Uncomfortable

Discussion in 'Women of the Martial Arts (Women Martial Artists)' started by Lilian, Feb 23, 2018.

  1. WaterGal

    WaterGal Master Black Belt

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    That's true. IME, "I'm fine" generally means "explaining what's wrong would be a giant hassle, probably make me more upset, and probably confuse or upset you, so I'd rather just not say anything and pretend I'm fine because that seems easier for both of us".
     
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  2. AngryHobbit

    AngryHobbit Master of Arts

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    I know you are being humorous. That said, let's face it - there is a difference between companionable silence and the dreaded silent treatment.
     
  3. AngryHobbit

    AngryHobbit Master of Arts

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    All jokes aside, I know some ladies will bristle at me and possibly even accuse me of betraying other members of my gender, but I do believe it is important not to assume men are telepathic and will instinctively know what and when they are doing wrong.

    I am NOT talking about relatively clear-cut cases, such as rape, molestation, or sexual harassment. I have experienced attempted rape, years of molestation, and some sexual harassment (it tends to happen when a woman works in a traditionally male field). I am not clueless. I aware those things exist. I am also not talking about situation when someone is very clearly creeping you out - and is obviously aware of doing so.

    However, I must defend men who sincerely and courteously complimented a woman on her looks or her clothes and got fired for sexual harassment. I must defend men who get the silent treatment and spend hours trying to figure out why. I must defend men who smiled or winked at a woman from a distance and were immediately dubbed creepy.

    I refuse to blame men I am interacting with NOW for every sin ever committed by every man who ever lived. Yes, it is true that most tyrants and dictators through history were men. But it's not my husband's fault. And it's not the fault of my male friends. If my relationships with friends and family of either gender go awry, I consider it a matter of equal responsibility to sort out what the problem is and figure out a solution. Pouting, saying I am "fine", and glowering does not solve a damn thing.

    Ladies, speak up. Even when your first impulse tells you, "Well, why SHOULD I speak up? This should be obvious!" It's not about should or must. It's about what IS.

    Gone are the times when Mesopotamian priestesses of Rhea-Kibela, the Mother of Gods, could deem a man physically or mentally unworthy solely based on their own judgment and choose to kill him or castrate him and turn him into a temple slave. Yeah, there are days when this option might look attractive - but it's not longer available. Speak. Up. Or nothing will ever change.
     
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  4. drop bear

    drop bear Sr. Grandmaster

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    By the way I knew a girl at work who was a massive creep. It is definitely awkward.
     
  5. JowGaWolf

    JowGaWolf Grandmaster

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    lol... not going to let that slide huh? lol
     
  6. Tez3

    Tez3 Sr. Grandmaster

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    Really? You have the age and experience to lecture women when you yourself decide that being brought up as a man is better than being brought up as a woman? Sweetheart, you are still a girl, when you are a woman come back and lecture women.

    You are pandering to certain men by agreeing that women are in the wrong. You are refusing to see men and women as individuals and insisting on stereotyping them. You also seem to ignore that domestic abuse is a horrendous thing, speak up, yeah sure, easy for you to say, some women being battered somewhere will be so glad of your advice.

    These days women do speak up, have you missed the 'Me Too' campaign? Women are being encouraged to resist FGM and to fight for equal rights in countries where they don't exist, just recently women have been allowed to drive in Saudi Arabia, small thing to you I'm sure with your 'man brain' but it's small steps that we hope will lead to emancipation. child marriage... in the USA some states are refusing to raise the age of consent and want young girls to be able to marry old men, you think that is just the Third World? Equal pay is something many think is not an issue but in many places still is and you are wittering on about women who don't speak to men? What about men who batter women? I didn't see you condemning that or is that fine? what 'strong silent' better than women men do?

    If you can't see that your little rant is totally inconsequential to women these days then I'm afraid you totally fail to understand today's world. women have brains and use them, they are breadwinners, workers, scientists ( did you think you were unusual being a female scientist?) many things, women and girls do speak out, they say things that need saying. The fact that a couple of posters on here lighthearted roasted their wives on here doesn't mean you get to lecture womanhood because you are 'superior' being brought up by men. I worked with men for over 40 years, I have seen them in all conditions some of which you could not imagine, I have seen men brought low and raised high, and my dear, they are humans with faults, virtues, courage and failings just like women. Your taking sides helps no one, you are not putting backs up you are showing yourself up.

    We should all be working together to make a better world, there are enough problems in the world many of which we can solve relatively easily if we work together. However ignoring those problems as you are is putting us back by decades. You may think by refusing to blame all men (not that anyone has here) you are sounding fair but instead you come across as blaming all women and actually very patronising towards men.



    I have as well, not nice. Human beings are human beings at the end of the day, good bad and indifferent.
     
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  7. Tez3

    Tez3 Sr. Grandmaster

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    Have you seen this thread? Fallout with training partner a female being ignored by the men in her class......................
     
  8. _Simon_

    _Simon_ Brown Belt

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    ...

    AngryHobbit has diminished no one, nor has she slammed any genders. I think she's simply saying she has more masculine characteristics. And I also think gender is being confused with energies/characteristics.

    Males generally (geeenerally) have more masculine energy/characteristics. It's pretty obvious, and it's not a 'stereotype'. Female generally have feminine energy/characteristics. It's a natural thing.

    These differ in degree between people, and some are balanced more towards one than the other. I am definitely more on the feminine side, what some call a new era male haha..

    I used to get riled up about genders/stereotypes, but it took awhile for me to see that it's a non-issue. It showed that I was holding onto a position about genders because part of me still believed what people would say about what I should be, and I was clearly insecure within myself. So instead of attacking everyone, I finally looked within and worked on accepting myself as I am. This isn't me 'yielding' to people's stereotypes, but I didn't see a need in trying to change (from judging) people's views on gender. If it upset me there was something I was judging (distorting) within the other person. I promoted my own understanding of myself by simply being what I am, that has far more influence than perceiving and telling people they're wrong for being who they are.

    It depends on what you're defining an energy as, if you're saying feminine energy is weak, then you'll get upset at anyone who says that. But they're mixing energy traits and other characteristics which aren't apart of it. Feminine energies are 'soft and 'allowing', and there's an immense strength in that, not weakness. It's not that masculine is strong and feminine is weak. Masculine has the yang quality of strength, feminine is more yin. Not really related to gender in general, but tend to be displayed in those genders as a generality (haha a fun sentence to say...).

    Generalities are just ways of expressing things as a statistical likelihood. Not a universal statement of 'all women are ___ and therefore that's bad' etc.

    Only when judgements (right/wrong) come into it will there be upsets..

    AngryHobbit, you are awesome. And no, I'm not saying it because you are apparently somehow believing that being more masculine is better than being feminine. But because you're embracing what you already are, and aren't ashamed of that. Shaming people for that is horrendous. I tip my hat massively.
     
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  9. Tez3

    Tez3 Sr. Grandmaster

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    I'm thinking you haven't understood what she's been writing, she was quite clear in her condemnation of women who she thinks all keep silent with their partners. It has nothing to do with characteristics, she was saying that because she was brought up with men she doesn't act how she thinks females act ie send people to Coventry' don't speak out and tell their partners what's wrong etc. One vital lesson to learn in life is that what happens between happily married couples is something only they understand, never poke your nose in.


    Well not so much really, you have read this somewhere but it doesn't make it correct. 'soft' and 'allowing' doesn't describe any women I know quite frankly and yes I know a lot of women as well as men.

    However you are missing the point of what was being said.
     
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  10. _Simon_

    _Simon_ Brown Belt

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    Yeah... there's been a lot of misunderstanding I think...

    Seems she was expressing her not being a fan of silent treatment. Was she really saying (and therefore.... condemning) every single woman on the earth does this? Or just expressing how she's not a fan of it?

    Never poke your nose in? To how people interact and view things?


    .....


    Anyways I won't speak for others, I can only say what it seems to me they were saying.

    Yeah you're making an assumption there that it's just something I've 'read'. It's a pretty experiential day-to-day observation, and it's dealt with a little bit in spiritual work in terms of identifying what's operating within you. Again, I'm not describing women. But the feminine energy characteristics, which tends to ('tends to' being the key word) be more prominent in females. No. This is not a judgement.


    Well the point of what was said seems to be that women are being stereotyped and berated, and that this apparent viewpoint is being perpetuated. I'm just not seeing that here.. so either I'm blind, or one is seeing what they want to see. Or both! Fun times ;)
     
  11. hoshin1600

    hoshin1600 Senior Master

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    as Charlie Brown would say....oh good grief.:facepalm:
     
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  12. gpseymour

    gpseymour Sr. Grandmaster

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    Like a billion hot dogs. (An Eddie Izzard reference, for those not familiar.)
     
  13. gpseymour

    gpseymour Sr. Grandmaster

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    Talking is definitely something we can do.
     
  14. gpseymour

    gpseymour Sr. Grandmaster

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    You do squeal like a girl.
     
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  15. gpseymour

    gpseymour Sr. Grandmaster

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    EDIT: Sort of a double-post.
     
  16. gpseymour

    gpseymour Sr. Grandmaster

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    If you read her first post that lead to this side-thread, she says she has an advantage in relating to men, because she relates more like a man (which men find easier to relate to). She doesn't say that's better than how some others relate - just that there's an advantage from it. She also points out the disadvantage that she sometimes has trouble relating with women. There's advantages and disadvantages to both generalized approaches.
     
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  17. JR 137

    JR 137 Senior Master

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    There’s really no point, Gerry. It’s the same thing any time a women’s issue is brought up. As I sit back and amuse myself with this thread’s contents, I see more and more similarities to a clown friend of ours who takes everything out of context and won’t **** up about it. Granted, she not on his level, but there’s definitely similarities when it comes to this topic.
     
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  18. JR 137

    JR 137 Senior Master

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    WOW! How does s h u t up (without spaces in shut) get edited?

    Never mind. autocorrect changed shut into sh!t. I’m going to have fun with that one while texting. Hopefully my mother won’t get mad at me.
     
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  19. JR 137

    JR 137 Senior Master

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    Pointless post
     
  20. gpseymour

    gpseymour Sr. Grandmaster

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    I'm kind of hoping that's a comment on about 25% of what I post here. :D
     
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