Where did the SKH stuff come from?

[Don Roley]

Now I thought this Straight Bladed ninja sword thing had been discussed elsewhere. In Lore of the Shinobi Warrior Book five in the chapter "Myths of Ninjutsu" it clearly states that this idea is a cultural sterotype, and goes on to say where the misinformation possibly comes from. He then goes on to say that in Dr Hatsumis collection the majority of swords do not fall into this catergory. If one views the Stephen K Hayes DVDs one will be hard bushed to find a straight bladed sword, except possibly on the shuriken DVD, but then one can't really tell if the blade is straight as one does not, if I remember correctly, see all the blade. Its probably just a cheap blade that they did not mind damaging considering they were throwing metal shuriken at it.

Wait a minute, are you now trying to say that Hayes had nothing to do with the spreading of that mistaken little story? His early works clearly say that the ninja used straight bladed swords. I am sure someone not on the road can give exact quotes and page numbers. Heck, he even sold a straight bladed bokken through a martial arts' gear company he liscened with. "The Steve Hayes Collection" IIRC.

In this case, it seems that Hayes got his mistaken impressions from theatre. Stage swords are actually wood covered with thin metal for safety. Cheap, low budget productions have been known to not carve the blades but to go with just the straight pieces of wood you can pick up anywhere to arm their many actors at times.

 

[Bob Hubbard]

Don,
You won't get a reply from Gary/Gina. HeShe has been banned for continued misuse of multiple accounts and telling us they didn't care if they were banned.

 

[Fallen Ninja]

Man, lots of drama overnight. Anyway looks like I was wrong about Don not knowing... Oh, well doesn't really affect my Kamae :uhyeah: !

So where do we go now... back to our dojos or...

:ninja:
FN

p.s. The Bujinkan rules and everyone needs to realize that! Ha Ha Ha:rofl:

I've always wanted to say that!

 

[Jonathan Randall]

Don,
You won't get a reply from Gary/Gina. HeShe has been banned for continued misuse of multiple accounts and telling us they didn't care if they were banned.

Thank you. It is hard to trust someone's answers when you cannot trust them...

I'm sure To Shin Do has better representatives out there. Actually, I'm sure they do. I hope that they will come onto this board and represent their art, and themselves, honestly.

 

[Tony Dismukes]

Okay, here's another data point on the subject of Stephen Hayes deriving the godai concepts from stuff Hatsumi taught him (or not):

Back at the first Tai Kai in San Francisco in 1986, I was a relatively new student of ninpo taijutsu. Hatsumi was doing a question-and-answer session after the day's training. I had been writing out possible questions to ask for days. Finally, I rejected most of them as being too advanced for someone at my level. I should ask, I decided, about the most basic aspect of training as I knew it at that time. So when I raised my hand and was called on, I asked Hatsumi-sensei to elaborate on the significance of the godai. (Not the godai-no-kata, mind you, I was asking about the basic concept of the godai.)

The translator looked puzzled and conferred with Hatsumi for a moment, then responded: "The significance of the what?" At this point, Jack Hoban leaned over towards Hatsumi and started to explain, "That's just something we came up with over here to ..." He was immediately cut off by Stephen Hayes, who signalled him to be quiet. There was a little more discussion with Hatsumi, then the translator came back with the answer, something along the lines of, "Don't worry about it, just keep training."

I always thought it was strange that Steve didn't just take credit for coming up with the godai training concept. It's an interesting approach, and potentially useful so long as you don't take it too literally.

 

[Cryozombie]

Off topic but are you the same tony from Low tech riff raff?

 

[Satt]

Off topic but are you the same tony from Low tech riff raff?

Well, if you look at his profile, his website is www.lowtechriffraff.com.

 

[Cryozombie]

Well, if you look at his profile, his website is www.lowtechriffraff.com.

Clever boy.

I didnt look at his profile.

Stop being a smartass.

:wink1:

 

[Tony Dismukes]

Off topic but are you the same tony from Low tech riff raff?

First time I've been recognized online by my band affiliation. Yep, that's me.

 

[George Kohler]

What I am about quote is from John Lindsey on E-budo.com and it might have some bearing to this discussion.

Originally posted by John Lindsey
Once when I was training with Tanemura Sensei in Japan I asked about one of the kamae from a Gyokko ryu kata and why we were using a specific hand seal. He told me: “your thumb is forming a ring with your water finger. The attacker is fire, and you are becoming water to counter him.” Since Tanemura S. was Hayes’ original teacher, I wonder…

 

[Brian R. VanCise]

That is fascinating and possibly revealing as well.
Thanks George for your insight.

Brian R. VanCise
www.instinctiveresponsetraining.com

 

[Senin]

"Originally posted by John Lindsey
Once when I was training with Tanemura Sensei in Japan I asked about one of the kamae from a Gyokko ryu kata and why we were using a specific hand seal. He told me: ?your thumb is forming a ring with your water finger. The attacker is fire, and you are becoming water to counter him.? Since Tanemura S. was Hayes? original teacher, I wonder?"

Perhaps Mr Tanemura taught Mr Hayes things that Hatsumi was not (and is still not) ready to allow go public (such as other aspects of ninpo, other than just taijutsu).

 

[Fallen Ninja]

Obviously he got it from someone who he assumed knew more than him... It would be unethical for him just to make it up.

So "Where?" indeed is the question.

:ninja:
FN

 

[Don Roley]

Don,
You won't get a reply from Gary/Gina. HeShe has been banned for continued misuse of multiple accounts and telling us they didn't care if they were banned.

And it seems he has been sent to e-budo hell for (among other things) using more than one account name. I am now convinced that he is actively trying to fool people by appearing to be someone else. I think we should be on the look out for maybe another appearance by him.

 

[Grey Eyed Bandit]

Perhaps Mr Tanemura taught Mr Hayes things that Hatsumi was not (and is still not) ready to allow go public (such as other aspects of ninpo, other than just taijutsu).

I was at a seminar last weekend in which we did what seems to be very much like the technique mentioned above, albeit with an even more extensive explanation (such as the "prayer position" of kongo gassho no kamae, in which you're praying that the situation you're training to handle will never happen for real).

 

[Arachne]

It's sad to hear such a Sensei has been banned from a forum!

As a student, I find Gary is a proficient Sensei, enlightens students with humour and encourages them to develop their own style of fighting. Not only does he have the respect of many students and other excellent people like himself, but he also holds a 1st degree black belt in To-shindo. He is an excellent teacher and is travelling with Stephen K Hayes this year. I believe he is having the opportunity to try on authentic Ninja armour. I am sure if he is kind enough, we might have the opportunity to see pictures of something truly genuine.

“Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds."
-- Albert Einstein


Alex

http://arachne24585.spaces.live.com - Msn Space
www.globalcrystals.com/forum - Forum
www.naturalwiki.com - Intuitipedia

 

[Kreth]

It's sad to hear such a Sensei has been banned from a forum!

We're not too broken up over it. He couldn't play by the rules.

 

[Arachne]

"We're not too broken up over it."

Who's "We" ?

 

[Kreth]

"We're not too broken up over it."

Who's "We" ?

The forum staff, who made the decision to ban Gary Arthur after he blatantly violated the rules here.

 

[Arachne]

It is Sad to hear that.
But Thankyou for keeping the forum in order.

So where did all this SKH stuff come from?
I would appreciate simplicity.