Tatoos

[ralphmcpherson]

I always said I would get one when I got my black belt and my wife (an artist) is currently designing me one. It will incorporate the tenant "indomitable spirit" into the tattoo but in a way that its not obvious unless you really look closely, it may even be in korean.

 

[chrispillertkd]

I realize we are westerners for the most part, but it's true enough that the mainstream segments of many Asian cultures look down on tattoos and the people who get them. I know my parents did.

This article seems to suggest the same idea.

http://www.globalpost.com/dispatch/south-korea/090717/tattoos-underground

SEOUL — Wandering Seoul's streets in hopes of finding a tattoo parlor, even in the hippest neighborhood known to shelter hundreds of tattoo artists, is mostly a waste of time. You need to know the “proper” steps: first you run a search on the web, then you hook up with a tattooist who will guide you to a nondescript space, and finally you sit down for the illegal procedure.


Sitting in an underground tattoo parlor with his arms folded across his chest, 37-year-old tattooist Kang Un explains why things are so. There are no laws specifically about tattooing in South Korea, but medical laws state that only doctors can practice the act of penetrating someone’s skin with a needle.


In other words, to be a tattooist in Korea, you must hold a doctor’s license.


Tattoos have long been considered in the country a mark of violence, membership to a gang, or at the least, defiance of mainstream culture. There wasn’t much demand for a long time and getting a tattoo at an illegal parlor somehow suited the rebellious nature of it.


However, in recent years, many South Koreans have started to embrace tattoos as a work of art and a fashion statement. Tattooists are starting to call for regulation and legalization of the industry, but for now, most parlors remain illegal.

Interesting article. I have heard there is similar view towards tatoos in Japan, at least with older people. They see them as being associated with riff raff and, not surprisingly perhaps, the yakuza.

Pax,

Chris

 

[Fiendlover]

Seriously? LOL Saying things like that shows how low class you are and how little respect you hold for your fellow human beings. Tattoos have a rich history that I am sure they didn't teach in your bible school. Buzz off.

I agree. Tattoos go way back and I think that tattoos are an expression of oneself. I have a sagittarius arrow tattoo on the inside of my right ankle and I plan on getting more. I find that there is nothing wrong with someone who wants to decorate there body permantly with self-expressing art.

 

[Ironcrane]

I'm somewhat surprised that no one has mentioned that tattoos were apart of various Warrior cultures around the world, and not just something exclusive to thugs, and organized crime.
On, and off, I've though about getting a tattoo of a scorpion because I'm a Scorpio. A very proud Scorpio. I've even tried a few times to put together a scorpion style to go along with the rest of the animal styles I practiced, but was never successful.

 

[granfire]

I'm somewhat surprised that no one has mentioned that tattoos were apart of various Warrior cultures around the world, and not just something exclusive to thugs, and organized crime.
On, and off, I've though about getting a tattoo of a scorpion because I'm a Scorpio. A very proud Scorpio. I've even tried a few times to put together a scorpion style to go along with the rest of the animal styles I practiced, but was never successful.

Hmm, much of the warrior culture does include elements of thugs:

Just visited a small town in Bavaria on the Ammersee. A mural on one of the houses memorialized the stop-over of some knight in 1000 something with 60.000 men (not sure if that was all warriors or also support and supply) on the way to the holy land, but a thousand years ago that village must have been even smaller and after the troops left I bet there wasn't a blade of grass left for the farmers...

The rules of chivalry, the code of the warrior, all lofty ideas, but the reality looked different way too many times

As to tattoos:
They are, if not forever, pretty much for the duration. Way too many people get one and then they have to spend even more time and more money to have them removed.
I had contemplated getting one about 3 years ago, had the design picked out and felt realy strong about it, but then I keep seeing old lumpy people, imagening how nasty a tattoo looks on some old wrinkled butt (not the chosen location btw)

I have seen too many old carny people to fing the idea invigorating....

Another thought: getting tattoos is still an act of non conforming, but due to the rising numbers of good middle class people getting one, how boring they soon will be.

 

[Jade Tigress]

Who of you have a martial art tatoo? I want one but don't know in what part of my body, maybe a dragon or maybe a tiger, something nice and discret.
Something you can talk about it here?

Manny

I have a tiger and a dragon. LOL!

I have a phoenix on my back.

I've been wanting a phoenix tattoo as well. If I ever get another one, that's what it will be.

Dragons and tigers are nice looking but sooooo predictable for a martial artist.

How about something that has a deep personal meaning for you? It would be a good ice breaker to explain your ink to somebody where the meaning isn't obvious.

I never got a tattoo, but if I did I would probably get a butterfly or dragonfly, because they symbolize rebirth; or the chapter and verse of my one of my favorite scriptures.

Dragons and tigers may be predictable for martial artists but that's not why I chose mine. Both have significant personal meaning to me.

First, I have always loved tigers. Then I learned what they symbolize in Chinese culture. Courage, strength, power. I was going through a difficult period in my life and needed the reminder to stay strong. That was my first tattoo. It's on my back.

The eastern dragon, (both my tattoos are asian style) represents wisdom, benevolence, etc. The color red (the color of my dragon tat) is for luck. And I was born in the year of the dragon. The dragon is on my arm.

Because both of my tattoos have significant personal meaning to me, I will never regret them. My designs are original, done freehand directly on my body, no stencil, no flash. No one else will have a tattoo that is exactly like mine.

IF I get another one, it will be the phoenix. Symbolizing death and rebirth. Also something that has meaning to my life circumstances and bring encouragement to me.

I think the most important thing when deciding to get, and choosing a tattoo design, is to make sure it has meaning to you. Do not get a tattoo just to get a tattoo. I would avoid flash, you don't want a bunch of other people walking around with the exact same tat as you. Make sure you find a good artist. Schedule a consult, look at his or her work, talk about your design. If you're happy with the artist, then schedule the appointment. Don't just walk in off the street into any studio and get it done without some research. You'll have to live with a crappy looking tat the rest of your life.

Anyway, good luck. Keep us posted.

 

[Balrog]

Seriously? LOL Saying things like that shows how low class you are and how little respect you hold for your fellow human beings. Tattoos have a rich history that I am sure they didn't teach in your bible school. Buzz off.

Actually....

I worked for a while in a psychiatric clinic. One day at lunch, I was sitting at a table with some of the docs and they got to talking about tattoos and the history and psychology of them.

In a nutshell, tattoos are all about low self-esteem. You don't like yourself and the way you look, so you get a tattoo thinking that will improve you. It doesn't, and it's a vicious cycle - now you're stuck with a body disfigurement that announces to the world that you have psychological issues and the original problem didn't go away.

It's been that way throughout history. Whether the tattoo was done for magical, shamanistic reasons or for social aesthetic reasons, the underlying psychology of the tattoo is the same: bad self-image.

 

[terrylamar]

Seriously? LOL Saying things like that shows how low class you are and how little respect you hold for your fellow human beings. Tattoos have a rich history that I am sure they didn't teach in your bible school. Buzz off.

You are right, I don't remember being taught about tatoos in Bible School. I don't think God has anything to say about tatoos at all. I'm not sure if you are the pot or the kettle as far as "respect you hold for your fellow human beings," seeing how 70% plus are Christians and you just diss'ed us all.

I have no desire to be associated with street trash, junkies, biker gangs, porn stars and little rich kids that want to be cool. I have much too much respect for my body to do so.

Having said that, I really don't care what you do with your own body. It is going to affect my life at all, besides interject a little humor.

Why is it that you think you get to have an opinion and I don't.

I'll "buzz off" now.

 

[risingfire]

You are right, I don't remember being taught about tatoos in Bible School. I don't think God has anything to say about tatoos at all. I'm not sure if you are the pot or the kettle as far as "respect you hold for your fellow human beings," seeing how 70% plus are Christians and you just diss'ed us all.

I have no desire to be associated with street trash, junkies, biker gangs, porn stars and little rich kids that want to be cool. I have much too much respect for my body to do so.

Having said that, I really don't care what you do with your own body. It is going to affect my life at all, besides interject a little humor.

Why is it that you think you get to have an opinion and I don't.

I'll "buzz off" now.

Thanks, I don't care if you are a Christian or a Buddhist, generally it’s the christen religion that looks down upon tattoos...drew my correlation there. This is not about God...if there even is one. Just because I may not respect your belief in God, I respect you are a human, and will not call you trash based upon a single act. Guilt by association huh? How very Christian of you. So open minded...and people wonder why we are a nation and world divided. Of course you are entitled to your opinion! But I am entitled to disagree and defend myself when you call me trash! Wel,l I guess I am going to go off the set now, money shot is done, get on my bike with the gang, stop off and meet up with friends, shoot up, and then head off to party with the rich kids. I will say this though; I got a phoenix on my back because I viewed it as beautiful and a symbol of the hardest times in my life. Watching three loved ones die of cancer before I turned 20, then having a horrible deep depression that resulted in having to receive 22 ECT treatments...all before I was 25. I had my surgery, lost over 200 LBS, became much happier and overcame depression and everyone’s expectations, finished my B.S. and MBA, and joined the art again. If I am "trash" for wanting to look at a symbol of my success in the mirror every day then so be it. Peace out.

 

[dortiz]

Tatoos have been around along time and used in many ways originally. And Many of those ways had nothing to do with low self esteem...sheesh Balrog, being a little general in your stereotyping eh : )
Tribal arts used them as praise for bravery and in many groups as rituals to growing up.
Just guessing but like many rituals of older eras most modern societies pushed anything paganistic away and frowned on them.
In todays world tats almost have become fashion but to many martial artists that I know they are usually symbols of their journey or accomplishment.
Me personally, I have the hokey Dragon on my upper right arm from when I first started training. Later added the Tiger after crossing another milestone on my other arm. Now I have Hapkido in Hangul on my right forearm and the KHF logo with my Kyung Moo Kwan name below on my left forearm.
All are covered and are there just for me to enjoy. To me they are representative and milestone markers. They are badges I earned ; )
Everybody has different taste. If a poster says something about an aspect of TKD or HKD that I dont like I dont chime in say its stupid, I just dont post. Now if they ask about techniques or hobbies and even tattoos which I do, then I can contribute to their question.

 

[Drac]

Asking what kind of tattoo to get is similar to asking what kind of MA to study, it all your choice. Remember the decision to get a tattoo is not one to be taken lightly as it will be with until you shuffle of this mortal coil. Yes, tats can be removed, but according to a friend that had it done it hurts WORSE that getting the original, the darker the tat the less chance of success the technician will have totally removing it.

Then there is the whole aspect of who is going to do it. There are some inkslingers that have a very heavy hand, and it will cause more pain that necessary. I put in a year of research until I had mine done, I wound up going out-of-state for mine as the artist was considered one of the top 5 in the US at that time.

Then there is a cost. The stuff you see on the walls of most shop are called "Flash" and can be cheap depending on the size. Due to the size of the one I got it was about $ 120.00 an hour and it took 3 hrs. That was for a one color tattoo, colors cost more..My 2 cents...

 

[girlbug2]

I'm somewhat surprised that no one has mentioned that tattoos were apart of various Warrior cultures around the world, and not just something exclusive to thugs, and organized crime.
On, and off, I've though about getting a tattoo of a scorpion because I'm a Scorpio. A very proud Scorpio. I've even tried a few times to put together a scorpion style to go along with the rest of the animal styles I practiced, but was never successful.

You're male? It's unusual to find a guy who believes in Astrology.

 

[Drac]

If you are determined to have Chinese (hanzi), Japanese (kanji), Korean (hanja),or Vietnamese (hán tự), characters tattooed onto your skin make TRIPLE SURE that the message you wish to convey is correct. Master Steve tells a story of taking a newly arrived Japanese to a local karate school. Upon entering there was a shrine and after a looking at the kanji letters the Japanese man fell to the floor in a fit of laughter.. It seems the owner didnt research the characters..It read " Toys Sold Here"...

 

[granfire]

If you are determined to haveChinese (hanzi), Japanese (kanji),Korean (hanja),or Vietnamese (hán tự), characters tattooed onto your skin make TRIPLE SURE that the message you wish to convey is correct. Master Steve tells a story of taking a newly arrived Japanese to a local karate school. Upon entering there was a shrine and after a looking at the kanji letters the Japanese man fell to the floor in a fit of laughter.. It seems the owner didnt research the characters..It read " Toys Sold Here"...

LOL!!!

Beat an offering of eggrolls though (or Sushi)

 

[Balrog]

Tatoos have been around along time and used in many ways originally. And Many of those ways had nothing to do with low self esteem...sheesh Balrog, being a little general in your stereotyping eh : )

Not in the slightest. And remember, I was quoting a psychiatrist who had to deal with that issue on a daily basis.

 

[BloodMoney]

Tolerance to ignorance failing....must...hold...back...rant

the underlying psychology of the tattoo is the same: bad self-image.

Fail. There several entire races of people that would be quite offended by that.

Your clearly not from NZ mate. One or two local Maori (or from my culture, Samoans) might have something to say about that. You clearly dont know what Ta Moko is do you? Here let me help you.

If you cant be bothered reading it then heres a nice summary (my bold):

Since 1990 there has been a resurgence in the practice of moko for both men and women, as a sign of cultural identity and a reflection of the general revival of the language and culture. Not all moko applied today is done using a tattoo machine. Recently there has been a strong revival of the use of uhi (chisels). Women too have become more involved as practitioners, such as Christine Harvey of the Chathams, Henriata Nicholas in Rotorua and Julie Kipa in Whakatane. Te Uhi a Mataora was recently established by practitioners to discuss issues facing the art form, such as the practice by non-Māori, an issue which is increasingly of concern to Māori.

But of course if a psychologist said it then it must be right. If theres one thing Freud understood it was pacific warrior cultures on the other side of the world he never visited.

I have no desire to be associated with street trash, junkies, biker gangs, porn stars and little rich kids that want to be cool. I have much too much respect for my body to do so.

Once again, tell that to these guys:

I have many tattoos and I dont wish to be associated with street trash. I do wish to be associated with many other things I love, and with a warrior culture that pre-dates streets, heroin, pornography and motor bikes by just a tad.

I'll "buzz off" now.

Thank you.

Tattooing and body modification are an expression of oneself and have been for thousands of years. Then again African tribeswoman 5,000 years ago were probably just trying to fit in with the local "cool" crowd by stretching their lips

 

[granfire]

Tattooing and body modification are an expression of oneself and have been for thousands of years. Then again African tribeswoman 5,000 years ago were probably just trying to fit in with the local "cool" crowd by stretching their lips

Hmmm, from what I gathered, those body modifications were more designed to keep the slave hunters away.

And while I agree that a lot of the Psy-guys can't find their behind with both hands, the majority of 'us' are not of Polynesian descent, nor do we sport Maori blood.

To us the connection to body ink is much more recent and - via explorers no doubt - the tradition has been a bit watered down and tainted...


So yeah, there is that seedy underbelly of society to consider when you get yourself done up. Sometimes the ghosts in other people's heads are the hardest to combat.

 

[cali_tkdbruin]

Tattoos are a major portion of Polynesean culture and life, and are an accepted addition to the body. Just because one doesn't favor tattoos does that make it acceptable to disparage a group or groups of people only because they're different from you, or have different beliefs from you?

 

[granfire]

Tattoos are a major portion of Polynesean culture and life, and are an accepted addition to the body. Just because one doesn't favor tattoos does that make it acceptable to disparage a group or groups of people only because they're different from you, or have different beliefs from you?

Well, how about turning this argument around: Just because a small portion of the world population has a honorable tradition with Tattoos, does that diminish the connection with the seedy underbelly of society in the Western/Northern hemisphere?

I mean, yeah, there are the good middle class folks who walk on the wild side with a butterfly on the ankle, but sheesh, you can't deny the impact ink has on gang life style! And we are not talking about 'Mudder' on the biceps...

You got to take the different believes into account when you put yourself into the situation to be afiliated with the unpleasant side of life.

It does not mean you are a crook, it just means you have added another layer that needs to be peeled back in the inter human social aspects. You can't point towards your traditions and demand that another person throws his completely out the window: From were I am looking at it, Polynesians are few and far between where I am (even though we have a good amount of out of state traffic here, military installation), but the not so presentable peeps with body ink are much more visible.

Heck, i don't want to sit here and defend the dislike for ink. A lot of times I could not tell you what the person looked like because I was studiing the tattoo...but you got to give it to people, mileage varies in thing like that.

 

[Carol]

The Associated Press recently had an article, Parents deal with tattoo trend.

• 22 percent of women and 26 percent of men said they had tattoos in a 2004 survey published in the Journal of the American Academy of Dermatology.

• The numbers are higher among young adults: Tattoos were reported by 36 percent of 18- to 25-year-olds and 40 percent of 26- to 40-year-olds in a Pew Research Center survey from 2006.

• But among 41- to 65-year-olds — the demographic most likely to have teenage children — only 10 percent reported having tattoos.

I don't have any tattoos, but I don't believe for a moment that this many folks have tattoos because they have mental health issues or are otherwise from a scruffy side of society.