen many people who were taught how to cut rafters or stringers for example. Show them the geometry formulas/equations behind this and without exception they will say "yea, I get that".

Again, I made no effort to offend anyone. If I did I apologize.

 

[Gerry Seymour]

because its not the only variable that would change, in anything but that which was self propelled by an engine and even then??? your also increasing mometum and wind resistance, which means your parameter of constant uniform acxeleration is impossible to achieve, and of course the power charecteristic of the engine

You don't understand theoretical physics at all.

 

[Gerry Seymour]

Not confused at all and I agree your statement is true regarding acceleration/time. But in application it has a very limited purpose. Until you do something with it, it is a theoretical fact of physics. Nothing more.
This is exactly the point that I have seen so many college graduates get to but never acquire the ability to cross. Can they set in a chair and learn how to write the formula and get a result on paper? Sure. Can they apply this tool to something in the real world? Not very often. Conversely, I have seen many people who were taught how to cut rafters or stringers for example. Show them the geometry formulas/equations behind this and without exception they will say "yea, I get that".

Again, I made no effort to offend anyone. If I did I apologize.

And the statement I made was entirely within the realm of theoretical physics. I didn't apply it to anything real-world. You made an attempt to correct what wasn't incorrect.

 

[jobo]

You don't understand theoretical physics at all.

do you under stand any physics accept from grade school, one dimentional round objects in a vacume with no friction and no propulsion,

no,

theoretical physics doesnt support you either, if that theory includeds real world application or if you insist on beibg torally abstract,even the other theoretical issues youve ignored
or are you really saying that air restance , friction and leverage doesnt exist in theortical physics,

then thats thhe sort of madness that results in people designing perpetual motion machines

 

[jobo]

And the statement I made was entirely within the realm of theoretical physics. I didn't apply it to anything real-world. You made an attempt to correct what wasn't incorrect.

well this seems to be a grudgibg acceptance that your statements dont exist as true out side of grade school science class