I wrestled from 3rd grade through graduating high school. Then coached on and off for 10 years. The “rolling around with guys wearing tights” didn’t get old for most people. Genuine friends having a good joke, and idiots I couldn’t stand. It never really bothered me. They all knew they couldn’t handle what wrestlers go through.
There are those with a chip on their shoulder, but it doesn't make you a jerk if you give someone a black eye in training. Not proud of it, but I've given a few people black eyes before in training, it happens sometimes. The group I train with are very positive and good-hearted people. Me jumping to conclusions of their character because of a few bruises and black eyes is presumptuous.
It's not the intention of hurting you, it's the pressure of sparring an opponent with greater skill than you. As I've already stated, control is a relative term. Controlling your power to a reasonable degree is one thing, nerfing it to a degree where it won't even hurt is another matter.
As I've already stated, blackening eyes doesn't require a lot of power.
I said occasional black eyes, not "a lot". I understand that this style of training isn't for everyone, but it is for some people. The same goes for drills and other training, not only sparring. If I'm doing a blocking drill I want to block real attacks, I want to have to pick up on tells to react appropriately. Do slip ups happen? Yes, but you carry on. I've been to schools that have strict rules on no hard contact and zero head contact. Different schools have different training cultures, if it's not for you that's understandable, but that doesn't make it wrong. It's ignorant to say someone is brainwashed for having a different training method than you.
I already said occasionally, I don't know where you got "a lot" from.
Not disagreeing with any info here about CTE - just understand that some folks accept harder sparring. If the level is agreed upon, it's not a control issue. Still a safety issue, perhaps, but not a control issue. The ones I've gotten and given in grappling and defensive testing were often more properly chalked up to poor control.
Expand on your first sentence.
You're missing the point, getting hit isn't the method nor the goal. Learning to deal with realistic energy both technically and psychologically is the goal. Blackening eyes and bruising doesn't require a lot of power.
Damaging to the capillaries yes. Permanent brain damage? No
Your article refers to some professional boxers and football players. Training hard and training intelligently aren't mutually exclusive, but there is a fine line between training hard and training recklessly. Training with realistic energy isn't reckless, but beating the hell out of each other with no purpose nor direction is. You're conflating any level and frequency of head contact to permanent brain damage is inaccurate. CTE is a serious issue, but it's caused by multiple consciousness and/or chronically severe head traumas. Does overexposure to the sun cause skin cancer? Yes. But that doesn't mean any contact with the sun will result in skin cancer.
Tbh all I'm seeing from you is you thinking your a badasss because you get black eyes in training. Its not tough getting beat up its dumb. Most of the brain damage fighters get is from sparring. That's why numerous boxers and Mma guys say they don't spar anymore or they regret fighting hard in the gym because it messed up their health and yes actually it takes quite a lot of power to cause a black eye. If it wasnt then every single boxer would have black eyes after every fight but they don't again there's absolutely 0 reason for anyone to be getting black eyes in training apart from professional fighters who get paid. The only reason for it happening is either the occasional accident, bad control or ego
I'm not disagreeing that its dangerous to be hit in the head, but some people just do martial art differently then others. To say that "This school blah blah blah" or "that school blah blah blah" Is their opinion. If someone wants to go hard why shouldn't they? thats just the way they train and thats just the way they enjoy training
If someone wants to get kicked/punched in the face thats honestly their problem. They made that decision and I dont think that its right as a Martial Artist or a human being to say their path is wrong. Just because something isn't healthy that doesn't give anyone a right to judge that way of fighting
And what if they don't....what if someone doesn't want to get beat up yet the instructor allows it to happen even if the person doesn't want that
(Ah.. I was just trying to inject a little humour into the thread, break up the seriousness, was totally joking, ah well
)
Yes, I agree that numerous Pro fighters have taken so much abuse that their health is in a very poor state. However; there are numerous world renowned fighters that have had long carriers, trained hard and still have their mental faculties intact. Again, it has to do with the approach and methods of their training.
No it doesn't. You have very little tissue between the skin around your eye and the bones below it. This has a dynamic affect and makes it more prone to bruising by not having any soft tissue or muscle underneath it to absorb and dissipate the force. I've been struck very hard in the abdomen/diaphragm area, but it doesn't bruise nearly as easily or at all because my abdomen has a lot of tissue and muscles underneath to dissipate the force. In summary, bony surfaces are easier to bruise.
Boxing gloves makes getting black eyes more difficult. It has more so to do with the size of the gloves and making it more difficult in getting a strike to fit into such a small opening. Black eyes still do happen in professional fights though.
That's more of a personal preference, some people prefer this method of training. It has more to do with training under the conditions in which black eyes and bruises are more probable, rather than intentionally striking each other in the eye.
I did read that part. When I refer to real attacks that isn't only referring to the power but to the trajectories and targets as well. I don't think your approach is wrong, but it's simply not for me. When I'm sparring/drilling I want to have to deal with attacks both high and low. If I get into an altercation I want deeply ingrained muscle memory response when someone starts swinging at my head.
You misunderstand, I meant the capillaries of the skin, when they burst/rupture that results in visible bruising. I wasn't referring to the capillaries of the brain.
We're all at risk of injury, some greater than others. There are accidents and injuries in all sorts of different training environments. The greatest injury I've ever witnessed was in Aikido. One student did the four directions throw and accidentally tore the guys shoulder. He didn't do it hard nor fast, he just did it at the wrong angle and the guy lives with the limitations from that injury to this very day.
Refer to my response to headhunter
They might be irrelevant to you, but not to the topic. This isn't solely a conversation on brain trauma, but on training methods as well.
The questions isn't if there's damage or not, the question is where and to what extent is the damage? Getting struck in the head, walking into a car door causes damage. But there's not evidence that any contact to the head automatically causes permanent brain damage.
Repetitive and subconcussive are loose terms. By that definition getting poked in the head twice will result in CTE. The devil is in the details.
CTE is a real thing and is a serious issue. However; the broad scope you are applying CTE is inaccurate. Saying any force to the head at any frequency will result in CTE isn't supported. By that logic every professional boxer, kickboxer, mixed-martial artis, soccer and football player in the world would be diagnosed with CTE. You can have both intelligent and unintelligent approaches to hard training, that's where I think most of the difference lies.
