Vehicles as weapons

Discussion in 'General Self Defense' started by PhotonGuy, Aug 18, 2017.

  1. PhotonGuy

    PhotonGuy Senior Master

    Joined:
    Aug 14, 2013
    Messages:
    2,953
    Likes Received:
    274
    Trophy Points:
    143
    Vehicles seem to be a current trend as the weapon of choice for mass killers. There has just been a terror attack in Barcelona where a van plowed into a crowd, killing a bunch of people. These vehicle ramming attacks seem to be occurring mostly in Europe although there was recently such an attack in the USA in Virginia. So the best thing I can think of to do is to simply be alert. These vehicle ramming attacks happen in cities or urban areas where there's lots of people so if you're in such an area be extra careful about keeping a lookout for a vehicle that might plow into people. Make sure you have enough room to dodge to the side in case a vehicle comes plowing in your direction and if possible try to run inside any nearby building.
     
  2. drop bear

    drop bear Sr. Grandmaster

    Joined:
    Feb 23, 2014
    Messages:
    15,130
    Likes Received:
    3,249
    Trophy Points:
    308
    I have been nailed by a car before. I got on to the bonnet and did a break fall. apart from some gravel rash I was ok.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  3. dunc

    dunc Orange Belt

    Joined:
    Mar 31, 2006
    Messages:
    79
    Likes Received:
    20
    Trophy Points:
    8
    Yup I think rolling and break falls are probably the key martial arts skills that may help in that situation
     
  4. Danny T

    Danny T Senior Master

    • Supporting Member
    Joined:
    Sep 5, 2002
    Messages:
    3,439
    Likes Received:
    1,705
    Trophy Points:
    238
    Location:
    New Iberia, Louisiana USA
    As in any self defense/personal protection situation...awareness is key. All situations are self defense/personal protection situations. Awareness is always key.
     
  5. gpseymour

    gpseymour Sr. Grandmaster

    Top Poster Of Month

    • Supporting Member
    Joined:
    Mar 27, 2012
    Messages:
    15,146
    Likes Received:
    4,247
    Trophy Points:
    448
    Location:
    Hendersonville, NC
    I thought of that with the Virginia attack, but the attacks in Spain were using vans. Fewer options with those. In a crowd, it'd be damnably difficult to get out of the way.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  6. Tez3

    Tez3 Sr. Grandmaster

    • Supporting Member
    Joined:
    Oct 13, 2006
    Messages:
    25,318
    Likes Received:
    3,870
    Trophy Points:
    308
    Location:
    England
    When a vehicles comes at you at speed as these do and pins you against abuilding, as these do then you are either dead or have life changing injuries. The drivers are specifically attacking people in places where they cannot move away and cannot 'judo roll'. These are cold blooded murderers, they know exactly how to cause the maximum amount of damage. They chose crowed streets and bridges, awareness is unlikely to help you, in fact probably the best thing you can do is hope it misses you. sorry but that's a professional opinion from a Met. officer friend of mine. There's no warning signs and no where to go because that's how they plan it. It's not random attacks.
     
    • Agree Agree x 2
  7. geezer

    geezer Grandmaster

    • MartialTalk Mentor
    Joined:
    Oct 20, 2007
    Messages:
    5,712
    Likes Received:
    1,951
    Trophy Points:
    263
    Location:
    Phoenix, AZ
    Like guns, vehicles can also kill when used carelessly by reckless, drunken, or merely distracted drivers. I live in a state where any adult except a felon can carry a knife or a gun either openly of concealed with no permit ...and everybody drives to get anywhere.

    Friends of mine from other places have asked me if our loose gun laws make me uneasy. My reply is that I'm too busy avoiding being hit by some idiot texting and driving to worry about guns! :confused:
     
    • Like Like x 3
  8. geezer

    geezer Grandmaster

    • MartialTalk Mentor
    Joined:
    Oct 20, 2007
    Messages:
    5,712
    Likes Received:
    1,951
    Trophy Points:
    263
    Location:
    Phoenix, AZ
    After all, 911 was an example of using transportation vehicles as weapons.
     
  9. jobo

    jobo Senior Master

    Joined:
    Apr 3, 2017
    Messages:
    4,116
    Likes Received:
    495
    Trophy Points:
    208
    Location:
    Manchester UK
    if you are in a crowd, they are all trying to move away and nobody is going anywhere fast, added to that people are in family groups with children to worry about. I don't think there is any solution other than keep out of crowded tourist traps. I hate being in crowded places, so its no hardship to me to give them a swerve
     
  10. gpseymour

    gpseymour Sr. Grandmaster

    Top Poster Of Month

    • Supporting Member
    Joined:
    Mar 27, 2012
    Messages:
    15,146
    Likes Received:
    4,247
    Trophy Points:
    448
    Location:
    Hendersonville, NC
    Not always practical to avoid them, though. This weekend, for instance, there's a prediction of something more than 100,000 (maybe as many as 250,000) visitors to our immediate area, in preparation for the eclipse (we are within 30 miles of the path of totality). This area will be clogged in an unusual manner. If I go anywhere, there will be crowds.
     
  11. jobo

    jobo Senior Master

    Joined:
    Apr 3, 2017
    Messages:
    4,116
    Likes Received:
    495
    Trophy Points:
    208
    Location:
    Manchester UK
    at least youl see the car coming of its got its lights on

    i live in a city of near five million people , i manage to avoid very crowded d areas
     
    • Funny Funny x 1
  12. drop bear

    drop bear Sr. Grandmaster

    Joined:
    Feb 23, 2014
    Messages:
    15,130
    Likes Received:
    3,249
    Trophy Points:
    308
    It is not that uncommon. I have a mate who has had two cars try to drive though his pub.
     
  13. Brian King

    Brian King Master Black Belt

    • Supporting Member
    • MartialTalk Mentor
    Joined:
    Mar 17, 2003
    Messages:
    1,487
    Likes Received:
    373
    Trophy Points:
    123
    Location:
    Bellevue, Washington USA
    There are ways of moving thru a crowd even a panicked one but must be practiced and much more difficult if you are with your family.
    Vehicle line of attack is straight, running away but staying in the line of attack is futile at best but it is instinctive to run straight ahead and with a crowd.
    All that said, if it is a planned attack things will be grim. First, Today look where you go but look thru the eyes of someone wanting to do maximum damage. This will give you clues to add to your chances of survival.
    Second, learn trauma care so that if you are a survivor you can assist others to survive.
    Regards
    Brian King
     
    • Like Like x 2
  14. gpseymour

    gpseymour Sr. Grandmaster

    Top Poster Of Month

    • Supporting Member
    Joined:
    Mar 27, 2012
    Messages:
    15,146
    Likes Received:
    4,247
    Trophy Points:
    448
    Location:
    Hendersonville, NC
    This has been on my list for a long time. The Red Cross offers (or at least used to) training for emergency responders. Maybe it's time for me to look into that again.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  15. PhotonGuy

    PhotonGuy Senior Master

    Joined:
    Aug 14, 2013
    Messages:
    2,953
    Likes Received:
    274
    Trophy Points:
    143
    I don't know where you're at but wherever it is you're probably much more likely to get shot if you go to Los Angeles, and LA has among the tightest gun laws.
     
  16. drop bear

    drop bear Sr. Grandmaster

    Joined:
    Feb 23, 2014
    Messages:
    15,130
    Likes Received:
    3,249
    Trophy Points:
    308
    CPR. And bung a t shirt over the bits squirting blood.
     
    • Funny Funny x 1
  17. jobo

    jobo Senior Master

    Joined:
    Apr 3, 2017
    Messages:
    4,116
    Likes Received:
    495
    Trophy Points:
    208
    Location:
    Manchester UK
    the line of attacked isn't,straight, they can swerve from side to side to get the greatest concentration of people, is if every onw goes to the left to get out of the,way, they swerve to that side.

    going in the opposite direction to the crowd seem a good idea, but that easier said than done if the people behind are pushing you
     
  18. gpseymour

    gpseymour Sr. Grandmaster

    Top Poster Of Month

    • Supporting Member
    Joined:
    Mar 27, 2012
    Messages:
    15,146
    Likes Received:
    4,247
    Trophy Points:
    448
    Location:
    Hendersonville, NC
    If they are traveling at some speed, the line of attack can't swerve much and stay in control. I'd have to look at it more closely, but it probably acts like a straight line for the distance we'd react in, if they're at 30-40 MPH.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  19. jobo

    jobo Senior Master

    Joined:
    Apr 3, 2017
    Messages:
    4,116
    Likes Received:
    495
    Trophy Points:
    208
    Location:
    Manchester UK
    when they took out Westminster bridge they were swerving all over the road to get the most people they could, nor do they need to be going that fast to kill people, nor do they need to maintain control, but even so you can move around a considerable amount at that speed.
    how,does swerving all over the road count as a straight line? It certainly isn't the shortest distance between two points, which is the defintion of a straight line
     
  20. gpseymour

    gpseymour Sr. Grandmaster

    Top Poster Of Month

    • Supporting Member
    Joined:
    Mar 27, 2012
    Messages:
    15,146
    Likes Received:
    4,247
    Trophy Points:
    448
    Location:
    Hendersonville, NC
    I said it "probably acts like a straight line for the distance we'd react in". I never said it was one. With some speed, the curve isn't going to be extreme. If they're going 15 MPH, the curve is probably material. At 40, it likely isn't. To see this, look at a curve you can reasonably take at 40 MPH. Now, look at the degree of "lateral" movement (from the target's position) over a reasonably short distance. It's not huge. It will make a difference, depending which direction they run to, but not a huge one. And at that speed, changing direction suddenly in a van isn't likely to be useful - more likely to lose control than to quickly change directions.

    Again, that all presupposes a certain amount of speed. If they are going slower, swerving becomes more of a factor.
     

Share This Page