Wing Chun and Animal Techniques.

[arnisador]

I don't think I've ever heard a Wing Chun technique referred to as being a Tiger, or Dragon, or Crane, or what-have-you technique. Is there any animal style that is associated with Wing Chun or is it entirely separate from the Shaolin animal systems? Are any of the punches/blocks/etc. considered to be of some animal's type?

 

[Phil Elmore]

My teacher, Sifu Anthony Iglesias, wrote an article called "The Five Animals of Wing Chun" for the next issue of The Martialist. It appears in our subscriber-only content. Here's a quote:

It is widely believed that the origins of Kung Fu are rooted deeply in animal forms -- movements studied and imitated by the first Kung Fu practitioners of the Shaolin Temple as they observed certain living creatures. You may hear from those who don't know better that Wing Chun is not an "animal style." The fact is, however, that animal characteristics are very much a part of Wing Chun Kung Fu's different aspects.

The five animals of Wing Chun are the tiger, leopard, white crane, dragon and snake. Each of these five animals is associated with one of the Chinese elements: fire, metal, wood, earth and water.

Each Wing Chun lineage pays respect to the five animals in its own way. Some kwoons have a snake and crane on their school banner, for example, while others use the crane and tiger or just the dragon. Regardless of lineage, the animal forms present in Kung Fu styles are part of both our movements and our thoughts. At the Syracuse Wing Chun Academy, we focus on all five animals and their characteristics...

 

[arnisador]

I'll have to look at some of my Wing Chun books again with an eye to the tiger, leopard, white crane, dragon and snake. Thanks!

 

[leehoicheun]

to answer your question you have to look at where Wing Chun originated. The most popular story is that it came from the Shaolin Temple created by the five elders.

an experienced WC practioner can easily spot the symilarities while watching a Shaolin fighter.

for example: I taught at the Fu Shaung Temple which is a Shaolin based school. I would often watch the other classes and always see bits and pieces that seemed to come directly from Wing Chun.... or should I say.... where WC got it from

One day while watching Sifu Hammond teaching the Tiger & Crane form I saw WC all over the place. If I ever wondered about WC's origins before.... they were put to rest after my time spent with Sifu hammond at the Fu Shaung Temple.

so YES.... there are animals in Wing Chun.

 

[arnisador]

Originally posted by leehoicheun
One day while watching Sifu Hammond teaching the Tiger & Crane form I saw WC all over the place.

Can you give me some specific examples? I'm not a WC person, but I do have access to vid clips of the forms, for example.

 

[leehoicheun]

it's been a while and I can't remember exactly everything i saw but let's start off with the basic hand movements.

In the form they were doing they was a substantial amount of Fook Sau (hooking/subdueing hand) which represents the crane. Wing Chun uses Fook Sau. The Fook Sau was used in combintation with differents strikes like Biu Jee (thrusting fingers) and more. They also did Larp Sau (grabbing band) which is Tiger.

All I can say is that you'll have to see it for yourself to understand fully what I saw.

Good Luck

 

[Samurai]

IN the book Yuen Kay-San Wing Chun Kuen by Rene Ritche he uses animal names for some of the movements.

--Jeremy Bays

 

[arnisador]

From here:
http://www.shaolin.com/page.asp?content_id=1002

The two universal aspects of snake techniques are pin-point open-hand strikes and twisting arm postures to disguise one’s line of attack. Such movements are often seen in Wing Chun kung fu forms, as in the third, or Bil Jee, set, in which most of the hand techniques are snake-derived.

Web-searching has also turned up several claims that WC is a crane/snake based style (e.g., here and here).

 

[Gwailao]

As i have always understood it, wing chun's animal roots are snake and crane. Not saying any other indeas are wrong, thats jut how ive always understood it.

 

[Phil Elmore]

Those are certainly prominent (bil jee, the evasive footwork, etc.). Lop Sau is very "tiger," though, as just one alternative example.

 

[Gwailao]

just curious, but what about it makes it "tigerish"? no really familar with that styles appraoch

 

[Phil Elmore]

Lop sau is a Wing Chun technique that involves pulling the opponent's arm down and back, out of the way -- sort of like a tiger might claw someone.

 

[Gwailao]

well i guess thats one way to look at it, but do they practice lop sao in tiger kung fu?

 

[leehoicheun]

yes.

I would say that thinking about it too much is not healthy. As stated in an article I wrote, each linage pays tribute to 1, 2 or more of the animals. In one school of thought, they pay respect to Crane, Snake, Tiger and Fox...................... Fox?:asian:

this does not mean they are wrong. It's just another way of thinking.

You asked about Lop Sau. Lop Sau means "grabbing hand". A snake can not grab you, it has no hands or claws. so this rules it out as a snake hand. A crane, like the snake, has no claws other then the claws on it's legs that are too busy meneuvering and avoiding. The tiger however uses it's claws to catch and hold you, pulling you into it's crushing jaws. This is the same way a Lop Sau works. It pulls you in to the strike and stays "sticky" to you.

To go even further. It's not about how the animals are shown in the physical aspects of a style, but rather how they show in the mental and spiritual. Here's what I mean. A person can be very tiger in his powerful rip you to shreds mentallity or he can be very snake like in his slipperiness and non force on force nature.

Most Kung/Gung Fu practitioners aim to be able to use all five animals and elements. This is mastery at it's best. The ability to flow from one to the other with out thought. You are attacked with tiger, you become snake. Or you are attacked with fire, you put the flames out with water. But, if you fight fire with fire, the bigger, stronger fire wins.

I hope this helps.
Amit To Fo.

 

[arnisador]

What animal, if any, is associated with the basic Wing Chun straight punch and the associated chain punches?

Often the index finger bulges out slightly, but not so much that it looks like a phoenix fist to me.

 

[leehoicheun]

the wing chun straight punch belongs to the animal... HUMANS :rofl:

but seriously. You're thinking way too much about what animal represents what technique and forgetting that the animal "behavior" was added to the already existing HUMAN attributes.

In the words of Bruce Lee.... A punch is a punch.:asian:

someone once told me that the most boring thing about classical music are the poeple who write about it. I tend to agree. Instead.... I'd rather just listen to it. for Wing Chun, I'd rather train.

 

[arnisador]

Just curious!

 

[Phil Elmore]

The Animals of Wing Chun, an article by Sifu Anthony Iglesias

 

[Pat]

The straight punch is normally associated with the element of wood. However, the straight punch can also be done with a rising energy or a falling energy, which would associate it with a different element. I don't know if this helps or hinders this discussion.
:shrug: :drinkbeer

 

[arnisador]

I usually think of those elements in Japanese systems and the animals in Chinese systems, but I know it's more complicated than that. What animal might go with it?