Traditional Shaolin White Crane Gongfu Training (Indiana)

[BillK]

Ok, then I invite you to enlighten us.

I get it: you want to train in something specific but there are no instructors nearby. Life ain't fair.

But if you care to justify your position (not that you need to, you can do what you want with your life and don't need to justify anything to us), I'm all ears. Or eyes, I guess.

Here's the thing. There are a lot of highly experienced folks here who have been around the block a few times. You came here for the first time last Sunday and put forth a notion of training in this way, and we see serious problems with your proposal. Instead of looking the other way, we gave you honest advice. Don't waste your money and, more importantly, your time in a misguided effort. You could spend years doing this and then discover that you have learned a tiny fraction of what you thought you learned, and all of it done incorrectly, with bad habits that are difficult to undo if you ever get to work with a good instructor. What a shame.

We are actually trying to help you avoid that mistake. There are other options that are much better. That is honest good advice.

Take it or leave it, but don't get upset just because our advice and our reaction is not what you had hoped for.

Further dialog is welcome.

The "assumption" mentioned in my post is referring to how he seems to thinm my money "has been wasted" althougg no videos are purchased...yet. The "boo hoo" comment was the "asinine" part with it's juvenile forethought. If that's the result of being "around the block", then I'd rather stay away from that particular block. Oh, this isn't my first rodeo. And, if I wanted advise on this matter, then my OP would have asked for it, which it did not. So, all the othee comments have been rather moot.

 

[Flying Crane]

The "assumption" mentioned in my post is referring to how he seems to thinm my money "has been wasted" althougg no videos are purchased...yet. The "boo hoo" comment was the "asinine" part with it's juvenile forethought. If that's the result of being "around the block", then I'd rather stay away from that particular block. Oh, this isn't my first rodeo. And, if I wanted advise on this matter, then my OP would have asked for it, which it did not. So, all the othee comments have been rather moot.

Then feel free to waste your time as you see fit.

 

[MAfreak]

not sure if he is doing it right, but its the same base for the straight handstrike.

but i get the point. there are many figures like in "sport-wushu", not meant for fighting, so i for myself wouldn't like to learn it without instructor, because it seems partially complicated.

 

[Flying Crane]

not sure if he is doing it right, but its the same base for the straight handstrike.

but i get the point. there are many figures like in "sport-wushu", not meant for fighting, so i for myself wouldn't like to learn it without instructor, because it seems partially complicated.

Yeah and this is not sport wushu by a long shot. And the still shot photo isn't really it, it's the complete movement that shows the method. Anybody can find a moment in time still photo that resembles something else but the actual method is very different. It's a training mechanism that helps you understand and develop full-body connection and rotation. And delivery of the punch in a real fight can be different from this training mechanism. There are a lot of details from the feet on up. If you don't understand those details and don't have someone helping you get it right, then you are simply throwing you hand backwards when punching forward. And that would be useless and potentially damaging to your shoulders depending on how much wrong you are.

So let's pretend you learn this method of basics with the intention of taking it and crossing over to the southern crane method. Or to hapkido or to shotokan or to krav maga or boxing or Muay Thai or whatever or vice-versa. These are very different methods and they don't blend.

 

[mograph]

And the still shot photo isn't really it, it's the complete movement that shows the method.

This might be the relevant video:

 

[Flying Crane]

This might be the relevant video:

Yup. I feel it's poorly done, very little or no connection.

 

[MAfreak]

what i meant is the stance while straight punching. the other arm backwards instead of protecting as much of the upper body as possible, is anyway a bad idea in a fight. i think the whole movement/form is kind of gymnastics? in the book "kung fu elements" by shou-yu-liang and wen-ching wu they describe kung fu/wushu as split in two parts; the artistic style and sanshou for fighting.

 

[mograph]

in the book "kung fu elements" by shou-yu-liang and wen-ching wu they describe kung fu/wushu as split in two parts; the artistic style and sanshou for fighting.

The authors did split wushu into taolu and sanshou (p.139), but where did they make the split you describe?

 

[MAfreak]

must be somewere in the intro.

 

[Flying Crane]

what i meant is the stance while straight punching. the other arm backwards instead of protecting as much of the upper body as possible, is anyway a bad idea in a fight. i think the whole movement/form is kind of gymnastics? in the book "kung fu elements" by shou-yu-liang and wen-ching wu they describe kung fu/wushu as split in two parts; the artistic style and sanshou for fighting.

Yup, this is not wushu, but it illustrate my point:you can't understand this over a video medium.

 

[Flying Crane]

what i meant is the stance while straight punching. the other arm backwards instead of protecting as much of the upper body as possible, is anyway a bad idea in a fight. i think the whole movement/form is kind of gymnastics? in the book "kung fu elements" by shou-yu-liang and wen-ching wu they describe kung fu/wushu as split in two parts; the artistic style and sanshou for fighting.

I only had a moment with my previous response, I've got another moment to further my thoughts.

This form is not gymnastics, it is not modern performance wushu. It is a form that trains fighting principles and techniques. The arm back, as I described, is a training mechanism that helps you understand full body connection and rotation. I don't expect you to understand it thru the medium of video. Only face-to-face instruction will enable you to understand it. That is my whole point in this.

 

[Flying Crane]

I posted this in another thread, seems it's relevant here:

In the 1950s cultural revolution in China, traditional fighting methods were suppressed and outlawed and a new, modern approach was created by the government. This new approach was based on the old methods, but with one very important difference: it was not intended for fighting. Instead it was intended to be a national performance competition and sport method that was inspired by the old martial methods. This is where the flowery forms come into the picture, which were only intended as a floor routine and not as a tool for training real fighting methods. The application of the movements were ignored, and the movements themselves were altered in favor of aesthetics. They look pretty but the structure and technique was undermined so it is no longer a viable fighting method.

This is known as "Modern Wushu". These are what you see in the big tournaments with lots of fancy and flowery forms with leaps and jumps and acrobatics. Some of these people are outstanding athletes, but they do not train in a real fighting method.

The forms found in the older, traditional fighting methods are not flowery like this, as they are meant to be a functional training tool. Unfortunately many people do not understand the difference. Some sifu teach the modern wushu forms and let their students believe they are learning traditional fighting methods. That is a shame and possibly a fraud it done deliberately and knowingly. Some people just don't even know what it is that they have been taught, and believe it is one thing when in reality it is the other. Some people believe the modern forms are viable fighting methods, not knowing they were never even intended to be.

 

[MAfreak]

this is exaclty what i mean. its important to clarify the differences to everyone. otherwise they get dangerous false confidence (in case of a self-defense-situation). but its the same in many other martial arts, its in karate too.

 

[clfsean]

This form is not gymnastics, it is not modern performance wushu. It is a form that trains fighting principles and techniques. The arm back, as I described, is a training mechanism that helps you understand full body connection and rotation. I don't expect you to understand it thru the medium of video. Only face-to-face instruction will enable you to understand it. That is my whole point in this.

This. End of story.

 

[gaoshou]

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