What’s a good martial art to blend with Taekwondo?

[Hanzou]

I had no idea Taekwondo had such a respectable showing in MMA.

But then stuff like this is why I think it's foolish to rule out wing chun etc. Just because an art hasn't got a base of full contact fighters doesn't mean it won't.

After the early UFC for years all you heard on forums like this was "high kicks don't work".

Dogma was made to be broken.

High kicks work in UFC because MMA fighters have good takedown defense and are all around solid grapplers. You develop a good grappling base and that gives you the freedom to do all kinds of wild stuff with striking.

The problem with Wing Chun is two-fold: It has dubious principles as a striking art, and if you're going into MMA you simply have better options that give you quicker results.

 

[JR 137]

I think why there's so many TKD Black Belts is because there's so many opportunities to train in TKD schools. It would be my guess that TKD would be the most available style/type of martial opportunity for the general population to find a place to train, at least nation wide here in America. I could be wrong, I haven't done any actual research, that's just my guess from what I've experienced.

Also, years wise, it's not as time consuming as some other avenues of Martial training to achieve a black belt.

But - all the guys shown in that vid, which I loved BTW, those guys are professional MMA fighters in the UFC. You know darn well they've done more than train TKD. And while MMA is just a small slice of the Martial Arts - it really is, there's just so much more to martial Arts than fighting, it is, however, one serious high level of fighting. Tough, nasty, stuff, MMA is, especially in the UFC.

And, as I'm just home from work, early, too I'm watching Saturday's UFC show right now as I type and have a cold one. Life is pretty darn good.

My unscientifical figures tell me there is a 2.962:1 ratio of TKD schools:all other MA styles (including MMA) combined. A TKD school down the road from my house just closed recently, dropping them from 3:1. It’s too bad, the owner seemed like a nice guy.

I drive by 3 TKD schools (actually 2 now) on my way to my dojo. I have respect for TKD. But those two that I drive by don’t get any love from me. They might have if I was 8 and had parents who could afford a to send me there instead of buying a new car.

 

[DaveB]

High kicks work in UFC because MMA fighters have good takedown defense and are all around solid grapplers. You develop a good grappling base and that gives you the freedom to do all kinds of wild stuff with striking.

The problem with Wing Chun is two-fold: It has dubious principles as a striking art, and if you're going into MMA you simply have better options that give you quicker results.

No. High kicks work in MMA because the human body with training can launch powerful kicks which, when learned correctly are hard to anticipate, to head height.

Grappling is a useful addition to one's fighting ability, it is not why other techniques work.

 

[Brandon Miller]

If you're just starting martial arts, why do you know the term McDojo?

Im new to Taekwondo not martial arts

 

[Brandon Miller]

I’m thinking about checking out this school called Freddie Pooles Martial Arts. It’s only 5 miles from my house. Looks to be a belted blended system of some sort. Let me know what you guys think of this place. I’m narrowing it down to these two schools Freddie Poole's Martial Arts

 

[Monkey Turned Wolf]

Im new to Taekwondo not martial arts

What's your MA experience? That could help with advise on what to blend it with.

 

[Brandon Miller]

What's your MA experience? That could help with advise on what to blend it with.

Amateur MMA, Amatuer boxing

 

[DaveB]

Ignore.

 

[Hanzou]

I’m thinking about checking out this school called Freddie Pooles Martial Arts. It’s only 5 miles from my house. Looks to be a belted blended system of some sort. Let me know what you guys think of this place. I’m narrowing it down to these two schools Freddie Poole's Martial Arts

Seems legit. The head instructor gave off a few red flags, but then you scroll down and hes surrounded by some very experienced folks. I would definitely check it out and see if you enjoy the instruction being offered.

 

[Buka]

I've got some TKD in my background. What worked well for me was boxing and grappling. But everyone is different.

Maybe keep this in mind....everyone here sounds like lifers. If so, your first ten years in the Arts is just walking down the beach to the water.

 

[Hanzou]

No. High kicks work in MMA because the human body with training can launch powerful kicks which, when learned correctly are hard to anticipate, to head height.

Grappling is a useful addition to one's fighting ability, it is not why other techniques work.

Grappling allows everything to work in MMA.

In MMA, you can get by without high kicks or even kicking period.

You're not getting by in MMA without grappling.

 

[DaveB]

Grappling allows everything to work in MMA.

In MMA, you can get by without high kicks or even kicking period.

You're not getting by in MMA without grappling.

What you need to win in MMA and why a technique works are two totally different things.

 

[Hanzou]

What you need to win in MMA and why a technique works are two totally different things.

I'm talking about why a technique works in MMA, not why it works period.

Those same principles apply to Wing Chun as well. The art has weak takedown defense among other things, thus it is absent from MMA. If you can't stop a basic takedown, you're not going to make it very far in MMA.

 

[DaveB]

I'm talking about why a technique works in MMA, not why it works period.

Those same principles apply to Wing Chun as well. The art has weak takedown defense among other things, thus it is absent from MMA. If you can't stop a basic takedown, you're not going to make it very far in MMA.

Even so you'd be wrong, at least if we're using English.

As for wing chun not doing well because it doesn't have good takedown defence, that couldn't be more wrong.

Boxing has no takedown defence. Almost no arts that aren't grappling arts specifically have decent takedown defence because nobody in their right mind fights on the ground in a non sporting fight.

And also, why would wing chun need a ground defence etc in MMA. That's what bjj is for.

 

[Hanzou]

Even so you'd be wrong, at least if we're using English.

As for wing chun not doing well because it doesn't have good takedown defence, that couldn't be more wrong.

Actually that's exactly why it doesn't do well in a MMA context.

Boxing has no takedown defence.

Boxing alone doesn't do too hot in MMA either.

Almost no arts that aren't grappling arts specifically have decent takedown defence because nobody in their right mind fights on the ground in a non sporting fight.

I certainly hope you're joking. Takedown defense (and ground fighting) isn't just for fighting on the ground or inside a ring, its to stop you from winding up on the ground and in a very bad situation. For example, you could just get scooped up and slammed and wind up unconscious or dead from impact with concrete:

Or you could get taken to the ground, not get knocked out, and then have to deal with someone on top of you trying to turn your face into hamburger:

If you know some grappling (frankly if you know bjj) you can reduce the chances of that happening to you;

I've always found it interesting that so many traditional MAs seemingly "forgot" a very important aspect of fighting.

And also, why would wing chun need a ground defence etc in MMA. That's what bjj is for.

Wing Chun needs ground defense period, not just for MMA. Yes, I would highly recommend WC exponents to cross-train in Bjj if they have the time.

 

[drop bear]

High kicks work in UFC because MMA fighters have good takedown defense and are all around solid grapplers. You develop a good grappling base and that gives you the freedom to do all kinds of wild stuff with striking.

The problem with Wing Chun is two-fold: It has dubious principles as a striking art, and if you're going into MMA you simply have better options that give you quicker results.

There is a whole bunch of stuff that makes chun just really bad for takedowns. Like the forward pressure concepts.

And you will find chunners that can actually fight have invested time in footwork and head movement.

Otherwise this the method of ambushing someone takes a certain kind of fighter. Basically you have to out staunch the guy and have to out fitness the guy. And chun doesn't spend a lot of time making guys fit.

I personally think chun has to mostly be applied from distance where you would have time to use the hand trapping.

 

[drop bear]

Even so you'd be wrong, at least if we're using English.

As for wing chun not doing well because it doesn't have good takedown defence, that couldn't be more wrong.

Boxing has no takedown defence. Almost no arts that aren't grappling arts specifically have decent takedown defence because nobody in their right mind fights on the ground in a non sporting fight.

And also, why would wing chun need a ground defence etc in MMA. That's what bjj is for.

The ground is a complicated and nuanced idea. And for some reason non sporting fight instructors don't seem to understand nuance.

Wing chun would need ground defense because ultimately one thing is the other. You don't stand up doing wing chun and then fall to the ground doing bjj. You are doing them both at once.

 

[drop bear]

Boxing has no takedown defence.

Yes it sort of does. And amateur boxing more so.

Because of the style of their striking. They get in do damage and then get out.

You can do takedowns easily when you are being punched in the head. And you can't do takedowns easily from too far away.

You can wait, cover up and let a striker over commit himself with ineffective strikes and do takedowns fairly easily.

Wing chun hangs out in that takedown range a lot longer. And hand trapping isn't damage.

 

[DaveB]

Actually that's exactly why it doesn't do well in a MMA context.



Boxing alone doesn't do too hot in MMA either.



I certainly hope you're joking. Takedown defense (and ground fighting) isn't just for fighting on the ground or inside a ring, its to stop you from winding up on the ground and in a very bad situation. For example, you could just get scooped up and slammed and wind up unconscious or dead from impact with concrete:

Or you could get taken to the ground, not get knocked out, and then have to deal with someone on top of you trying to turn your face into hamburger:

If you know some grappling (frankly if you know bjj) you can reduce the chances of that happening to you;

I've always found it interesting that so many traditional MAs seemingly "forgot" a very important aspect of fighting.



Wing Chun needs ground defense period, not just for MMA. Yes, I would highly recommend WC exponents to cross-train in Bjj if they have the time.

Stand up martial arts do usually have some level of ground defence, it's just not refined enough to stand up to ground specialists because no one who thought about defending themselves from bandits.

 

[Hanzou]

Stand up martial arts do usually have some level of ground defence, it's just not refined enough to stand up to ground specialists because no one who thought about defending themselves from bandits.

You don't need to be a ground specialist to take someone down. A buff kid watching youtube vids on takedowns is more than enough to dunk even a trained person on their head. We're not even considering the large number of people who wrestled, played American Football, or Rugby in their younger days.