The Blue Gi

[Patrick Skerry]

Is the blue gi necessary for judo? Will it hurt the art? And should judo practitioners be forced to wear it for competition? I'm totally against the blue gi myself and have already refused to wear it.

 

[Hollywood1340]

What does color matter? Have you looked into the history of WHY it's worn in competition? And how would it hurt the art, as outside of of the competition ring there is not need for it to be worn. The question is not what the players wearing but how the player plays.

 

[Patrick Skerry]

What does color matter? Have you looked into the history of WHY it's worn in competition? And how would it hurt the art, as outside of of the competition ring there is not need for it to be worn. The question is not what the players wearing but how the player plays.

"What does color matter?" Is that why football players don't wear pink uniforms?

"Have you looked into the history of WHY it's worn in competition?" Yes, I have - it was approved in 1997 by the International Judo Federation, then later by the International Olympic Committee (without the permission of any practicing judoka). It wasn't accepted by the World Championships until a few years later.

The blue gi is totally 'not' accepted by either the Kodokan or the All Japan Judo Federation! Which is why that stupid blue costume is not worn when competing in the Kodokan or the AJJC!

The blue gi was adopted to make the lazy referee's job easier calling points during matches; and to sportify judo to attract more ticket buying spectators - both unnecessary reasons for the baby blue gi!

How does it hurt the art? It hurts the art of judo for the reasons it was adopted in the first place, not to improve Dr. Kano's vision of maximum efficiency with minimum effort, but to quantify Judo in the western tradition of instant gratification and visual appeal, i.e. quantity not quality. The blue gi and the inane thinking behind its adoption will only serve to further alienate the practitioners of judo, and turn judo into something else - something 'not-judo'.

The blue gi is simply a horrendous abomination!

 

[Hollywood1340]

Well it's good to see one so passionate about what he does. As for the rest...well to each their own. I wear blue with pride. It's all about picking your battles.

 

[Patrick Skerry]

Well it's good to see one so passionate about what he does. As for the rest...well to each their own. I wear blue with pride. It's all about picking your battles.

So how do you feel towards a fellow judo enthusiast who would refuse to wear a blue gi, and was persecuted for it? Would you go to his aid at a major tournament, say the Nationals? Would you support an organized boycott of the blue gi?

Also, how would you feel if you visited a traditional judo dojo and they asked you not to wear a blue gi? Or if you were invited to a non-sanctioned judo shiai that didn't allow blue gi's, would you attend?

I think this is the direction judo is heading.

 

[Hollywood1340]

Well it's not me. If you refuse to wear blue, you can't compete in some tourneys. I guess it depends on what it's worth to you. Again I say it's only for competition. Not for the dojo, testing, what have you. I mean I find it to be a rather minor thing. Judo is what you make it. It seem refusing to do something set down by a higher up is extremly disrespectful, as in some cases it's not what YOU want. But I am enjoying this. Judo world needs people like you
http://www.bstkd.com/JudoHistory/HistoryOne.htm

 

[Patrick Skerry]

Well it's not me. If you refuse to wear blue, you can't compete in some tourneys. I guess it depends on what it's worth to you. Again I say it's only for competition. Not for the dojo, testing, what have you. I mean I find it to be a rather minor thing. Judo is what you make it. It seem refusing to do something set down by a higher up is extremly disrespectful, as in some cases it's not what YOU want. But I am enjoying this. Judo world needs people like you
http://www.bstkd.com/JudoHistory/HistoryOne.htm

Refusing to do something set down by a higher up is how this country was founded.

Pouring lemonade on me then telling me its raining by a higher up is also very disrespectful.

And accepting change without critical assessment is fatalistic and undemocratic.

I told a sensei at a prospective judo club I wanted to join that I have no intention of wearing a blue gi, and I received a long hard stare in return. But judo is not the military and I don't have to wear a blue gi. If I am forced, I will get a lawyer and sue for discrimination - it might set a precedent.

What if the National Football League approved pink tutu's as a required uniform, and a professional football player refused to wear it - would he be wrong? I feel the blue gi is equally ridiculous as a pink tutu.

An organization harboring similar views is the KANO SOCIETY, at:
http://www.kanosociety.org so I am not totally alone in my opinion.

Thanks.

 

[bignick]

also...from what i understand..the color blue was adopted because it looked the best on tv...this is from my instructor, so excuse my ignorance if i'm incorrect...

my instructor has this philosophy concerning gi's in class....you can wear any color you want as long as it's white

but even without the blue gi they still have ways to distinguish between the contestsants...i.e. the Red vs White tournament....

i really don't have a problem wearing a blue gi in competition...i don't own a blue gi and i've never worn one...but i don't see what the problem is

 

[bignick]

also...we have to realize that when we practice judo we are borrowing and learning from another culture...and it is a great benefit to live in a world where oppurtunites as such present themselves...and you say that the blue gi is a westernization of judo...to help quantify the participants and impose western rules about the sport...well...what's so wrong about the east borrowing a little from the west...

don't assume that one group has it totally right...it is my understanding that the kata guruma was added to judo after kano had seen some western wrestling...

 

[Patrick Skerry]

also...from what i understand..the color blue was adopted because it looked the best on tv...this is from my instructor, so excuse my ignorance if i'm incorrect...

my instructor has this philosophy concerning gi's in class....you can wear any color you want as long as it's white

but even without the blue gi they still have ways to distinguish between the contestsants...i.e. the Red vs White tournament....

i really don't have a problem wearing a blue gi in competition...i don't own a blue gi and i've never worn one...but i don't see what the problem is

Again, the problem with the blue gi is the attitude behind its adoption. Prior to the adoption of the blue costume in 1997, a red sash was used to distinguish the two players, that was all that was needed. Good shimpans (referees) did the rest. The Red & White tournaments held in the Kodokan had nothing to do with distinguishing one competitor from another.

Also, as a side note, it is inconsiderate to impose the expense of a second gi on competitors. If you want me to have a blue gi, then you can pay for it - they're much more expensive than white gi's.

 

[bignick]

so why did they use a red sash then?

surely a good referee wouldn't need such an artificial way to tell the competitiors apart

 

[Patrick Skerry]

so why did they use a red sash then?

surely a good referee wouldn't need such an artificial way to tell the competitiors apart

A simple red sash is all that should be needed to distinguish two judoka tangled up in newaza, any thing else would be ostentatious, especially the garish blue suit.

So a simple red sash is all that a good referee should need to distinguish two judo players.

The blue gi with shoulder markings and other trappings is just the western attempt to quantify judo and prevent litigation from bad calls made by lazy referees.

The baby blue gi is way overkill in order to tell the difference between two judo players.

 

[bignick]

let me start by saying that the football player's not wearing a pink tutu is a bad example....

dancer's wear that type of dress because the need something that comfortable and doesn't inhibit their range of movement...

football player's wear what they wear because they need something that will hold all of their protective equipement in place...as for them not wearing pink uniforms...well...that stems from the western conciousness considering it to be a color associated with the female gender...

Surely you arent' objecting to wearing a blue gi because it's "girly"...

A blue gi is just that...a gi dyed blue...same material...it serves the same purpose as a white gi...

i think you're going a little overboard in calling it "simply a horrendous abomination!"

i think there a lot more problems that face modern judo than the way we distinguish between competitors during a shiai

 

[Hollywood1340]

Refusing to do something set down by a higher up is how this country was founded.

Pouring lemonade on me then telling me its raining by a higher up is also very disrespectful.

And accepting change without critical assessment is fatalistic and undemocratic.

I told a sensei at a prospective judo club I wanted to join that I have no intention of wearing a blue gi, and I received a long hard stare in return. But judo is not the military and I don't have to wear a blue gi. If I am forced, I will get a lawyer and sue for discrimination - it might set a precedent.

What if the National Football League approved pink tutu's as a required uniform, and a professional football player refused to wear it - would he be wrong? I feel the blue gi is equally ridiculous as a pink tutu.

An organization harboring similar views is the KANO SOCIETY, at:
http://www.kanosociety.org so I am not totally alone in my opinion.

Thanks.

Okay, I'm going to cease responding and I'll tell you why. For starters, if I'm getting what your saying right, you'd take legal action becasue you can't wear a uniform you want to wear? Lets take it another step. The uniform you don't want to wear is in your eyes a wesertnfication of the great art of judo? As I undertand it, you wear what sensei says wear, be it pink or blue, or polka dotted. That is your place as a student. Do you think you could step on any mat of a reputable gym and refuse to wear a uniform and expect to train? That is not a right dude, that is a privilage, one which in reading your posts its obvious you have not earned. You fail to see judo as it is, action and motion. It's not the uniform. If that is your biggest hang up you got a lot coming to you in the wide world of Judo. Better yet, go join Zen Judo, as they train as Kano meant judo to be trained. And for the rest, prove it on the mat. You'd make a good Uke I think.

 

[bignick]

strangely enough...this is the first time i've heard somebody on the forum mention zen judo...

which is what i train in...i didn't think anybody else had heard of it

 

[Hollywood1340]

Bignick,
I have my own issues with Zen Judo, which has no bearing on this issue. But in the end for me it comes down to a few things regardless of style
1. Do you train hard?
2. Do you train with heart?
3. Do you test your skills?
4. Can you learn?
5. Can you teach?

 

[Patrick Skerry]

Okay, I'm going to cease responding and I'll tell you why. For starters, if I'm getting what your saying right, you'd take legal action becasue you can't wear a uniform you want to wear? Lets take it another step. The uniform you don't want to wear is in your eyes a wesertnfication of the great art of judo? As I undertand it, you wear what sensei says wear, be it pink or blue, or polka dotted. That is your place as a student. Do you think you could step on any mat of a reputable gym and refuse to wear a uniform and expect to train? That is not a right dude, that is a privilage, one which in reading your posts its obvious you have not earned. You fail to see judo as it is, action and motion. It's not the uniform. If that is your biggest hang up you got a lot coming to you in the wide world of Judo. Better yet, go join Zen Judo, as they train as Kano meant judo to be trained. And for the rest, prove it on the mat. You'd make a good Uke I think.

Hi James,

As I wrote earlier, its not just the blue gi, although that is a factor, but it is the attitude that adopted the baby blue costume in the first place that is the real threat to judo; the twisting and mangling of a martial art into a western sport whose only goal is to win medals and provide entertainment to ticket buying spectators. Dr. Kano warned against this several times. He distinguished the difference between jodan judo (as practiced in Japan) and godan judo (as practice in the sleazy Olympics).

Am I threatening legal action? You bet your baby blue gi! Especially since this is the age of litigation, if I am prevented from competing because I am an orthodox judoka and won't wear a blue gi, that is simply discrimination on part of the IJF, especially since the IJF did not seek out in 1997 any practicing judoka's vote or permission or opinion about an offensive color change!

If I go to a gym and refuse to wear their bunny suit, that is not a problem since I have the option of simply going to another gym and wear my own preferred suit. Yet in judo, that option has been removed, the IJF demands you wear their freaky blue costume in a public place and you must pay for it to boot. I'm sure a civil liberties union lawyer can smell money in that lawsuit.

And as far as Zen judo goes, Dr. Kano never heard of it. I believe Zen judo advocates no competition at all, and Dr. Kano indicated how important tournament was to character development and technique testing, his ratio was: Randori 80%; kata 17%; and shiai 3% of the judo repetoire - not 99% competition and no kata like some stupid Western sport.

Please visit the excellent site: http://www.judoinfo.com for some needed research on judo theory and Dr. Kano's view towards judo. Then visit the Kano Society at: http://www.kanosociety.org to understand that I am not alone in my opinon on sport judo.

 

[bignick]

i'm not saying zen judo is the answer to all questions...was just saying that's the style i train in...

it's not a matter of advocating no competition...it's a matter of that's not our goal...my instructor has competed and won on the national level in both shiai and kata...

kano never heard of zen judo because he was dead by the time it was founded...

you keep referring to high judo as it's practiced in japan and referencing the sleazy olympics...well...last i checked...japan competes in those sleazy olympics...how high does that make their judo

i think you have an over romanticized view of japan and the judo practised there...

 

[bignick]

another question if the IJF and other organizations are so corrupt and horrible why do you keep wanting to enter into their tournaments...it's not discrimination because you don't want to follow their rules on uniforms and competitions...you're gonna have a heck of time convincing a judge that you were discriminated against because you didn't want to wear a blue gi...it'd be different if there were racial, sexual, ethical overtones here...but there aren't...your sole argument for lawsuit is that "i don't like blue gi's" not the strongest grounds for litigation

 

[Patrick Skerry]

i'm not saying zen judo is the answer to all questions...was just saying that's the style i train in...

it's not a matter of advocating no competition...it's a matter of that's not our goal...my instructor has competed and won on the national level in both shiai and kata...

kano never heard of zen judo because he was dead by the time it was founded...

you keep referring to high judo as it's practiced in japan and referencing the sleazy olympics...well...last i checked...japan competes in those sleazy olympics...how high does that make their judo

i think you have an over romanticized view of japan and the judo practised there...

I still feel that the Olympics (not necessarily the athletes) are sleazy, and even though both the Kodokan and the All Japan Judo Association are dead set against the blue gi, they fear being internationally isolated again, so, in a demonstration of REAL POLITIK, Japan competes in the Olympics, but are loathe to do so.

I realized that Zen judo was developed after the death of Dr. Kano, and that competition is de-emphasized, but that is a mistake. Competition is very necessary for both character development and technique testing, as clearly specified by Dr. Kano. Any tinkering with the genius Dr. Kano's creation is simply not judo - the ratio of 80%:17%:3% formulated by the founding genius is perfectly adequate.

Also, out of curiosity, who is your instructor? I might have read about him.